Vinny did now I'm asking you to give back...Big Green donation.

[TheGreenhouseEffect]

If you are planning to renew, why not now?

If you are holding out because you are disappointed, angry, feeling betrayed by football, consider that there are some 260 Marshall athletes other than football players in need of your support. Holding out on donations that solely go to support the education of our student athletes hurts those on our 20-win basketball team, our 1st place softball team, our 3rd place volleyball team, and 11 other sports.

These kids work their tails off for Marshall. Many would never see a college campus if not for their athletic ability and they make the most of it. MU Athletics enjoys an amazing 84% graduation rate!

The Big Green is having another membership drive this year. Last year over 300 members were added. This year the goal is to keep who we had and add another 12 or sot to get to 3500 members.

A part of this drive is a contest among the chapters. If anything I've said here, or if you support what I have said in past postings about supporting our kids, motivates you to go ahead and renew or join anew, do me a favor and note me as your referral. I can send you paperwork if you reply to this thread or PM me or just mention Doug Riley when you call in.

Just asking to help a Herdfans Brotha out. My chapter came in 2nd place last year and I would love to reward them for all their hard work with a 1st place win this year.

BTW, Marshall is #12 in CUSA in public (state) funding for athletics but #1 in private donations. You are making a difference.

 

[Treadmill MUsic]

Mr. Vinny has "give back" type paper. I contribute when it's feasible, but I'm a real little guy money wise. Go Herd!

 

[CarolinaHerdZilla22]

I LOVE MARSHALL...this is why I give $$$$$$.......no matter your amount donated====it add$ up. Everyone can not be a 110%er...but your PRIVATE #1 $$$ helps grow our Athletic Program.

HerdZilla22 (Sweeney) in Charlotte

 

[TwolfHerdfan]

If you are planning to renew, why not now?

If you are holding out because you are disappointed, angry, feeling betrayed by football, consider that there are some 260 Marshall athletes other than football players in need of your support. Holding out on donations that solely go to support the education of our student athletes hurts those on our 20-win basketball team, our 1st place softball team, our 3rd place volleyball team, and 11 other sports.

These kids work their tails off for Marshall. Many would never see a college campus if not for their athletic ability and they make the most of it. MU Athletics enjoys an amazing 84% graduation rate!

The Big Green is having another membership drive this year. Last year over 300 members were added. This year the goal is to keep who we had and add another 12 or sot to get to 3500 members.

A part of this drive is a contest among the chapters. If anything I've said here, or if you support what I have said in past postings about supporting our kids, motivates you to go ahead and renew or join anew, do me a favor and note me as your referral. I can send you paperwork if you reply to this thread or PM me or just mention Doug Riley when you call in.

Just asking to help a Herdfans Brotha out. My chapter came in 2nd place last year and I would love to reward them for all their hard work with a 1st place win this year.

BTW, Marshall is #12 in CUSA in public (state) funding for athletics but #1 in private donations. You are making a difference.

Which is why I never understood it when some nut job posts that our fans don't support the program. Good gracious, we are in the poorest area of any in CUSA and yet we are #1 in private giving and fan revenue.

 

[19MU88]

And much/most support that comes is from well beyond the boundaries of "the area"....

 

[MarshallManiac]

Which is why I never understood it when some nut job posts that our fans don't support the program. Good gracious, we are in the poorest area of any in CUSA and yet we are #1 in private giving and fan revenue.

In all fairness...it's CUSA...and not even the real CUSA...it's the new CUSA which is basically the Sun Belt which is just a few notches above the FCS

 

[herdit44]

In all fairness...it's CUSA...and not even the real CUSA...it's the new CUSA which is basically the Sun Belt which is just a few notches above the FCS

in fairness we're still soon to be the smallest public fbs institution in one of the smallest, poorest states in the union.

 

[TwolfHerdfan]

in fairness we're still soon to be the smallest public fbs institution in one of the smallest, poorest states in the union.

Very good point. I don't think many Marshall fans or alums realize we are one the smallest schools. The BG and school need to make that known and how giving helps us overcome that obstacle. We don't have 30K or more students to collect fees from. And state funding will continue to shrink.

 

[CarolinaHerdZilla22]

Very good point. I don't think many Marshall fans or alums realize we are one the smallest schools. The BG and school need to make that known and how giving helps us overcome that obstacle. We don't have 30K or more students to collect fees from. And state funding will continue to shrink.

