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So you think needle exchanges do not work?

Raoul Duke MU

Doctor of Journalism
Moderator
I've always maintained that needle exchange programs are not only harm reduction (I assume that's a "liberal thing" to some of you) but also a huge money saver compared to HIV and Hep C outbreak costs. Well now we have a study to prove addicts not only use exchanges and cut down on risky outbreak causing shit, but also are way more likely to properly dispose of needles AND the exchanges serve as an effective one-stop shop for medical needs (HIV testing, getting people to take their meds for chronic diseases).

I've talked here before about Austin IN. You do not want Huntington or Charleston to become another Austin. Think with some common damn sense.

A new federal study shows that needle sharing plummeted in Austin, Indiana after people who shoot up drugs began using a syringe exchange started in response to the largest drug-fueled HIV outbreak ever to hit rural America.

U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention researchers asked 124 injection drug users in Scott County about needle sharing before and after the exchange was established in April 2015. They found the proportion who shared syringes dropped from 74 percent to 22 percent.

They also found 86 percent of those surveyed in 2016 – including 98 percent of those with HIV – used the needle exchange. And 82 percent disposed of spent needles safely in "sharps" containers for medical waste, up from 18 percent before the exchange opened.

More than 5,000 clean syringes were distributed in the first couple of weeks after the exchange opened.

"As a result of the public health response, there was a huge decrease in high-risk practices, especially among HIV-positive people," said Sharoda Dasgupta, author of the analysis, which was presented Wednesday at a medical conference in Boston. "The results from this study were substantial."

Scott County's needle exchange opened as a "one-stop shop" in downtown Austin where people can also get free HIV testing, educational information, job counseling, drug treatment and other services. Austin, population 4,200, is the epicenter of the outbreak, which was caused by rampant intravenous painkiller abuse and now includes 230 cases of HIV – a rate comparable to many countries in Africa.

Outside organizations, including the CDC, Indiana University Health and the giant, California-based AIDS Healthcare Foundation, have converged on Austin to create a safety net of sorts.

A related study out Wednesday, based on 2016 interviews with 200 Scott County IV drug users, pointed to other positive effects of that response. For example, HIV testing rose substantially. The syringe exchange was the most common testing site, and those who used it were far more likely to be aware of a daily oral medication, called PrEP, that helps reduce the risk of spreading HIV.

Dr. Will Cooke, Austin's lone doctor during the outbreak, said the study results reflect what he sees day-to-day. He said drug users with HIV are injecting more responsibly than other IV drug users in an attempt to protect themselves and others – defying "this misconception that they're bad people." He stressed that addiction is a disease and these people are suffering. "They need help."

Cooke said he's glad the syringe exchange has linked more residents to medical care. Most HIV patients also have hepatitis C, and the state has a new program to help them, which allows rural doctors like him to consult remotely about cases with experts at Indiana University School of Public Health.

Gradually, Cooke said, Austin is recovering from addiction and related disease,

"We're getting there. We're getting more people into (drug) recovery. It's like roots growing into the soil," he said. "Time is the only real answer to addiction. Time and community."


https://www.courier-journal.com/sto...haring-austin-indiana-hiv-outbreak/399216002/
 
What is the downside of an HIV or Hep-C outbreak in the druggie community? Both are spread by blood-to-blood contact.

Not asking to be a dick. Would really like to know the potential risks to the general population.
 
What is the downside of an HIV or Hep-C outbreak in the druggie community? Both are spread by blood-to-blood contact.

Not asking to be a dick. Would really like to know the potential risks to the general population.
the strung-out in the streets may bite you. walking through charleston in the evening is like an episode of the walking dead when the zombies first start appearing.
 
I've always maintained that needle exchange programs are not only harm reduction (I assume that's a "liberal thing" to some of you) but also a huge money saver compared to HIV and Hep C outbreak costs. Well now we have a study to prove addicts not only use exchanges and cut down on risky outbreak causing shit, but also are way more likely to properly dispose of needles AND the exchanges serve as an effective one-stop shop for medical needs (HIV testing, getting people to take their meds for chronic diseases).

I've talked here before about Austin IN. You do not want Huntington or Charleston to become another Austin. Think with some common damn sense.

A new federal study shows that needle sharing plummeted in Austin, Indiana after people who shoot up drugs began using a syringe exchange started in response to the largest drug-fueled HIV outbreak ever to hit rural America.

U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention researchers asked 124 injection drug users in Scott County about needle sharing before and after the exchange was established in April 2015. They found the proportion who shared syringes dropped from 74 percent to 22 percent.

They also found 86 percent of those surveyed in 2016 – including 98 percent of those with HIV – used the needle exchange. And 82 percent disposed of spent needles safely in "sharps" containers for medical waste, up from 18 percent before the exchange opened.

