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Another baseball stadium, I've got my best man on it article...

TheGreenhouseEffect

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Aug 17, 2012
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Nice story by Smock, appears progress is being made behind the scenes. If WV Gov JJ really wanted to help Marshall move up, he could weigh in on this project rather than bash Hamrick and Holliday for not getting into the AAC, cause it will take a new baseball stadium to get into an AAC and at least a nice hotel. The Doubletree may solve/help the hotel issue.

http://www.wvgazettemail.com/sports...nues-quest-for-baseball-stadium-in-huntington
 
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There have been "rumors" that some renovations have already been done but I have not personally seen any nor is there any indication (sign) that the hotel will soon be a Doubletree.
 
When I booked a room for WKY the DT said they would start in June to renovate , floor by floor. If you see window dumpster vents being put into place then they are about to begin. I won't hold my breath.
 
Power Park is struggling. Attendance for the Power is way down (less than half what it was 10 years ago). Last week, the door was opened to moving the state high school baseball tournament to Morgantown starting next year, and then god forbid Marshall finally gets its own stadium, there goes that. Given the tendency of minor league baseball teams to relocate when hardship arrives, I could see 10 years from now, Charleston might have a $32 million state-of-the-art minor league grass farm and storage facility.

I just mention this because I've seen a lot of comments from Mayor Williams, Mike Hamrick, and hopeful Huntington residents about the potential economic impact of a baseball stadium. APP never panned out the way it was supposed to, and I just have a hard time believing a project with half the budget, with no minor league team associated with it, happening thirteen years further down the line of baseball's waning demise is going to have a different result.
 
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IMHO:

- It says a lot about the Gag-zette that the article has a popup to subscribe for news about "your Mountaineers". 100% anti-Marshall paper, always has been, always will be.

- The people that bought the hotel said they would renovate it, so I suppose they will. Whether they do so to Doubletree standards or some lesser brand remains a question.

- I think "some work" is done at ACF by a skeleton crew because if they ever shut it down totally, the EPA will make them clean it up. (This is the actual plant, I don't think there is anything wrong with the parking lot). Somebody sharp needs to know what we are buying, lest the state or city get stuck with the cleanup (something similar happened at Louisville, IIRC).

- Just getting ahold of the parking lot would be a good thing. Most colleges have control of most of their parking. MU only has the high donors' lot. It would be a good source of revenue.

- If I understand this, the mayor is talking about a "TIF" which is taking a vacant piece of land, building something useful on it, and then using the sales tax and increase in the property tax to pay for the construction. Looks good on paper, but the whole thing is predicated on Huntington actually needing whatever else they are going to build. Sounds like Pullman #2 to me. Can Huntington support more retail? More hotel space? More nightlife spots and restaurants seem more likely. I don't know. They should have commitments from the types of businesses they want in hand before acting. Remember the "superblock".

- The Power are dying. Jones is out as mayor in 18. The Power have a sweetheart deal with the city because his paramour is Mr. Baseball in Charleston. The next administration may want to spend its money elsewhere. In any event, minor league teams move around, looking for the next sweetheart deal.

- But more importantly, read the idiocy they were spewing when they were building that place. The old warehouse was going to be this great office complex, and the area across the street was going to be this nightlife distict. When they built the ballpark, it was a poor people's strip mall and then past that Charleston's only really bombed out section. And, except for ONE developent (a restaurant and yuppie appartments) it still is.

- Huntington is not Charleston. Huntington has Marshall. And Marshall already soaks up the live gate sports market pretty cleanly. I don't know if a minor league team can make it. Certainly not a full-season one. Maybe a rookie league team, which only plays from late June to Labor Day. I'm not a big fan of these "independent" teams.
 
Charleston always seems to have a team. whether the Charlies, the Wheelers, the Power, etc. I don't think we can rely on a Minor league team coming in; but look at it as a nice addition if it does happen. jmo.
 
Charleston always seems to have a team. whether the Charlies, the Wheelers, the Power, etc. I don't think we can rely on a Minor league team coming in; but look at it as a nice addition if it does happen. jmo.
They anticipate a short season team here if it happens at all.
 