I support our administration should set a goal to get Marshall's undergraduate enrollment to around 20K....offer Ohio, Ky, and Va high school school students within a radius of 100 miles to Huntington the same fees as a West Virginia resident receives. Our graduate school already attracts out of state students.

HerdZilla22

 

[herdit44]

I support our administration should set a goal to get Marshall's undergraduate enrollment to around 20K....offer Ohio, Ky, and Va high school school students within a radius of 100 miles to Huntington the same fees as a West Virginia resident receives. Our graduate school already attracts out of state students.

HerdZilla22

here's the thing, we lose money/break even on in-state students, so offering in-state tuition to a bunch more people doesn't really help us financially. we do offer a metro rate still, i believe, to many of the areas you mention (minus virginia).

 

[TwolfHerdfan]

At least with increased enrollment we get more funds from the additional student fees.

 

[herdit44]

At least with increased enrollment we get more funds from the additional student fees.

yeah, we'd see increased fees, but the tuition different would be almost $10,000 per student. it'd put us in a massive hole if suddenly a significant portion of our out-of-state students started paying $10,000 less per student.

it's a shame the situation we're in here in wv with the continuing cutting of higher ed spending coupled with the fact that the largest university in the state after a century plus of being given the lion's share of state dollars to build up the university is still entirely dependent on state dollars to stay afloat, which prevents marshall (and i think more importantly in this state the ctc system) from expanding.

 

[oldeherd]

MU needs to ramp up recruitment efforts big time and start targeting certain areas more. For instance, Virginia has a lot of high quality universities but some are very selective and the state has a pretty high in state tuition. Population of state is 8 million plus. MU needs to recruit more in Metro DC area and Northern Virginia. Huntington only about 6-7 hours away. Used to drive to DC area for years, often could make it to Beckley in around 5 hours and change. Other areas of Old Dominion, Roanoke, SW Virginia are even closer to Huntington- -Taking route 23 down through Kentucky gets you to Bristol-Kingsport, TN, and Johnson City area fairly quickly.

 

[19MU88]

in fairness we're still soon to be the smallest public fbs institution in one of the smallest, poorest states in the union.

That's a better way to look at it

 

[herdit44]

MU needs to ramp up recruitment efforts big time and start targeting certain areas more. For instance, Virginia has a lot of high quality universities but some are very selective and the state has a pretty high in state tuition. Population of state is 8 million plus. MU needs to recruit more in Metro DC area and Northern Virginia. Huntington only about 6-7 hours away. Used to drive to DC area for years, often could make it to Beckley in around 5 hours and change. Other areas of Old Dominion, Roanoke, SW Virginia are even closer to Huntington- -Taking route 23 down through Kentucky gets you to Bristol-Kingsport, TN, and Johnson City area fairly quickly.

i believe we have ramped up our recruiting efforts there (and other places), but unfortunately unlike once upon a time, out-of-state tuition at marshall these days really isn't very competitive vs in-state tuition in those states. christopher newport, george mason, james madison, longwood, vcu, odu, radford are all thousands of dollars cheaper per year in-state compared to marshall out-of-state.

 

[TwolfHerdfan]

So it seems there is no hope based on what I am reading. Lets just shut her down, join the MEAC and start playing State and Concord.

Relying on WV students to bolster enrollment is not a solid plan for the future. Less kids attending college and declining population. I applaud the stepped up recruitment efforts. They gotta come from somewhere.

Unless the Alumni Association has a massive increase in contact with our alumni, I don't see Marshall increasing revenue. Where will it come from?

 

[herdit44]

So it seems there is no hope based on what I am reading. Lets just shut her down, join the MEAC and start playing State and Concord.

Relying on WV students to bolster enrollment is not a solid plan for the future. Less kids attending college and declining population. I applaud the stepped up recruitment efforts. They gotta come from somewhere.

Unless the Alumni Association has a massive increase in contact with our alumni, I don't see Marshall increasing revenue. Where will it come from?

it's not no hope, it's realism. with the into program dr kopp brought to campus and the increased recruiting, advertising, etc we've recently done under dr gilbert outside of our normal areas, we're definitely taking our swings. both were aware that we couldn't survive on west virginia kids, that we needed out-of-state tuition revenues as the state continues to cut higher ed spending.

hopefully it'll pay off, but more and more kids entering college, and their families, are becoming aware that the costs of higher ed are spiraling out of control and job prospects when graduating college to pay off that debt aren't the best they've ever been to put it mildly.

if i lived in virginia and my kid got accepted to george mason or odu and marshall, i'd strongly push them to stay in state, the tuition difference alone at the end of 5 years would be more than $50,000. if i lived in kentucky, i'd strongly push them towards morehead, eastern, northern, etc. or if they were borderline getting into those schools push them towards a kctcs school with a 2 + 2 program with one of the 4 year schools in the state. that's the reality facing dr. gilbert and the leadership here.

