Men's Basketball Picked to Finish 11th
- Thread starter Chris McLaughlin
- Start date
I love it when we are disrespected! Motivation....
OUCH!
Obviously the opposing coaches thought JE and CJ were all we had. Cool.
Coach 'em up DD!
Obviously the opposing coaches thought JE and CJ were all we had. Cool.
Coach 'em up DD!
On paper, I can see what the opposing coaches are thinking... Lose two guys that scored as much as Elmore and Burkes and they assume you wont be as good. There are certainly going to be growing pains, but we should finish better than 11th.
Absolutely. CUSA coaches must be "giddy" again. I see where they're coming from, but I think Dan has proven more than to put us that low. But whatever.
This is also a combination of us taking a step back while a lot of teams in the conference are taking a step forward. FIU & FAU both have 1st team All-CUSA players and they're 9-10. North Texas is good and they're 7th? UAB is a solid team and they're 6th? ODU won it last year and UTEP has caught them. Jackson and Wallace from UTSA came into the Cam last year, shit all over us, and they're lucky to get a 1st place vote. The conference is solid this year.
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ha ha , we will do better than that mark it down. Not predicting a title but at least 7-8 worst case- 6 best case
Danny loves being predicted low. Obviously none of the coaches or writers have any idea of the quality of the incoming players. They see that we lost 47ppg and don't see where they can come from this year.
Danny has told us over and over that he is NOT worried about where scoring will come from. He expects to be in the 80's
Danny has told us over and over that he is NOT worried about where scoring will come from. He expects to be in the 80's
INPUT: SamC statement on Herd Hoops
that one weekend in March
that one weekend in March
It's the lowest we've been predicted to finish since D'Antoni's hiring. (Incomplete data exists for 2014-15)
A couple interesting points about the next-lowest: we were picked to finish 9th in 2015-16, D'Antoni's second season. We wound up finishing the season 4th, lead by the play of one-year transfer James Kelly from Miami. Interestingly enough, Kelly's wiki page contains the following unsourced declaration:
Kelly, despite playing only one season is considered one of the best players in Marshall Basketball history.
A couple interesting points about the next-lowest: we were picked to finish 9th in 2015-16, D'Antoni's second season. We wound up finishing the season 4th, lead by the play of one-year transfer James Kelly from Miami. Interestingly enough, Kelly's wiki page contains the following unsourced declaration:
Kelly, despite playing only one season is considered one of the best players in Marshall Basketball history.
This is funny... It was four years ago and I honestly had already forgotten about Kelly.
That was there year we started 0-6 and then Elmore got eligible at the semester(ala Taylor?). We went 17-10 after that-DD’s second year.
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If you need more evidence of the massive double standard applied to our two coaches than this thread, you cannot read and write.
Eleventh.
Mediocre. Unacceptable. MH should do something. We have so many resources.
Eleventh.
Mediocre. Unacceptable. MH should do something. We have so many resources.
I couldn’t think of a better first post to reply to on here than what Sam just posted.
We’re talking about Danny actually EXCEEDING expectations, not John Holliday falling short of expectations. lol
And I would never call for Hamrick to be fired over basketball having too good of resources to not be successful, because anyone with a clue of what goes on behind the scenes knows the disparity between football and... literally everything else.
We’re talking about Danny actually EXCEEDING expectations, not John Holliday falling short of expectations. lol
And I would never call for Hamrick to be fired over basketball having too good of resources to not be successful, because anyone with a clue of what goes on behind the scenes knows the disparity between football and... literally everything else.
You are missing some key differences, which isn't surprising.
First, the basketball team is picked 11th and the consensus is MU will finish better than that... Not like football where we are usually predicted to be the best, or among the best teams, and consistently underachieve.
Second, DD has taken a program that was absolute garbage for decades and improved it... Basketball is on an upward trajectory (at least in the eyes of fans). Football, not so much.
Lastly, in no way to we have better/more resources than other CUSA schools in basketball. Our arena is old, no tradition, until the last 3-4 years almost zero fan support, etc... In terms of hoops resources we are light years behind the WKU, ODU, MTSU and Louisiana Tech's of the world... Again, unlike football, where we have every advantage (tradition, stadium, fan support, IPF, etc.).
If Doc was picked 11th he would finish 13th. Let's see how Dan does. If he finishes 11th or lower, I'll be the first to give him a hard time. Heck, I'll do that if he doesn't get top 8.
I'll go ya one further - top 6. Too much returning talent + IB + the Euros + the newbies....+ Dan's ability to teach the system.
If Cusa was as good in football as it was in basketball we would be lucky to finish eleventh with Doc.
When Doc ties for 2nd place is the East does that mean he finish 3rd, 4th, 5th, or 6th?
Being picked to finish 11th and actually doing so are 2 different things. We'll see how things shake out. Heck, we might even get lucky in March. Have you ever been to a Herd bball game lately? Fast and furious, unlike our dull, drab fball. Don't produce for DD, you'll find yourself on the bench, unlike fball, where it's the same mistakes over and over, and no substitution.
Just in case you are referencing what I said in the other thread (I doubt it)... I 100% agree. Don’t think D’Antoni is the answer.
Keep in mind that Dan is the lowest paid coach in CUSA. Why? Not because he is the worst coach, but because he loves the school and wants his program to succeed so he is willing to work for what is essentially nothing in the coaching world so the money can be spent on other things.
