Columbus Day

[GK4Herd]

It has become fashionable to discredit Columbus in recent years. He was a brutal mercenary and his atrocities are well documented. But he was also a product of his times. And though he wasn't likely the first European in America, his impact on the world can't be argued...or maybe it's more accurate to say his discovery.

Columbus's voyage and accidental discovery reshaped the world like no other single event in history. It reunited Pangea and had a profound effect on the economy, the politics, the agriculture, and the genetic makeup of the world. The disease that spread from Europe to America completely annihilated the native population making them ripe for European control. The Columbian Exchange introduced corn, potatoes, and tomatoes to Europe and completely changed the political and economic landscape.

Do we celebrate this man with a holiday? I'm not sure accolades are in order, but there is absolutely no denying the man's impact. He died considering himself a failure, but his mark would be very difficult to be reproduced by a single man or event. Thoughts?

 

[i am herdman]

The Indians would have done the same thing to the Europeans if they would have had the capability. It is human nature.

The protests you see now are nothing more than every group wanting attention and political correctness gone wild.

Frankly, we are a nation of sissies now who probably couldn't survive in a similar situation. Sherman burned the South and is one of the most notable and respected generals in history. Now, the South proudly salutes the American flag. So do many Indians. Harry S Truman ordered the big bomb to drop on Japan and now we buy Japanese cars and the Japanese are considered a friend.

Some folks can't get over it and realize there are going to be winners and losers. Every group has been persecuted at some time in history.

 

[raleighherdfan]

Dear America,

Lets stop celebrating or seriously recognizing anything. Someone's feelings will likely be hurt. The potential for offending anyone really isn't worth the risk. The costs are simply too high if we don't take the opportunity to eliminate individual recognition. Celebrating individual accomplishment (unless the individual is championing minority issues or other general loser types) is mean and unfair.

Accolades should only be given when every single person agrees. A "consensus" must be taken. If liberal loving, compassionate, types completely agree,.........only then is it ok to celebrate their perfect version of "accomplishment". If there isn't a "consensus", if a poll doesn't support such celebration, if pop culture doesn't think its cool............then fvck it. Lets bury it because the self inflicted guilt by such a caring, victim focused, nanny-state (gutless) society is way too much to handle.

The only thing worth truly recognizing and celebrating is total fairness and accomplishing equal outcomes for all, guaranteed to us by a well intentioned modern day bureaucrat.

Respectfully (because any other way may be considered bullying),
Mr. I. Am Mediocrity

 

[GK4Herd]

I see your point Raleigh, but I think different factors are playing into the Columbus Day thing that isn't necessarily a matter of political correctness. Don't get me wrong, the whole political correctness thing is driving the outrage in recent years. I think what needs to be brought into the equation is whether Columbus Day become a holiday based on merit of his greatness or by the sanitized version that was presented to school children when I was a kid. Political correctness bemoans the fact that he was a brutal mercenary that resorted to some pretty poor treatment of the natives. But history is chock full of that kind of stuff. What the Spaniards did in Mexico, Central and South America were MUCH more atrocious then Columbus' misdeeds.

The fact of the matter is Columbus's impact was mostly a result of the political situation in the world at the time and the rising ability to travel greater distances by sea than any time in history to that point. Wasn't it Leif Ericson that found his way into the Americas years before Columbus? The impact of that was negligible because of the world's inability to exploit the discovery or even know about if for that matter.

But Columbus happened upon the west by accident. It wasn't him being a great explorer so much as there was this large landmass in the way between him and China or India. It was purely an accident. He was also considered a failure when he didn't deliver on the gold and riches immediately to those who funded his voyages. Columbus wasn't a great man or leader from a historical perspective. But what he DID do was set off a chain of events that entirely changed the world. You can question his greatness, but his impact is unquestionable in so many ways.

So...is that deserving of a holiday?

 

[sistersville]

Columbus day is a big day to the italians. They use to make people shut down their stores on columbus day. Unlike other groups of people the italians have done great

 

[ThunderCat98]

Bah! My people discovered North America long before CC! Cymru am byth!

 

[Herd Fever]

This holiday is by far the biggest example of a White Supremacy Holiday out here. Not only did he not discover the land that is the USA, we are the only nation in the Western Hemisphere that even celebrates him.

What he did is no different than what ISIS is doing today so don't give me the product of the times BS

 

[TwolfHerdfan]

Most holidays are an excuse for the lazy government employee's to get another paid day off. Leaches. While the private sector slaves away.

 

[Herd Fever]

And what the Spaniards did in Latin America is because of Columbus who was commissioned by the Spanish.