FWIW, TIF districts CAN be a very successful development tool, as long as properly planned and the City has the right development partner. When looking at what Huntington is working to accomplish on implementing its master redevelopment plan, no reason it can't work for this; plus, it should be a catalyst for future redevelopment, as owners of older properties will feel the market pressure to renovate their projects. TIF's work very well here in Virginia (although our governing legislation is a little different from Huntington, and we have larger markets); and they have worked not-so-well in St Louis and many places in California. As long as part of a larger strategic plan, and with proximity to campus, a TIF should work well for this. Just my 2 cents
 
Nice story by Smock, appears progress is being made behind the scenes. If WV Gov JJ really wanted to help Marshall move up, he could weigh in on this project rather than bash Hamrick and Holliday for not getting into the AAC, cause it will take a new baseball stadium to get into an AAC and at least a nice hotel. The Doubletree may solve/help the hotel issue.

http://www.wvgazettemail.com/sports...nues-quest-for-baseball-stadium-in-huntington
Waggs is looking for a new job, and I think he would consider staying if there was a plan. Im not sure its fair to just trash the idea before it gives off the ground because Marshall and Huntington needs this bad. They also need to show improvement or growth in and around the campus. Honestly it saws leadership when things like this take place.
 
IMHO:

- It says a lot about the Gag-zette that the article has a popup to subscribe for news about "your Mountaineers". 100% anti-Marshall paper, always has been, always will be.

- The people that bought the hotel said they would renovate it, so I suppose they will. Whether they do so to Doubletree standards or some lesser brand remains a question.

- I think "some work" is done at ACF by a skeleton crew because if they ever shut it down totally, the EPA will make them clean it up. (This is the actual plant, I don't think there is anything wrong with the parking lot). Somebody sharp needs to know what we are buying, lest the state or city get stuck with the cleanup (something similar happened at Louisville, IIRC).

- Just getting ahold of the parking lot would be a good thing. Most colleges have control of most of their parking. MU only has the high donors' lot. It would be a good source of revenue.

- If I understand this, the mayor is talking about a "TIF" which is taking a vacant piece of land, building something useful on it, and then using the sales tax and increase in the property tax to pay for the construction. Looks good on paper, but the whole thing is predicated on Huntington actually needing whatever else they are going to build. Sounds like Pullman #2 to me. Can Huntington support more retail? More hotel space? More nightlife spots and restaurants seem more likely. I don't know. They should have commitments from the types of businesses they want in hand before acting. Remember the "superblock".

- The Power are dying. Jones is out as mayor in 18. The Power have a sweetheart deal with the city because his paramour is Mr. Baseball in Charleston. The next administration may want to spend its money elsewhere. In any event, minor league teams move around, looking for the next sweetheart deal.

- But more importantly, read the idiocy they were spewing when they were building that place. The old warehouse was going to be this great office complex, and the area across the street was going to be this nightlife distict. When they built the ballpark, it was a poor people's strip mall and then past that Charleston's only really bombed out section. And, except for ONE developent (a restaurant and yuppie appartments) it still is.

- Huntington is not Charleston. Huntington has Marshall. And Marshall already soaks up the live gate sports market pretty cleanly. I don't know if a minor league team can make it. Certainly not a full-season one. Maybe a rookie league team, which only plays from late June to Labor Day. I'm not a big fan of these "independent" teams.

Question also, SamC, is how much retail can Huntington, Cabell County, and Tri-State, with stagnant overall population, support at a successful level. Indications are that the Tanyard shopping/retail complex will be underway this year, perhaps by late summer. Retail center of the region will be even more around Barboursville, eastern Cabell County, and NOT downtown Huntington.

As for possible pro baseball entity, IF and when H-town gets a facility, parties looking for a franchise may look into the Appy Rookie League. Mercer County has TWO teams in that league located about 10 miles apart. If one of them decides to leave, or folds, maybe Huntington could be a new location. Neither is doing that well attendance wise. Would only be about 2 hours travel more from current cities if a team moved to Huntington. Appy league schedule runs from mid to late June to late August, which would be ideal; wouldn't be any meaningful conflicts with HERD baseball, IMO.
 
It says a lot about the Gag-zette that the article has a popup to subscribe for news about "your Mountaineers". 100% anti-Marshall paper, always has been, always will be.
Here's the truth - take it or leave it: Gazette-Mail sports department doesn't have a bias against Marshall. Mitch Vingle? Sure, I'll give you that - his ringtone is the Mountaineer fight song and he has all the objectivity of a junior high sports mom - but I promise you Sports Editor (and former Marshall beat writer) Derek Redd is very much a fan of Marshall University, its athletic department, and the folks who work inside it.

The reason you're seeing that ad isn't because they're out to get Marshall, its because they're out to get WVU....readers. An article about the Mountaineer tying his shoes together and tripping will get about five times as many clicks as a game report for Marshall football or basketball. I'm sorry, I've seen the web numbers and that's just the reality.