 

[HerdFan73]

So it seems there is no hope based on what I am reading. Lets just shut her down, join the MEAC and start playing State and Concord.

Relying on WV students to bolster enrollment is not a solid plan for the future. Less kids attending college and declining population. I applaud the stepped up recruitment efforts. They gotta come from somewhere.

Unless the Alumni Association has a massive increase in contact with our alumni, I don't see Marshall increasing revenue. Where will it come from?

No one is saying give up. It's just the fact of the matter is that if these problems could be solved with answers from a well intentioned message board session, they probably would have been already.

As someone stated before, the INTO program is one area to illustrate the effort Marshall is making to increase enrollment dollars.

 

[TwolfHerdfan]

My daughter has been offered soccer scholarships to a few D3 private schools. The thing is those schools are 38K a year. They give liberal academic assistance but it's not close to covering 1/2 of the tuition. It's insane what some kids are coming out of college, owing high five figures in loans.
The cost of college is becoming beyond reach of many.

 

[herdit44]

My daughter has been offered soccer scholarships to a few D3 private schools. The thing is those schools are 38K a year. They give liberal academic assistance but it's not close to covering 1/2 of the tuition. It's insane what some kids are coming out of college, owing high five figures in loans.
The cost of college is becoming beyond reach of many.

you mean grants or finaid? d3 doesn't offer athletic scholarships.

my cousin was borderline d2/d3 football talent out of high school, looked at a couple d2 schools, but ultimately went to a d3 school, tuition alone is about $45,000 per year. it's just absolutely insane the cost of higher ed these days.

 

[TwolfHerdfan]

you mean grants or finaid? d3 doesn't offer athletic scholarships.

my cousin was borderline d2/d3 football talent out of high school, looked at a couple d2 schools, but ultimately went to a d3 school, tuition alone is about $45,000 per year. it's just absolutely insane the cost of higher ed these days.

Yes, grants and aid. Correct D3 doesn't provide scholarships but try to help with more aid, academic scholarships, etc.

 

[CarolinaHerdZilla22]

it's not no hope, it's realism. with the into program dr kopp brought to campus and the increased recruiting, advertising, etc we've recently done under dr gilbert outside of our normal areas, we're definitely taking our swings. both were aware that we couldn't survive on west virginia kids, that we needed out-of-state tuition revenues as the state continues to cut higher ed spending.

hopefully it'll pay off, but more and more kids entering college, and their families, are becoming aware that the costs of higher ed are spiraling out of control and job prospects when graduating college to pay off that debt aren't the best they've ever been to put it mildly.

if i lived in virginia and my kid got accepted to george mason or odu and marshall, i'd strongly push them to stay in state, the tuition difference alone at the end of 5 years would be more than $50,000. if i lived in kentucky, i'd strongly push them towards morehead, eastern, northern, etc. or if they were borderline getting into those schools push them towards a kctcs school with a 2 + 2 program with one of the 4 year schools in the state. that's the reality facing dr. gilbert and the leadership here.

I STILL SUPPORT.....If Marshall is to continue to grow...we must expand our student boundries to Va, Ohio, Kentucky, Pa and OFFER=== Same Tuition pricing to them. I know out of state students that decided to get a great education at MARSHALL and loved the time spent in Huntington. Our state's declining population will not support Marshall or any WV school for that matter.

A % of Something is better than NO % Of Nothing

Our Cinn,Ohio/Northern Ky Alumni Chapter stepped up and funded about 50--$8,000 scholarships for students living in those areas and OFFER same tuition as WV high school graduates. They (Chapter) had a VISION and refused to buckle under that same "old defeatists attitude" that some folks from our GREAT STATE still employ.

Marshall has a long history of talented graduates...and you might not believe this....MANY come from out of state to get educated.

HerdZilla22 (Gary Sweeney) from Charlotte & Mt. Hope, WV

 

[herdit44]

Yes, grants and aid. Correct D3 doesn't provide scholarships but try to help with more aid, academic scholarships, etc.

good luck to her, a lot of the d3 schools are incredible academic institutions!