That kind of thing is endearing to a fan base.
That kind of thing is endearing to a fan base.
What “consensus” ? Most guides and other polls say about the same. A meaningless, losing season.
But you are accepting of “better than that”, meaning “better than eleventh”. The definition of accepting mediocrity.
There is no doubt that the mediocrity accepting fan base accepted the bad performance of coach after coach, including Greg White, the meme around him we are now seeing repeated.
But “improved”? “Upward trajectory”? Really? One special week and a half, and the rest pure mediocrity. But “upward”? Finish 4th, win tournament, followed by lost season ending in ridiculous pay-to-play deal; 11th. That is, umm, downward.
See that is the deal that the Doc hate crew has to buy into. It is just not true.
First, CUSA exists for football. The ONLY theme holding the deal together is a desire of the member schools to play football at the same level. Nothing else. Each has a different relationship to basketball, ranging from the better ones you mention to a third of the league that makes no effort at all at basketball. The idea that CUSA is anything but a one-bid lower mid-major fourth tier league in basketball, with at least 4 teams not really trying, is just wrong. This league is easy to dominate, which is what we should be doing.
Second, yes, thanks to our wonderful AD, we have great facilities. Including in basketball. When you cannot sell 9.5K, what do you need with more? The arena is just fine. Travel has improved (thanks MH and Jimmy J). Basketball has everything it needs. What, exactly, save a dedicated practice facility which is coming, do we need?
Third, yes, we have great fans. MU, among the smallest public colleges in I-A, is in I-A because of the best fan base in the country. Fans that would be there for basketball, if there was anything to see. There just isn’t.
Eleventh.
Ouch, I can't believe you'd knock the football program like that.
The fans aren't showing up for football games, so there must not be anything to see.
So what do you think the low live gate will be for this 11th place basketball team?
My first guess would be December 11th, against the mighty Big Blues of Bluefield State College, but school is still in session and the team might be as good at 2-5 or even 3-4 at that time. So, probably a weeknight game in the predicted third pod of this silly pod system.
Time to get behind the lone men’s sport worth a shit at MU these days, soccer.
Last season attendance was up about 1000 per game over the previous year. In fact we nearly won the conference race. Lost in a close one to ODU. The Monarchs have far and away had the largest attendance since Memphis exited. I would expect us to be there with them again this year. I also expect UTEP now that they will be good again, to challenge for the largest crowds in CUSA. They were always #2 to Memphis with over 9k per game until they started losing. The Miners are back and that is great for CUSA.
CUSA exists for Football? Damn, what a miserable existence. We've only won this thing once. Damn.
So you believe that the fans will accept the mediocrity. Good to know.
Of course it does. It is illogical to argue otherwise. You actually believe that MU would be in a conference with teams in Texas and Florida without football? CUSA, and certainly CUSA 2.0 and 3.0, were created for football, by schools all wanting to play football at the same level. Each with different basketball, and minor sports, schemes that vary greatly in level. Some try, some want to try but really cannot, and some could not care less and make a token effort. Being picked 11th is being picked last.
In a football-free world, MU is in a league like the A-10 or such like.
Some seem to accept mediocrity for football. Considering Danny has been able to move the program forward from decades of ineptitude, the fans appreciate that. Doc has provided consistency but with all the resources at his disposal, he has vastly under performed in arguably the worst D1 league in college football. But some continue to kiss his ass and Hammy's too.
And to let it be known, I like Doc for his loyalty and how he represents the school. His run as coach is to be respected and he'll finish out his current contract. But it's time for a change in the near future.
Hey now... CUSA isn't the worst league out there, we were ranked 9th out of 10 last year... (Thanks to the MAC for being an absolute dumpster fire)
It's true that CUSA exists because of football and the associated TV revenue. Sam's falacy is that CUSA is any good at football (it's not) and/or that all of the schools in the league care about football (they don't).
The ACC also exists because of football (remember they realigned for TV markets/dollars as well)... Would anyone in their right mind argue that ACC football is better than ACC basketball? Of course not... CUSA was created by football, but it's better at basketball. Just watch the games.
Sam believes cusa in basketball is a one-bid, lower mid-major, 4th tier level basketball conference. He may be right. But, I would say cusa football could be rated at the same level. Just how many bowl games do cusa teams play in each year that are played between Christmas and New Years Day? I can probably count them on one finger or less. Talk about mediocrity...7 or 8 wins a year in football doesn't do it for me. We should be at the top of the conference every year. But Sam can't see that. His eyes are obscured by Doc's butt cheeks.
Let me go on record as saying, I Don’t like Con USA!!! We don’t belong there. When we first joined it was ok, a step up, but then the program departures and all of a sudden we’re in a third rate conference. The problem, however, we don’t dominate. We don’t win in any sport. We’re good but not great. We have no case to join any other conference for many reasons. Thus the attitude of the fans and the alumni. I am now simply optimistic we compete and have a clean program. Soccer, volleyball, softball, baseball are just as important to me as football and basketball even though they are more visible and lucrative. Doc and DD have been fine for our University and I will support them. Optimistic but realistic.
80+ football teams out 130 get into a bowl 64 out of well over 300 get NCAA bids