 

[raleighherdfan]

But what he DID do was set off a chain of events that entirely changed the world. You can question his greatness, but his impact is unquestionable in so many ways.

This answers the question you are asking IMO.

But with that said. I am open to considering the removal of bullshit holidays that are created simply to allow govt employees 3 day weekends. After all, I am told, having the govt shutdown for any reason is detrimental to my existence.

 

[i am herdman]

Let's get rid of Columbus day and Martin Luther King day. No need for token holidays that fuel racial divide.

 

[Herd Fever]

Columbus did nothing for this world other then feed the selfish needs of Europeans.

 

[Herd Fever]

Let's get rid of Columbus day and Martin Luther King day. No need for token holidays that fuel racial divide.

How is MLK day fueling racial divide?? Herdman you continue to better yourself one ignorant statement at a time

 

[i am herdman]

How is MLK day fueling racial divide?? Herdman you continue to better yourself one ignorant statement at a time

Well, for one is MLK anymore deserving of a day for kids to be out of school than Abraham Lincoln or George Washington? Second, people have taken MLK's idea and dream and twisted it for their own agenda. See: Jesse Jackson, Al Sharpton, and other so called leaders.

At the end of the day why is MLK JR deserving of a holiday over any other prominent American icon?

Finally, you see when we start removing the importance of one it opens up debate for others. You don't like Columbus having a holiday and some people don't like MLK Jr having a holiday. When do the hispanics get a holiday?

 

[GK4Herd]

This holiday is by far the biggest example of a White Supremacy Holiday out here. Not only did he not discover the land that is the USA, we are the only nation in the Western Hemisphere that even celebrates him.

What he did is no different than what ISIS is doing today so don't give me the product of the times BS

I think the original intent of the holiday had nothing to do with racism or white supremacy. It was more about promoting patriotism. And it's true that he didn't step foot in present day usa, but his third voyage landed in South America and his fourth in Central America.

But what about the impact of the discovery? Whether you agree or disagree with the methods or results, its hard to ignore the impact this had on the world. The greed of men has existed from the beginning of time and knows no boundaries. White Europeans aren't the only ones who are guilty of atrocities to sate their desire for riches. Slavery in Africa has existed for centuries and still exists remotely today. The behavior of Columbus speaks to the greed of man and isn't indigenous to any single race.

 

[Herd Fever]

Well, for one is MLK anymore deserving of a day for kids to be out of school than Abraham Lincoln or George Washington? Second, people have taken MLK's idea and dream and twisted it for their own agenda. See: Jesse Jackson, Al Sharpton, and other so called leaders.

At the end of the day why is MLK JR deserving of a holiday over any other prominent American icon?

Finally, you see when we start removing the importance of one it opens up debate for others. You don't like Columbus having a holiday and some people don't like MLK Jr having a holiday. When do the hispanics get a holiday?

I don't know about other states but in NY they get a whole week off for Lincoln and George Washington birthdays.

And don't get me started on opportunist like Jesse and Al

 

[Herd Fever]

I think the original intent of the holiday had nothing to do with racism or white supremacy. It was more about promoting patriotism. And it's true that he didn't step foot in present day usa, but his third voyage landed in South America and his fourth in Central America.

But what about the impact of the discovery? Whether you agree or disagree with the methods or results, its hard to ignore the impact this had on the world. The greed of men has existed from the beginning of time and knows no boundaries. White Europeans aren't the only ones who are guilty of atrocities to sate their desire for riches. Slavery in Africa has existed for centuries and still exists remotely today. The behavior of Columbus speaks to the greed of man and isn't indigenous to any single race.

And this is why he shouldn't be celebrated

 

[sistersville]

Columbus did nothing for this world other then feed the selfish needs of Europeans.

Columbus used slaves to test how sharp his knife was. A. barbarian MLK day I am all for. He took on the united states of america and made them stop one of the nations worst sins,,,the treatment of blacks. . Jim Crow laws needed flushed down the toilet not marked white or black. MLK said he had been to the mountaintop and had seen the promise land. He says but I might not be with you. That was in support of sanitary workers i think. He knew he was getting shot. James earl ray sure got to england fast. Which brings me to this point. Never trust the goverment by giving them your guns so they can give them to libyians and everyone else in the world. One day we might have to rise up against the goverment and we need those automatic weapons

 

[i am herdman]

I don't know about other states but in NY they get a whole week off for Lincoln and George Washington birthdays.

And don't get me started on opportunist like Jesse and Al

A whole week?