 

[herdit44]

I STILL SUPPORT.....If Marshall is to continue to grow...we must expand our student boundries to Va, Ohio, Kentucky, Pa and OFFER=== Same Tuition pricing to them. I know out of state students that decided to get a great education at MARSHALL and loved the time spent in Huntington. Our state's declining population will not support Marshall or any WV school for that matter.

A % of Something is better than NO % Of Nothing

Our Cinn,Ohio/Northern Ky Alumni Chapter stepped up and funded about 50--$8,000 scholarships for students living in those areas and OFFER same tuition as WV high school graduates. They (Chapter) had a VISION and refused to buckle under that same "old defeatists attitude" that some folks from our GREAT STATE still employ.

Marshall has a long history of talented graduates...and you might not believe this....MANY come from out of state to get educated.

HerdZilla22 (Gary Sweeney) from Charlotte & Mt. Hope, WV

ok.

 

[herdit44]

this won't help our out of state recruitment efforts

 

[Surbadger]

this won't help our out of state recruitment efforts

View embedded media

You have to deal with what our "Governor" gives us.

 

[TwolfHerdfan]

That's gonna kill us and eliminate the "we're cheaper on tuition" selling point.

But hey, the state govt sucked at the coal severance tax teet for years and wasn't smart enough to diversify. Now that teet has gone dry and it's not coming back to where it once was.

 

[oldeherd]

i believe we have ramped up our recruiting efforts there (and other places), but unfortunately unlike once upon a time, out-of-state tuition at marshall these days really isn't very competitive vs in-state tuition in those states. christopher newport, george mason, james madison, longwood, vcu, odu, radford are all thousands of dollars cheaper per year in-state compared to marshall out-of-state.

May be true, but I know that some of those schools are pretty selective. E.g., JMU admits something over 4000 new students every year but has something like 22,000 applicants. Unlike WV, which has a very low percentage of college grads, Virginia, with about 8 million in population, has a lot more of its residents attending college. That's why schools like GMU and VCU are as large or larger, enrollment wise, than VA Tech and the "flagship", UVA.

As for our recent years tuition increases, well the same or greater increases certainly have NOT hurt WVU, which relies heavily on out of state students from OH, PA, NJ, MD, VA, etc. MU just has to keep striving to market itself better and more often in the surrounding TRI-State, as well as PA, MD, VA, and perhaps areas of NC. These states have what WV does not have, POPULATION, which means larger pools of potential students. Like the old fisherman use to say, you "can't land em unless you cast your line"!!

 

[herdit44]

May be true, but I know that some of those schools are pretty selective. E.g., JMU admits something over 4000 new students every year but has something like 22,000 applicants. Unlike WV, which has a very low percentage of college grads, Virginia, with about 8 million in population, has a lot more of its residents attending college. That's why schools like GMU and VCU are as large or larger, enrollment wise, than VA Tech and the "flagship", UVA.

As for our recent years tuition increases, well the same or greater increases certainly have NOT hurt WVU, which relies heavily on out of state students from OH, PA, NJ, MD, VA, etc. MU just has to keep striving to market itself better and more often in the surrounding TRI-State, as well as PA, MD, VA, and perhaps areas of NC. These states have what WV does not have, POPULATION, which means larger pools of potential students. Like the old fisherman use to say, you "can't land em unless you cast your line"!!

jmu is fairly selective, but not that selective. they have a ton of applications, but the majority of those end up going somewhere else anyway. either way, you don't get accepted to jmu you can apply to longwood (their entrance requirements are similar to marshall) and go to school for significantly less.

wvu does rely heavily on out of state students, but their out of state enrollment has been stuck right around 12,000 since 2010. there are many factors as to why, but partially is that wvu for the longest time was a cheaper alternative to in-state schools in the states you mentioned. that's just no longer the case. out of state tuition this year was $22,488 and that's just going to go up even more with the fy18 budget cuts to higher ed.

i get your points, i really do and i'm really glad that we're pushing into those areas more, but the reality of the situation is while yes we will probably snag some students we wouldn't have otherwise, it's a hard sell to convince a kid and his family to pay $30,000/year to come to marshall.

 

[CarolinaHerdZilla22]

May be true, but I know that some of those schools are pretty selective. E.g., JMU admits something over 4000 new students every year but has something like 22,000 applicants. Unlike WV, which has a very low percentage of college grads, Virginia, with about 8 million in population, has a lot more of its residents attending college. That's why schools like GMU and VCU are as large or larger, enrollment wise, than VA Tech and the "flagship", UVA.