More than 5,000 clean syringes were distributed in the first couple of weeks after the exchange opened.

"As a result of the public health response, there was a huge decrease in high-risk practices, especially among HIV-positive people," said Sharoda Dasgupta, author of the analysis, which was presented Wednesday at a medical conference in Boston. "The results from this study were substantial."

Scott County's needle exchange opened as a "one-stop shop" in downtown Austin where people can also get free HIV testing, educational information, job counseling, drug treatment and other services. Austin, population 4,200, is the epicenter of the outbreak, which was caused by rampant intravenous painkiller abuse and now includes 230 cases of HIV – a rate comparable to many countries in Africa.

Outside organizations, including the CDC, Indiana University Health and the giant, California-based AIDS Healthcare Foundation, have converged on Austin to create a safety net of sorts.

A related study out Wednesday, based on 2016 interviews with 200 Scott County IV drug users, pointed to other positive effects of that response. For example, HIV testing rose substantially. The syringe exchange was the most common testing site, and those who used it were far more likely to be aware of a daily oral medication, called PrEP, that helps reduce the risk of spreading HIV.

Dr. Will Cooke, Austin's lone doctor during the outbreak, said the study results reflect what he sees day-to-day. He said drug users with HIV are injecting more responsibly than other IV drug users in an attempt to protect themselves and others – defying "this misconception that they're bad people." He stressed that addiction is a disease and these people are suffering. "They need help."

Cooke said he's glad the syringe exchange has linked more residents to medical care. Most HIV patients also have hepatitis C, and the state has a new program to help them, which allows rural doctors like him to consult remotely about cases with experts at Indiana University School of Public Health.

Gradually, Cooke said, Austin is recovering from addiction and related disease,

"We're getting there. We're getting more people into (drug) recovery. It's like roots growing into the soil," he said. "Time is the only real answer to addiction. Time and community."


https://www.courier-journal.com/sto...haring-austin-indiana-hiv-outbreak/399216002/
we've got a needle exchange program but recreational pot isn't legal. one contributes to a lethal addiction and threatens to exacerbate an already out of control problem. one could actually inject a crazy amount of money into our economy (which a portion of the profits could be earmarked to help with addiction), would encourage land ownership in our state, and has shown to lower opioid addiction rates. guess which one west virginia invests in.
 
What is the downside of an HIV or Hep-C outbreak in the druggie community? Both are spread by blood-to-blood contact.

Not asking to be a dick. Would really like to know the potential risks to the general population.

They have sex with a non drug user they get HIV or Hep C. Then you have sex with them
 
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we've got a needle exchange program but recreational pot isn't legal. one contributes to a lethal addiction and threatens to exacerbate an already out of control problem. one could actually inject a crazy amount of money into our economy (which a portion of the profits could be earmarked to help with addiction), would encourage land ownership in our state, and has shown to lower opioid addiction rates. guess which one west virginia invests in.

Baby steps, WV still struggling with the fact Coal is a dead industry.
 
we've got a needle exchange program but recreational pot isn't legal. one contributes to a lethal addiction and threatens to exacerbate an already out of control problem. one could actually inject a crazy amount of money into our economy (which a portion of the profits could be earmarked to help with addiction), would encourage land ownership in our state, and has shown to lower opioid addiction rates. guess which one west virginia invests in.

Obviously I support the legalization of marijuana, for a multitude of reasons.
 
What is the downside of an HIV or Hep-C outbreak in the druggie community? Both are spread by blood-to-blood contact.

Not asking to be a dick. Would really like to know the potential risks to the general population.

There is no all-encompassing "druggie community". There are closet addicts that function and run in non-addict social circles. It's very easy for one of them to sleep around and spread HIV.

Outbreaks of disease strain available health care resources. Let's say Cabell County has a sudden HIV outbreak the size of the one in Austin IN...4000+ new HIV cases in a month in Huntington, a lot of doctors are going to busy for while with that.

Also, there is financial risk. As I have noted before, no matter your political philosophy we are not going to stop government funding of treating people with chronic infectious diseases. What sounds better to you as a taxpayer: a needle exchange or 4000 new cases of HIV at half a million bucks a pop for lifetime treatment?

I found the findings on needle disposal very interesting. I know you have complained about the sharps box downtown. That sure beats dirty needles strewn all over town. Apparently, repeating proper disposal to addicts every time they visit the exchange works, from 18% to 82% is amazing.

And it's just general safety. Blood to blood infection...needle-stick injuries happen in health care. Improper sterilization happens in health care. You ever help someone that's been in an accident or had the shit beat out of them? Do you carry a personal protection kit everywhere you go? I have one in my car (as well as a tactical first aid kit); I won't touch a bleeding injured person without protection, I assume everyone and all blood is infectious. You think most people follow that standard? It's just a bad thing in general to have a high percentage of infected people in a community.
 