 

[raleighherdfan]

Shit, while we are at it.......lets stop celebrating the biggest white supremacy celebration of all. 4th of July. Think how many people around the world are offended by our success and superiority. Probably wouldn't have happened anyway had CC decided to keep his ass in Europe or simply hadn't got lucky and run into land while sailing to China.

In fact, think how lucky the Chinese are for not having Chris show up. By not allowing that syphilis carrying bigot onto their continent, they were able to maintain several more centuries of population control in various other hideous ways.

Herdfever (probably) likes this

 

[CockyHerd]

What about Thanksgiving? We sucked the Indians in with a free meal, introduced them to fire water, got them liquored up and stole their land!!!

 

[raleighherdfan]

What about Thanksgiving? We sucked the Indians in with a free meal, introduced them to fire water, got them liquored up and stole their land!!!

Damn straight. Introduced them to gun powder and muskets too. Talk about the down fall of indian civilization. If only European govts and monarchies could have protected them....think how civilized we would all be to day?.?.

 

[Herd Fever]

What about Thanksgiving? We sucked the Indians in with a free meal, introduced them to fire water, got them liquored up and stole their land!!!

I feel the same way about that cannibalistic holiday

 

[extragreen]

I just want a national Led Zeppelin holiday.

 

[GK4Herd]

I just want a national Led Zeppelin holiday.

Just another example of British exploitation of America. Nothing but brutal mercenaries. I guess when they came here they thought all that glittered was gold.

Come on EG....sometimes all of your thoughts are misgiven. Ooh...it makes me wonder.

 

[raleighherdfan]

If only we could have a "National Fetus Removal Day", "Ignore the Myths of the Bible Day", or "Welfare Recipient Pride Day". Those are holidays worthy of implementation.

 

[raleighherdfan]

Since when did the Thanksgiving tradition include the act of eating humans???? Must be a Jamaican tradition.

 

[extragreen]

You seem to have forgotten a thing...there are two paths you can go by.

 

[Herd Fever]

What about Thanksgiving? We sucked the Indians in with a free meal, introduced them to fire water, got them liquored up and stole their land!!!

I feel the same way about that cannibalistic holiday

Since when did the Thanksgiving tradition include the act of eating humans???? Must be a Jamaican tradition.

Come on, what do you think the turkey represents???

 

[GK4Herd]

You seem to have forgotten a thing...there are two paths you can go by.

Maybe...but in the long run there's still time to chose the road I'm on.

 

[extragreen]

Yeah, but the piper's calling you to join him

 

[raleighherdfan]

Come on, what do you think the turkey represents???

LMAO. Please explain how exactly eating turkey is a "cannibalistic" act.

 

[Herd Fever]

So you think the settlers came here, sat here and had a turkey feast with the Natives???

Now they ate the natives and the turkey is symbolic of that.

 

[raleighherdfan]

So you think the settlers came here, sat here and had a turkey feast with the Natives???

Now they ate the natives and the turkey is symbolic of that.

So the settlers ate the natives? Eating turkey is symbolic of how people ate other people? I knew your reply would be comedy, but damn, that is freaking hilarious. I really cant stop laughing. Bahahahaha

 

[Herd Fever]

Forgot I am talking to a conservative republican who thinks life and history is what is laid out infront of him instead of searching for truths

 

[Herd Fever]

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/nat...estown-cannibals-scientists-article-1.1332196

 

[Herd Fever]

If they ate their own, what makes you think they gave 2 shits about the natives. The white man never should compassion towards anyone not white in the history of Man

 

[raleighherdfan]

If they ate their own, what makes you think they gave 2 shits about the natives. The white man never should compassion towards anyone not white in the history of Man

Again, nothing in here about pilgrims eating natives. Complete fabrication an innuendo on your part. More race baiting ignorance. Only a moron would draw conclusions that eating a turkey in modern day has anything to do with celebrating "cannibalism" in ancient times as you suggested.

There are multiple written historical accounts of what "Thanksgiving" was/ is throughout its history. None of them involved celebrating the opportunity to eat human flesh. Its obvious you don't understand such a premise.

 

[Herd Fever]

Do you think the White Supremist History books are going to tell you that?? Come on, those same books try to downplay Slavery in America, the extermination of the Natives. the removal of Mexicans from their natural lands, Jim Crow and the Hundreds of thousands that was lynched over the years.

 

[CockyHerd]

Why don't we have a Holiday celebrating the Donner Party??? My family always has ham at Christmas, maybe that goes way back!!!

Oh, never mind, they didn't eat natives or Mexicans. They ate each other..........