As for our recent years tuition increases, well the same or greater increases certainly have NOT hurt WVU, which relies heavily on out of state students from OH, PA, NJ, MD, VA, etc. MU just has to keep striving to market itself better and more often in the surrounding TRI-State, as well as PA, MD, VA, and perhaps areas of NC. These states have what WV does not have, POPULATION, which means larger pools of potential students. Like the old fisherman use to say, you "can't land em unless you cast your line"!!

Well stated oldeherd....why is it that "old geasers" like us have our acts together & exhibit WORDS of WISDOM? I hope we did not show negative comments (thoughts) when we were young Pups.

We have to continue to "pound the POSITIVE drum" to some fellow West Virginians that alway look at life on the dark side. Being Negative never got anyone anywhere...."can't LAND em---less we cast our lines."

HerdZilla22 In Charlotte...........................GONE FISHIN

 

[The Real SamC]

Sorry guys, but no. Leaving out commuters in the immediate tri-state area, people looking to one our unique national level programs (HELP, forensic science), and people with some relationship to the university or the area (children of people who left WV/tri-state due to the economy) why would anybody attend MU over a similar school in their own state. MU is a great college, but there is an equivalent college in any other state.

I get WVU's unique business plan. NY's public colleges do not have "big time sports" (sorry Buffalo) and most of the other states in its marketing area have a version of the "California Master Plan" where only the best and brightest get into the big time schools with the big time athletics and the big time college town life and others are told to look elsewhere (Slippery Rock, Montclair State, Longwood, Frostburg State, so on). And here is WVU, with vastly lower admissions standards, deeply subsidized tuition (ofter lower than in-state where these yankees came from) and some semblance of big time sports and, certainly, cupcake academics and plenty of beer. I get it.

I get WVS "U" (sic) 's business plan, which is common in the upper south. Three generations ago, the smartest thing for a black person in the south to do was GTFO of the south. So lots of black people got degrees at State and took their credentials and used them for a better life, often in suburban DC. Now they send middle class and upper middle class suburban black kids "home" to a place they have never been for college. I get it.

Neither of those situations apply to Marshall. We do not not really have a potential pool of people out there where we have anything to offer over whatever they have in their own state. Put another way, say a kid lives in NC. Never really heard of WV other than knowing the 50 states from grade school social studies. Solid kid, but not spectacular. He (or more commonly she) can attend any of NC's fine second tier colleges (Appy, UNCC, UNCG, ECU, so on) for about $6 to 7K. Why would they pay triple (or even double or, for that matter $5 more) to go to MU? I don't think anybody can answer that question without playing the "I love Marshall" card, with is not a real argument.

So, where is the pool to grow Marshall? We are looking at it every day. This state, one, has way too many colleges. We need to close many. Two generations ago, travel more than two or three counties from home was unrealistic. The interstates and corridors changed that. There is nobody that cannot get to either or both MU and WVU in three hours today. We need to close some colleges.

This state, two, has way too few people going to college. We need to get more and more people into college from this state's HS graduates every year.

But, yes, there is a marketing element here. What does MU off an 18 to 25 years old that WVU or the state colleges do not?

- The culture at MU is a WV cultue. You, even if you are from some of the more backward parts of the state, will be respected and treated as a person. At WVU you will be laughed at by the majority NJ culture. Students at WVU fall into two catagories. Those from the northeast national majority culture, who the faculty wants to teach, and those from Appalachia, who the faculty has to teach. It is different.

- MU is hard. Our degrees mean something. They have respect nationally, and if you have an MU degree in X, by gum, you have a mastery of X that you just DO NOT GET at the state colleges You will do well in life becasue you will have been challenged.

- The welcoming nature of the people of Huntington to the dorm students is not found at WVU, nor at most places in any state. 99% of people in Huntington are good people and, mom and day, we will watch out for your kid in the big city (and, to most WVians, this is a big city).

- MU is a sober place. Is there drinking? Duh. Is there sex, drugs and rock and roll? Duh. But this is not WVU, where the self-selected student body is there, pretty much ONLY, for that. This is a serious place for serious people.

- MU provides a good lifestyle. WV Tech failed because, duh, no rational person wants to spend 4 years in Montgomery. You can say the same about lots of other places in WV. Huntington is fun. We have stuff (especially contrasted to most anyplace outside the I-64 corridor). MU has solid sports (not DII nothingness as at the state colleges). MU has the artists series, other cultural stuff, political speakers, serious events. Its fun.