One thing you learn hanging out with those guys is that most of them don't care about the outcome of sporting events. When its all-encompassing, and it's your job, that takes a lot of the fun of being a fan out of the transaction.

I will say this though: there is one area where Marshall fan response dwarfs WVU (and anybody else) - reader complaints about bias. You wouldn't believe the emails and voicemails these guys get, where someone reads their own narrow bias/paranoia into something they've read, and flames you on your office phone or email with some big scribe about what a Mountie-loving POS you are.

Signed,
Absolutely Not Doug Smock
 
Question also, SamC, is how much retail can Huntington, Cabell County, and Tri-State, with stagnant overall population, support at a successful level. Indications are that the Tanyard shopping/retail complex will be underway this year, perhaps by late summer. Retail center of the region will be even more around Barboursville, eastern Cabell County, and NOT downtown Huntington.

As for possible pro baseball entity, IF and when H-town gets a facility, parties looking for a franchise may look into the Appy Rookie League. Mercer County has TWO teams in that league located about 10 miles apart. If one of them decides to leave, or folds, maybe Huntington could be a new location. Neither is doing that well attendance wise. Would only be about 2 hours travel more from current cities if a team moved to Huntington. Appy league schedule runs from mid to late June to late August, which would be ideal; wouldn't be any meaningful conflicts with HERD baseball, IMO.


Actually, downtown Huntington is doing quite nicely. Probably the biggest thing the city has going for it. It's busy every day of the week with something seemingly going on.
Retail and downtowns went out a long time ago. The retail market in general is floundering. Macy's, Sears, Nordstrom and others aren't doing well in the face of online shopping.

Huntingtons downtown is all about activities around Pullman, the River and eateries.
 
Here's the truth - take it or leave it: Gazette-Mail sports department doesn't have a bias against Marshall.

LOL. I'll leave it. We get pretty good coverage in fact I'd say better than what our own home grown Chuck L writes about Doc and Hammy, but don't tell me there isn't bias.

As for Huntington, it really does have great great great potential. I know Williams is trying, but as for building Hamrick is leaving him in the smoke.

The city needs to embrace buying, tearing down old homes and getting new homes for young families to come and urban homestead. Start with Ritter park and work outwards.
 
LOL. I'll leave it. We get pretty good coverage in fact I'd say better than what our own home grown Chuck L writes about Doc and Hammy, but don't tell me there isn't bias.

As for Huntington, it really does have great great great potential. I know Williams is trying, but as for building Hamrick is leaving him in the smoke.

The city needs to embrace buying, tearing down old homes and getting new homes for young families to come and urban homestead. Start with Ritter park and work outwards.
How is Hamrick leaving anyone in the smoke regarding building? This is the one thing our new Prez and Hamrick need to get moving on is showing progress and change.
 
LOL. I'll leave it. We get pretty good coverage in fact I'd say better than what our own home grown Chuck L writes about Doc and Hammy, but don't tell me there isn't bias.

As for Huntington, it really does have great great great potential. I know Williams is trying, but as for building Hamrick is leaving him in the smoke.

The city needs to embrace buying, tearing down old homes and getting new homes for young families to come and urban homestead. Start with Ritter park and work outwards.
Why wouldn't the largest state newspaper cater to WVU? If you ran a meat market, would you cater to vegans, or would you focus on meeting the needs of 95% of the population that prefers a rack of ribs?
 
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Down in Lexington at the NCAA softball regional, MH said that we have the money for a baseball stadium -- just looking for a site. He likes the property behind (toward the river) the women's field.
 
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Why wouldn't the largest state newspaper cater to WVU? If you ran a meat market, would you cater to vegans, or would you focus on meeting the needs of 95% of the population that prefers a rack of ribs?

Because unfortunately Greenhouse doesn't know the difference between market demand and bias. According to him most people are biased towards meat and have been holding down whatever vegans eat for decades.
 
IMHO,

- Tanyard Station. Exactly. "Brick and mortar" retail is hurting, worldwide. Certainly hurting yet more in this area. And, yes, Barboursville is the center of this region as far as retail goes. Why? Putnam County. WSAZ did a poll some years back of Putnam County. Putnam works in Charleston, reads the Charleston paper, listens to Charleston radio, uses the Charleston airport, and everything else. Except one thing. It shops at the Huntington Mall. Downtown Huntington is doing OK with quaint little shops, but there is only so much the market can handle.