I have no problem with a needle exchange program if needles are actually being exchanged. Listening to the mayor of Charleston, it sounds like it’s more of a needle giveaway program than an exchange.

There are so many needles laying in the streets, parks, and playgrounds here. The needles aren’t being turned in; they’re being discarded in public areas. Businesses are having their employees search the premises prior to operation hours because customers are finding so many needles around their shops. It’s a problem in Charleston. I’m all for doing whatever can be done to crack down on the spread of HIV, but Jesus Christ, something has to give.
 
“Used needles and human feces are found littering downtown San Francisco as infectious disease expert warns the area is becoming dirtier than some slums in India and Brazil”
By Ashley Collman For Dailymail.com16:06 20 Feb 2018, updated 02:06 21 Feb 2018


San Francisco has a needle exchange program.

I wonder if theirs a connection with the size of the city and program success. I’m for whatever works to reduce the overall cost to the rest of society.
 
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I have no problem with a needle exchange program if needles are actually being exchanged. Listening to the mayor of Charleston, it sounds like it’s more of a needle giveaway program than an exchange.

There are so many needles laying in the streets, parks, and playgrounds here. The needles aren’t being turned in; they’re being discarded in public areas. Businesses are having their employees search the premises prior to operation hours because customers are finding so many needles around their shops. It’s a problem in Charleston. I’m all for doing whatever can be done to crack down on the spread of HIV, but Jesus Christ, something has to give.

Perhaps someone in Charleston can talk to someone in Austin and ask what they do. That jump in their proper disposal is amazing.
 
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“Used needles and human feces are found littering downtown San Francisco as infectious disease expert warns the area is becoming dirtier than some slums in India and Brazil”
By Ashley Collman For Dailymail.com16:06 20 Feb 2018, updated 02:06 21 Feb 2018


San Francisco has a needle exchange program.

I wonder if theirs a connection with the size of the city and program success. I’m for whatever works to reduce the overall cost to the rest of society.

San Fran has a tremendous homelessness problem. It's not just bums...gig economy people are sleeping in tents.
 
“Used needles and human feces are found littering downtown San Francisco as infectious disease expert warns the area is becoming dirtier than some slums in India and Brazil”
By Ashley Collman For Dailymail.com16:06 20 Feb 2018, updated 02:06 21 Feb 2018


San Francisco has a needle exchange program.

I wonder if theirs a connection with the size of the city and program success. I’m for whatever works to reduce the overall cost to the rest of society.

San Fran also have a huge homeless problem so......
 
Perhaps someone in Charleston can talk to someone in Austin and ask what they do. That jump in their proper disposal is amazing.
While I have no pity for users & ODers, I don’t want disease to spread like wildfire. The Charleston Police Cheif was just on with Hoppy Kercheval and said Charleston’s needle “exchange” program was as large as Baltimore, MD’s.

Also, people are setting their vehicles up where needles are sticking up to stab police officers during searches. Abandoned houses in Charleston have needles sticking up in doorways/windows, in the yard, etc. and when crews go to board the houses up, they have to watch for needles. There was a four year old girl who picked a needle up in a McDonalds bathroom and poked herself. There’s needles all over the place in the dying CTC Mall. I know people who used to run on the Kanawha Blvd who won’t anymore because it’s littered with needles.

Maybe the users in Indiana are just a lot cleaner people. Charleston has a homeless problem too, which I know plays a part too. But when a dying city is pumping out as many needles as Baltimore, MD...

Like I said, I’m for the program and don’t want the spread of disease. But what do you do when they’re being tossed around like beer cans in a trailer park?
 
While I have no pity for users & ODers, I don’t want disease to spread like wildfire. The Charleston Police Cheif was just on with Hoppy Kercheval and said Charleston’s needle “exchange” program was as large as Baltimore, MD’s.

Also, people are setting their vehicles up where needles are sticking up to stab police officers during searches. Abandoned houses in Charleston have needles sticking up in doorways/windows, in the yard, etc. and when crews go to board the houses up, they have to watch for needles. There was a four year old girl who picked a needle up in a McDonalds bathroom and poked herself. There’s needles all over the place in the dying CTC Mall. I know people who used to run on the Kanawha Blvd who won’t anymore because it’s littered with needles.

Maybe the users in Indiana are just a lot cleaner people. Charleston has a homeless problem too, which I know plays a part too. But when a dying city is pumping out as many needles as Baltimore, MD...

Like I said, I’m for the program and don’t want the spread of disease. But what do you do when they’re being tossed around like beer cans in a trailer park?

Send them to prison if they are using needles as booby traps for cops. Seriously, I have zero pity for anyone doing that.