- You can graduate in 4 years. And, if you need a job, you can find one. At a lot of the state college, the funding has grown so low that required coursework is not offered such that you can actually graduate in 4 years, and a lot of our state colleges are in job free counties.

The growth for Marshall is in serving WV, not immitating WVU.

 

[TwolfHerdfan]

Marshall's primary focus should be in WV but that is becoming a shrinking market. We need to be more aggressive within a 2 hour drive of Huntington and hope between the WV focus and the 2 hour radius - to gradually grow enrollment.

Adding programs to the engineering dept. and contining growth in the PT and pharmacy schools should help.

 

[jocktalker]

The State of West Virginia has one of the lowest post secondary school educational levels in the country. We do a pretty good job of graduating high school students (or just handing them diplomas and telling them to move on) but very few graduates who look at continuing their education at either a community college or a four-year degree institution.

Sadly, it is partially a cultural problem. Aside from the considerable expense to attend college, many West Virginia parents never went to college themselves and either fear their children will become better educated than them or they just don't understand the limitations they put on their children to broaden their skill set to compete in the 21st century.

People often bitch about not diversifying the West Virginia economy but frankly, finding a qualified workforce in West Virginia is becoming increasingly more difficult. Education requirements to dig coal is a lot different than going to work in the manufacturing industry. Especially if a prospective employee needs to pass a drug test first.

 

[TwolfHerdfan]

The State of West Virginia has one of the lowest post secondary school educational levels in the country. We do a pretty good job of graduating high school students (or just handing them diplomas and telling them to move on) but very few graduates who look at continuing their education at either a community college or a four-year degree institution.

Sadly, it is partially a cultural problem. Aside from the considerable expense to attend college, many West Virginia parents never went to college themselves and either fear their children will become better educated than them or they just don't understand the limitations they put on their children to broaden their skill set to compete in the 21st century.

People often bitch about not diversifying the West Virginia economy but frankly, finding a qualified workforce in West Virginia is becoming increasingly more difficult. Education requirements to dig coal is a lot different than going to work in the manufacturing industry. Especially if a prospective employee needs to pass a drug test first.

Very well said. WV residents don't value education in general and many parents use school as a baby sitting service.
The time to diversify and have vision was 40-50 years ago unfortunately.

 

[Y.A.G Si Ye Nots]

- MU is hard. Our degrees mean something. They have respect nationally, and if you have an MU degree in X, by gum, you have a mastery of X that you just DO NOT GET at the state colleges You will do well in life becasue you will have been challenged

Oh, stop it. Marshall is, at best, an average four year college. Earning a Marshall degree is not "hard" compared to other four year schools. Look at the acceptance rate at Marshall. Marshall grants admission to absolute morons as long as they can pay their tuition. Claiming that Marshall degrees have respect nationally is comically bad. They have no more merit REGIONALLY than just about any other four year degree in the area, let alone being respected nationally.

Marshall is not nearly as selective, hard, or respected as numerous schools in the SUNY system or most other state schools outside of the WV border. You don't live in reality if you think most employers give a shit if you have a Marshall degree, a Shepherd degree, or a Fairmont State degree. Unless you are in a very specialized program that a school excels in (which is a small minority of students earning degrees), an employer puts a lot more emphasis on interviews, personal connections, and general likability than they do on if your degree in communications is from Marshall, Shepherd, or Fairmont State.

- The welcoming nature of the people of Huntington to the dorm students is not found at WVU, nor at most places in any state. 99% of people in Huntington are good people and, mom and day, we will watch out for your kid in the big city (and, to most WVians, this is a big city).

Your bias for Marshall is showing a little too much.

 

[pdbailey]

People often bitch about not diversifying the West Virginia economy but frankly, finding a qualified workforce in West Virginia is becoming increasingly more difficult. Education requirements to dig coal is a lot different than going to work in the manufacturing industry. Especially if a prospective employee needs to pass a drug test first.

that's why I said we need to bring in low-skill manufacturing jobs to put the unemployed back to work. We need to take those jobs back that were stolen by Mexico and China through Bill "Cliton's" moronic trade deals. It won't be easy but a move to reduce the corporate tax rates federally and in-state could give WV a competitive start, plus reducing the number of people on unemployment or welfare will reduce the state's cost while increasing tax revenue.

 

[old buzzard]

People often bitch about not diversifying the West Virginia economy but frankly, finding a qualified workforce in West Virginia is becoming increasingly more difficult. Education requirements to dig coal is a lot different than going to work in the manufacturing industry. Especially if a prospective employee needs to pass a drug test first.