- Gag-zette. Nope, sorry. Is WVU a bigger deal in the Charleston market? Sure. Is a Charleston paper going to cover WVU more? Sure. That is not bias. But the Gag-zette is biased. It is not that it has 4 WVU stories for every one MU story, it is that the MU story is written by people who WANT MU TO LOSE. The Gag-zette covering MU is like the Gag-zette covering a Republican primary. Not their team. It panders to the troll community we used to see on our "smack board". The people who cannot be happy unless MU loses. Further, it is well known that the owner of the Gag-zette opposes the EXISTANCE of MU (and the state colleges) as an institution, being an elitist limosine liberal, not wanting people like us to get an education and better ourselves. (WVU, far away and a de facto private school for New Jersites is not her concern.) It would be better is the Gag-zette simply IGNORED MU, certainly MU sports, totally.
 
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IMHO,

- Tanyard Station. Exactly. "Brick and mortar" retail is hurting, worldwide. Certainly hurting yet more in this area. And, yes, Barboursville is the center of this region as far as retail goes. Why? Putnam County. WSAZ did a poll some years back of Putnam County. Putnam works in Charleston, reads the Charleston paper, listens to Charleston radio, uses the Charleston airport, and everything else. Except one thing. It shops at the Huntington Mall. Downtown Huntington is doing OK with quaint little shops, but there is only so much the market can handle.

- Gag-zette. Nope, sorry. Is WVU a bigger deal in the Charleston market? Sure. Is a Charleston paper going to cover WVU more? Sure. That is not bias. But the Gag-zette is biased. It is not that it has 4 WVU stories for every one MU story, it is that the MU story is written by people who WANT MU TO LOSE. The Gag-zette covering MU is like the Gag-zette covering a Republican primary. Not their team. It panders to the troll community we used to see on our "smack board". The people who cannot be happy unless MU loses. Further, it is well known that the owner of the Gag-zette opposes the EXISTANCE of MU (and the state colleges) as an institution, being an elitist limosine liberal, not wanting people like us to get an education and better ourselves. (WVU, far away and a de facto private school for New Jersites is not her concern.) It would be better is the Gag-zette simply IGNORED MU, certainly MU sports, totally.
Believe me, Doug Smcok does NOT want to see wvu win in anything. He is a Marshall guy through and through
 
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It panders to the troll community we used to see on our "smack board". The people who cannot be happy unless MU loses.
You may be right, but if true, it's probably due to the holier than thou attitude presented daily by the likes of Greenhouse and yourself. Why isn't it simply easier to go through life, knowing Marshall will always be 2nd fiddle player within their own state? WVU is a major school, while Marshall is a mid major. That's the way it is, and that's the way it will always be. It doesn't mean you can't dream, but to continually call them out is somewhat disingenuous on your part. If you were a Florida Gator fan/alumnus, how would you feel about a Stetson fan bitching daily about your school?
 
You may be right, but if true, it's probably due to the holier than thou attitude presented daily by the likes of Greenhouse and yourself. Why isn't it simply easier to go through life, knowing Marshall will always be 2nd fiddle player within their own state? WVU is a major school, while Marshall is a mid major. That's the way it is, and that's the way it will always be. It doesn't mean you can't dream, but to continually call them out is somewhat disingenuous on your part. If you were a Florida Gator fan/alumnus, how would you feel about a Stetson fan bitching daily about your school?

Yeah, but UF and Stetson would be equals if the Orlando Sentinel wasn't always biased towards the Hatters and its' fans.
 
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You may be right, but if true, it's probably due to the holier than thou attitude presented daily by the likes of Greenhouse and yourself. Why isn't it simply easier to go through life, knowing Marshall will always be 2nd fiddle player within their own state? WVU is a major school, while Marshall is a mid major. That's the way it is, and that's the way it will always be. It doesn't mean you can't dream, but to continually call them out is somewhat disingenuous on your part. If you were a Florida Gator fan/alumnus, how would you feel about a Stetson fan bitching daily about your school?[/QUOTE
 
Again, Mitch Vingle? You're absolutely right. That guy hates Marshall, and is as bad at hiding his disdain as he is at writing about sports.

Doug Smock? No. Doug's dismal outlook on the totality of existence can sometimes come out in his writing and make you think he hates Marshall, but what he actually hates is waking up every morning in this meaningless life, trapped in the middle of a hopeless, empty void and careening toward a miserable, painful end.

