What is Marshall's Problem?

[riflearm2]

A few years ago, I called out Marshall's marketing agency for blatantly stealing and/or reusing identical videos for Marshall football that had been used at other programs years earlier. Well, here we are again, but this theft seems to have been done within Marshall's program instead of with their marketing agency

The first picture was created by Syracuse's creative team last year. The second picture was recently posted by Marshall's staff, which clearly, is entirely stolen. This is both morally and legally wrong. It's copyright infringement. Not only did Marshall not go to the original creator and ask permission, but worse, they actually wrote Huff's signature on it, removed the original creator's signature from it, and covered it with the Marshall logos.

I've had two pieces of creative work "stolen" from me. One was a guy who got ahold of some tracks, passed them off as his own, and charged people significant thousands of dollars for them. I sued, and he agreed to settle and pay before it became public record. He also was scared of criminal charges related to what he did to the people who paid for the stolen material. In the other instance, Rick Ross, whom I had done many records for, had two of my tracks "leaked." He claimed they were stolen from him and then leaked online, greatly diminishing the money I could make on them, just so he could keep a buzz going with new music before his album dropped. I'm sure his camp leaked them on purpose.

Stealing creative work is the same as walking onto a person's property and stealing what they have on their front porch. Stop fvcking doing it, and get some morals.

Marshall's football program has a Director of Creative Design: Braden Short. I don't know if this was his doing. If so, it's a fireable offense. This is the sh!t that makes Marshall a second-rate program.

 

[GreenBison]

That's some really crappy artwork. Maybe the guy that did the original is too embarrassed to admit it is his work LOL.

 

[muthed]

There are no new ideas. Concepts are copied, reworked, and the public is led to believe they are the copier's original idea.

 

[riflearm2]

There are no new ideas. Concepts are copied, reworked, and the public is led to believe they are the copier's original idea.

There's a huge difference both morally and legally between being influenced by something or having a similar idea as somebody compared with blatantly ripping off and copying something. This is an example of the latter and trying to justify it is moronic.

 

[greengeezer]

When I was still working, I created a podcast that rose to number sixty-six on Apple iTunes list of most downloaded podcasts. It was a great source of pride for me that my creation was gathering international attention.
My supervisor made up some lame excuse about me using too much bandwidth and ordered me to remove the podcast from the county server.
I later learned she attended a regional technology conference where she passed off my work as her own. She even bragged to the attendees that HER work was an example of what innovative technology could accomplish in the area of interactive learning.

 

[mlblack16.]

I've seen that artwork a lot lately on Twitter. Is that the thing now, for recruits who have received an offer to RT or they all find it cool enough to share?

Also, I expect to see one of our "woe is me" supafans to show up soon with the "we are lucky to even have a marketing team, cuz we ain't go no money..."

 

[johns1124]

Embarrassing.

Unless, there is some sort of "Network Visuals", that are out there we don't know about.

 

[TwolfHerdfan]

Marshall and marketing don't go together. Marshall and innovative ideas? That's unheard of.

 

[sluggo72]

why do I think this is some sort of template you buy and modify it to your school? You cant use the NFL logo on anything without their permission. So I think somebody went to them, but a license and started selling this idea to various schools.
Besides isnt IMG in charge of most if not all of the marketing for MU?

 

[johns1124]

When I was still working, I created a podcast

Damn, I didn't know they had podcasts in the 70's and 80's.

 

[riflearm2]

I've seen that artwork a lot lately on Twitter. Is that the thing now, for recruits who have received an offer to RT or they all find it cool enough to share?

It's been like that for a long time. Recruits retweet each other's offers to congratulate them and expect the same in return. When Marshall steals work from other schools, it exposes the copycat scheme.

why do I think this is some sort of template you buy and modify it to your school?

The same reason you think a lot of other incorrect things: because you're a moron.

So I think somebody went to them, but a license and started selling this idea to various schools.

*bought

Yeah, that's not the case.

Syracuse knows about it now. Their Director of Recruiting is tweeting to Huff and other Marshall athletic twitter accounts to make sure the two Syracuse employees who created it a year ago are paid by Marshall and using hashtags like "#smh." Their creative media guy, one of two who worked on that graphic, is tweeting about it. Their football recruiting artist, the other guy who created it, is also tweeting about it.

Besides isnt IMG in charge of most if not all of the marketing for MU?

Almost all FBS and many FCS programs have a graphic designer on staff. Most of them are hired as assistant recruiting positions with their primary qualification being significant experience in graphic design. This type of recruiting graphic is the perfect reason why they are so in demand in football programs. A school's multimedia rights/trademark licensing company (Learfield-IMG) has absolutely nothing to do with these types of things.

Marshall has an employee in the football department whose primary job is to do this type of thing (create graphics, mainly for recruiting purposes). To resort to stealing the work of others from another school that created it a year ago is morally wrong, legally wrong, embarrassing, worthy of being mocked relentlessly, and is a fireable offense by whomever pushed it for Marshall to use and then swap out the signatures.

As a Twitter user mocked, Marshall even replaced the nice wood hangers with the cheap plastic ones. At least we were accurate with the theft.