I take exception to you implying that coal miners aren't capable of working in the manufacturing industry. You make it sound that miners still use dynamite, picks and shovels which is not true. I know that having worked 40 plus years in the mines.

The mining equipment is all computer controlled, by the same systems that are used in manufacturing. PLC's control most everything underground and the people that install them, program them, and maintain them are all lumped into the same sterotype of being "coal diggers" by a public that has absolutely no knowledge of what goes on in a modern coal mine.

I worked alongside people with teaching degrees, mining engineers, electrical engineers, computer engineers, mechanical engineers, all of us underground. In my time I became a certified mine foreman, trained in ventilation measures to prevent an explosive atmosphere. I also was a Certified diesel mechanic, a Certified Electrician with qualifications to work on systems running on as much as 38,000 volts. I learned to program PLC's and troubleshoot and correct problems with those systems. I had to learn to read electrical schematics and wiring diagrams and learn ladder logic. I was also trained in hydraulic systems operating on nearly 5000 PSI and learned to read hydraulic diagrams and the symbols used on them. I could recognize a problem, look at the print and find the culprit causing it and then replace the problem part. And I wasn't the only one with those qualifications. There were hundreds just like me, at just one coal mine. That scenario plays out all across coal country.

To suggest that WV doesn't have people smart enough to work in manufacturing is just plain wrong. Many of the same skill sets used in the mines can be easily transferred into manufacturing, as the same electrical and hydraulic theory is used in both.

As for passing a drug test, it's a state law that every coal miner in WV is regularly submitted to drug testing. Fail the piss test and the state takes away your right to work in the mines - for life.

We've got a capable workforce (ask Toyota and the FBI) , we just need the infrastructure and the proper incentives to lure businesses in. That's up to our elected officials to make happen, and so far they have proven themselves as being the ones not up to the task.

 

[jocktalker]

I take exception to you implying that coal miners aren't capable of working in the manufacturing industry. You make it sound that miners still use dynamite, picks and shovels which is not true. I know that having worked 40 plus years in the mines.

The mining equipment is all computer controlled, by the same systems that are used in manufacturing. PLC's control most everything underground and the people that install them, program them, and maintain them are all lumped into the same sterotype of being "coal diggers" by a public that has absolutely no knowledge of what goes on in a modern coal mine.

I worked alongside people with teaching degrees, mining engineers, electrical engineers, computer engineers, mechanical engineers, all of us underground. In my time I became a certified mine foreman, trained in ventilation measures to prevent an explosive atmosphere. I also was a Certified diesel mechanic, a Certified Electrician with qualifications to work on systems running on as much as 38,000 volts. I learned to program PLC's and troubleshoot and correct problems with those systems. I had to learn to read electrical schematics and wiring diagrams and learn ladder logic. I was also trained in hydraulic systems operating on nearly 5000 PSI and learned to read hydraulic diagrams and the symbols used on them. I could recognize a problem, look at the print and find the culprit causing it and then replace the problem part. And I wasn't the only one with those qualifications. There were hundreds just like me, at just one coal mine. That scenario plays out all across coal country.

To suggest that WV doesn't have people smart enough to work in manufacturing is just plain wrong. Many of the same skill sets used in the mines can be easily transferred into manufacturing, as the same electrical and hydraulic theory is used in both.

As for passing a drug test, it's a state law that every coal miner in WV is regularly submitted to drug testing. Fail the piss test and the state takes away your right to work in the mines - for life.

We've got a capable workforce (ask Toyota and the FBI) , we just need the infrastructure and the proper incentives to lure businesses in. That's up to our elected officials to make happen, and so far they have proven themselves as being the ones not up to the task.

Great response. I certainly didn't want to infer that coal miners weren't capable of working in other manufacturing sectors but merely stated that the skill set was different. As you correctly pointed out, the automation of the mines has helped provide skills that are easily transferable to other manufacturing sectors. Please accept my apology if you were offended. That was not my intention.

 

[jocktalker]

Sorry guys, but no. Leaving out commuters in the immediate tri-state area, people looking to one our unique national level programs (HELP, forensic science), and people with some relationship to the university or the area (children of people who left WV/tri-state due to the economy) why would anybody attend MU over a similar school in their own state. MU is a great college, but there is an equivalent college in any other state.