Maybe we are cleaner here. I can tell you litter is not as bad here as it is in WV.
 
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While I have no pity for users & ODers, I don’t want disease to spread like wildfire. The Charleston Police Cheif was just on with Hoppy Kercheval and said Charleston’s needle “exchange” program was as large as Baltimore, MD’s.

Also, people are setting their vehicles up where needles are sticking up to stab police officers during searches. Abandoned houses in Charleston have needles sticking up in doorways/windows, in the yard, etc. and when crews go to board the houses up, they have to watch for needles. There was a four year old girl who picked a needle up in a McDonalds bathroom and poked herself. There’s needles all over the place in the dying CTC Mall. I know people who used to run on the Kanawha Blvd who won’t anymore because it’s littered with needles.

Maybe the users in Indiana are just a lot cleaner people. Charleston has a homeless problem too, which I know plays a part too. But when a dying city is pumping out as many needles as Baltimore, MD...

Like I said, I’m for the program and don’t want the spread of disease. But what do you do when they’re being tossed around like beer cans in a trailer park?
Every time i see the Charleston chief of police i thank him. Guy's trying to make a difference in a city that's run in the most ass-backwards way possible. It's almost like they're daring him to give a shit.
 
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What is the downside of an HIV or Hep-C outbreak in the druggie community? Both are spread by blood-to-blood contact.

Not asking to be a dick. Would really like to know the potential risks to the general population.

I have no knowledge of needle sharing program efficacy, logistics, etc. I have zero opinion on them because I know nothing about them.

Regarding Hep C and HIV....

From a purely financial standpoint, at this point both of those diseases are either curable (see sofosbuvir for Hep C) or highly treateable...with extremely expensive drugs mind you. Obviously, for public health you want to limit the spread of these diseases...but from a publich health dollar stand point treating chronic illnesses like HIV with life-long very expensive drugs is just that - expensive. Many people live a long time with HIV and Hep C but have expensive ongoing prescription drug use or end up with liver cirrhosis/Hepatocellular carcinoma...also very expensive.

My guess would be the HIV or Hep C will not kill them, the narcotics will. You as a tax payer will pay tens of thousands to treat their HIV/Hep C. The Ryan White HIV program is federally funded and in my anecdotal experience pretty much anyone with HIV can get access to care through that program.

Medicare continues to refuse to negotiate drug prices, so we're stuck with a system that has very expensive drugs...but the drugs are very good for these viruses.
 
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I have no knowledge of needle sharing program efficacy, logistics, etc. I have zero opinion on them because I know nothing about them.

Regarding Hep C and HIV....

From a purely financial standpoint, at this point both of those diseases are either curable (see sofosbuvir for Hep C) or highly treateable...with extremely expensive drugs mind you. Obviously, for public health you want to limit the spread of these diseases...but from a publich health dollar stand point treating chronic illnesses like HIV with life-long very expensive drugs is just that - expensive. Many people live a long time with HIV and Hep C but have expensive ongoing prescription drug use or end up with liver cirrhosis/Hepatocellular carcinoma...also very expensive.

My guess would be the HIV or Hep C will not kill them, the narcotics will. You as a tax payer will pay tens of thousands to treat their HIV/Hep C. The Ryan White HIV program is federally funded and in my anecdotal experience pretty much anyone with HIV can get access to care through that program.

Medicare continues to refuse to negotiate drug prices, so we're stuck with a system that has very expensive drugs...but the drugs are very good for these viruses.

This. Which is smarter, spending cents or spending dollars? I'm also encouraged the programs are a gateway to addiction treatment.
 
While I have no pity for users & ODers, I don’t want disease to spread like wildfire. The Charleston Police Cheif was just on with Hoppy Kercheval and said Charleston’s needle “exchange” program was as large as Baltimore, MD’s.

Also, people are setting their vehicles up where needles are sticking up to stab police officers during searches. Abandoned houses in Charleston have needles sticking up in doorways/windows, in the yard, etc. and when crews go to board the houses up, they have to watch for needles. There was a four year old girl who picked a needle up in a McDonalds bathroom and poked herself. There’s needles all over the place in the dying CTC Mall. I know people who used to run on the Kanawha Blvd who won’t anymore because it’s littered with needles.

Maybe the users in Indiana are just a lot cleaner people. Charleston has a homeless problem too, which I know plays a part too. But when a dying city is pumping out as many needles as Baltimore, MD...

Like I said, I’m for the program and don’t want the spread of disease. But what do you do when they’re being tossed around like beer cans in a trailer park?
That's disgusting. Needle traps in your car should be a felony.

Also make littering needles carry a stricter punishment. Catch someone throwing a needle on the ground? Give them 30 days to turn 50 dirty needles in to the police dept or they issue a warrant for child endangerment or something like that. Make them clean up their own mess.
 
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