But he probably gets at least modestly stoked when Marshall wins a game.
 
Again, Mitch Vingle? You're absolutely right. That guy hates Marshall, and is as bad at hiding his disdain as he is at writing about sports.

Doug Smock? No. Doug's dismal outlook on the totality of existence can sometimes come out in his writing and make you think he hates Marshall, but what he actually hates is waking up every morning in this meaningless life, trapped in the middle of a hopeless, empty void and careening toward a miserable, painful end.

But he probably gets at least modestly stoked when Marshall wins a game.
Obviously you have not spent time with Doug
 
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Are you saying he's a happy person or anti-Marshall?

I might say screw it and concede the latter point out of sheer exhaustion, but I will never yield on the former.
 
I've known Doug since grade school. He grew up about 3-4 miles from Marshall and is a lifelong fan, graduated from Marshall and bleeds green. I'm sure he tries to be as unbiased as possible in the way he reports Marshall, and no 2 people would do it exactly the same way... but he doesn't hold grudges like Landon and he doesn't see through green glasses like Woody. I appreciate that. (and yes, I'm sure it is challenging working for a struggling newspaper that won't even send you to a drivable basketball tournament that Marshall makes the finals in.)
 
I've known Doug since grade school. He grew up about 3-4 miles from Marshall and is a lifelong fan, graduated from Marshall and bleeds green. I'm sure he tries to be as unbiased as possible in the way he reports Marshall, and no 2 people would do it exactly the same way... but he doesn't hold grudges like Landon and he doesn't see through green glasses like Woody. I appreciate that. (and yes, I'm sure it is challenging working for a struggling newspaper that won't even send you to a drivable basketball tournament that Marshall makes the finals in.)

Agree with your assessment on Smock. More objective than any of his fellow Gazette Columnists/beat writers ever thought of being. Reminds me of another Herd alum who wrote for the Gazette who was also very professional: the late Mike Cherry.

Hard to agree with the "struggling" newspaper bit especially when the Gazette keeps 2 columnists, and then some, spewing out WVU related articles virtually full time. Mitchie Dingleberry is suppose to be a "generalist" columnist but about 95 per cent of the time he writes about the Neers: current Neers, past Neers, future Neers, irrelevant Neers, etc. His columns definitely reflect his very serious "man crush" on Huggy Bear, and he seems to be rapidly warming up to Hungoveragain also!!

Then there is columnist Cassssa who is permanently stationed in Morganhole; no doubt in one of the school's locker rooms, where he can on a FULL TIME basis keep his ears, eyes, nose, mouth, etc,, pressed firmly to the ground. Thus, he can not miss any talk, utterance, speech, burp, fart, etc., ever coming from the EER coaches and Athletic Director!

Finally, there is sports editor Redd who by far seems to be the most objective soul of the bunch. However, when he does infrequently pen a column in the Gazette sports section it, too, about 20 to 30 per cent of the time no doubt is Mountaineer related!

No, with such resources allocated/squandered in covering the FlagSh#t U, its hard to believe that the Chilton family rag is "struggling"!!
 
I appreciate local media guys who can be objective and not sloppy drunk homers. Chuck needs to ease up on football though; just like others need to get off Hamrick's nutsack.
 
... its hard to believe that the Chilton family rag is "struggling"!!

While it is no secret that all newspapers are making less than they used to before algore invented the internet, WV law guarentees all newspapers a windfall profit from the legal ads. They have covered their costs before they sell the first commecial ad or the first copy.

The Chilton's supposed "struggles" are just tax planing for the limosine liberal children to avoid paying taxes when the old lady finally dies. Remember the Gag-zete's motto "do as I say, not as I do."

I appreciate local media guys who can be objective and not sloppy drunk homers. Chuck needs to ease up on football though; just like others need to get off Hamrick's nutsack.

Chuck is a dark hearted person, due to his well-known personal life setbacks. We all know that. But his act is not unique. Every paper covering a major program, even Raese's WVU worshiping D-P has a "negative" columnist who runs contrary to everybody else in the paper's views. You can find guys plying the same waters all over the country.

If MU has any "homer" or Hamrick worshiping columnists, I would be interested in knowing who they are. On the air, Woody certainly is, but that is Woody's job. Everybody's radio contract holder is like that. 3 and 8/11 cover the program reasonabably, 13's old owner was 100% anti-Marshall, new management has not yet set in. In print? Who? All I see are negative guys and moderately fair reporting. Certainly nothing you could call a "homer" at all.
 
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