I get WVU's unique business plan. NY's public colleges do not have "big time sports" (sorry Buffalo) and most of the other states in its marketing area have a version of the "California Master Plan" where only the best and brightest get into the big time schools with the big time athletics and the big time college town life and others are told to look elsewhere (Slippery Rock, Montclair State, Longwood, Frostburg State, so on). And here is WVU, with vastly lower admissions standards, deeply subsidized tuition (ofter lower than in-state where these yankees came from) and some semblance of big time sports and, certainly, cupcake academics and plenty of beer. I get it.

I get WVS "U" (sic) 's business plan, which is common in the upper south. Three generations ago, the smartest thing for a black person in the south to do was GTFO of the south. So lots of black people got degrees at State and took their credentials and used them for a better life, often in suburban DC. Now they send middle class and upper middle class suburban black kids "home" to a place they have never been for college. I get it.

Neither of those situations apply to Marshall. We do not not really have a potential pool of people out there where we have anything to offer over whatever they have in their own state. Put another way, say a kid lives in NC. Never really heard of WV other than knowing the 50 states from grade school social studies. Solid kid, but not spectacular. He (or more commonly she) can attend any of NC's fine second tier colleges (Appy, UNCC, UNCG, ECU, so on) for about $6 to 7K. Why would they pay triple (or even double or, for that matter $5 more) to go to MU? I don't think anybody can answer that question without playing the "I love Marshall" card, with is not a real argument.

So, where is the pool to grow Marshall? We are looking at it every day. This state, one, has way too many colleges. We need to close many. Two generations ago, travel more than two or three counties from home was unrealistic. The interstates and corridors changed that. There is nobody that cannot get to either or both MU and WVU in three hours today. We need to close some colleges.

This state, two, has way too few people going to college. We need to get more and more people into college from this state's HS graduates every year.

But, yes, there is a marketing element here. What does MU off an 18 to 25 years old that WVU or the state colleges do not?

- The culture at MU is a WV cultue. You, even if you are from some of the more backward parts of the state, will be respected and treated as a person. At WVU you will be laughed at by the majority NJ culture. Students at WVU fall into two catagories. Those from the northeast national majority culture, who the faculty wants to teach, and those from Appalachia, who the faculty has to teach. It is different.

- MU is hard. Our degrees mean something. They have respect nationally, and if you have an MU degree in X, by gum, you have a mastery of X that you just DO NOT GET at the state colleges You will do well in life becasue you will have been challenged.

- The welcoming nature of the people of Huntington to the dorm students is not found at WVU, nor at most places in any state. 99% of people in Huntington are good people and, mom and day, we will watch out for your kid in the big city (and, to most WVians, this is a big city).

- MU is a sober place. Is there drinking? Duh. Is there sex, drugs and rock and roll? Duh. But this is not WVU, where the self-selected student body is there, pretty much ONLY, for that. This is a serious place for serious people.

- MU provides a good lifestyle. WV Tech failed because, duh, no rational person wants to spend 4 years in Montgomery. You can say the same about lots of other places in WV. Huntington is fun. We have stuff (especially contrasted to most anyplace outside the I-64 corridor). MU has solid sports (not DII nothingness as at the state colleges). MU has the artists series, other cultural stuff, political speakers, serious events. Its fun.

- You can graduate in 4 years. And, if you need a job, you can find one. At a lot of the state college, the funding has grown so low that required coursework is not offered such that you can actually graduate in 4 years, and a lot of our state colleges are in job free counties.

The growth for Marshall is in serving WV, not immitating WVU.

I agree with two of your points. A Marshall degree means something to Marshall graduates. I believe that Marshall offers a well-rounded education and has some specialty areas where it excels among peer institutions. But let's not kid ourselves. A Marshall degree is not a nationally well known or respected more than almost any other four-year degree granting school.

I also agree that more West Virginia high school students need to pursue addition post secondary education degrees.

The rest of your comments are just repetitive rants against WVU and incorrect "facts" about subsidizing out-of-state students, IMO.

 

[old buzzard]

Great response. I certainly didn't want to infer that coal miners weren't capable of working in other manufacturing sectors but merely stated that the skill set was different. As you correctly pointed out, the automation of the mines has helped provide skills that are easily transferable to other manufacturing sectors. Please accept my apology if you were offended. That was not my intention.

No apology is needed. My response was not only in defense of coal miners, but more so in defense of the average work force in WV. I mentioned coal miners because that's my my field of experience. WV'ians are just as capable of filling any type of job as people in any part of the country, we just need our politicians to make the changes to bring industry in. Bring the jobs and our people will gain the necessary skill sets to fill them.