 

[GreenBison]

"Almost all FBS and many FCS programs have a graphic designer on staff. Most of them are hired as assistant recruiting positions with their primary qualification being significant experience in graphic design. "

The original graphic is Middle School level at best. They did not have "Significant Experience in Graphic Design." This is unpaid intern work, probably from someone from the Journalism department.

 

[Jbabbington]

Have we done this before? Because they're straight giving it to us... for good reason. I honestly wouldn’t be surprised if Huff didn’t even know about this. From where he’s come from, he might have just assumed we had the artists on staff capable of putting out this type of work. Might end up being just another task added to the list of stuff he wants to see changed here. I could be wrong, just my opinion.

 

[johns1124]

Dam, that's rough.

Hope they rectify this quickly.

Fvcked up part, it's not even a great graphic. Taking so much heat. Herd's media dept, must suck to say the least. Of all the graphics to pick up, they decide to plagiarize this one.

 

[greengeezer]

Damn, I didn't know they had podcasts in the 70's and 80's.

The podcasts were created in the 90s, ignorant one.

 

[johns1124]

The podcasts were created in the 90s, ignorant one.

Reel to Reel doesn't count as podcasts.

 

[riflearm2]

The original graphic is Middle School level at best. They did not have "Significant Experience in Graphic Design." This is unpaid intern work, probably from someone from the Journalism department.

It's exactly what the target audience wants. These graphics are sent out to high school recruits. That graphic is in line with what all of the other major programs put out. The "middle school level at best" designer behind it also does graphics for Bleacher Report. They aren't using a "middle school at best" designer. The other designer on it was promoted by ESPN.com as producing one of the four best graphics for NSD in the country with his comic book collection. Again, you have to know your audience when producing creative works.

This is the first designer's recent portfolio:

This is the second designer's recent portfolio including part of the project that earned recognition from ESPN:

 

[Chris McLaughlin]

This is clearly wrong and super embarrassing but does anyone else think Syracuse's RD is coming off like a complete ass in that thread? Tweeting directly at Coach Huff? Pretty unprofessional. Hope that dude has plan for 2022 because Dino Babers probably won't be SU's HC much longer.

 

[sluggo72]

It's been like that for a long time. Recruits retweet each other's offers to congratulate them and expect the same in return. When Marshall steals work from other schools, it exposes the copycat scheme.


The same reason you think a lot of other incorrect things: because you're a moron.



*bought

Yeah, that's not the case.

Syracuse knows about it now. Their Director of Recruiting is tweeting to Huff and other Marshall athletic twitter accounts to make sure the two Syracuse employees who created it a year ago are paid by Marshall and using hashtags like "#smh." Their creative media guy, one of two who worked on that graphic, is tweeting about it. Their football recruiting artist, the other guy who created it, is also tweeting about it.



Almost all FBS and many FCS programs have a graphic designer on staff. Most of them are hired as assistant recruiting positions with their primary qualification being significant experience in graphic design. This type of recruiting graphic is the perfect reason why they are so in demand in football programs. A school's multimedia rights/trademark licensing company (Learfield-IMG) has absolutely nothing to do with these types of things.

Marshall has an employee in the football department whose primary job is to do this type of thing (create graphics, mainly for recruiting purposes). To resort to stealing the work of others from another school that created it a year ago is morally wrong, legally wrong, embarrassing, worthy of being mocked relentlessly, and is a fireable offense by whomever pushed it for Marshall to use and then swap out the signatures.

As a Twitter user mocked, Marshall even replaced the nice wood hangers with the cheap plastic ones. At least we were accurate with the theft.

I wonder how much Syracuse paid the NFL for the use of their logos?

 

[GreenBison]

You're confusing Graphic Design with Illustration. He can manipulate photos and add Typography to photoshop documents. He's not an Illustrator which the original image is a illustration, not Graphic Design. And as for knowing your audience that's not how it works. I've been in the Design and Illustration business since the early 90's. You don't dumb down your work to appeal to a younger audience, they are capable of relating to good design and illustration.

 

[riflearm2]

You're confusing Graphic Design with Illustration. He can manipulate photos and add Typography to photoshop documents. He's not an Illustrator which the original image is a illustration, not Graphic Design. And as for knowing your audience that's not how it works. I've been in the Design and Illustration business since the early 90's. You don't dumb down your work to appeal to a younger audience, they are capable of relating to good design and illustration.

Their other work shows graphic design and not just illustration, thus the reason for showing their recent portfolio. It's not a case about dumbing anything down for a young audience. It's about being successful with what the goal is for your audience compared with the time it takes to develop.

If they have 80 of these images to produce, they are going to find the most efficient way to do them while still accomplishing their goal (providing recruits with something they can retweet that excites them that is at the same caliber as their competitors are producing).

 

[riflearm2]

This is clearly wrong and super embarrassing but does anyone else think Syracuse's RD is coming off like a complete ass in that thread? Tweeting directly at Coach Huff? Pretty unprofessional.

His program invested their time, money, and talent into producing something. Marshall stole it without compensating them for any of it. Just as important, Marshall would be using the stolen work to compete with recruits. And Marshall went out of its way to remove the signature of the original creator and put their logo and signature over it.

Could their recruiting director have emailed Huff or a Marshall athletics administrator? Sure. But what does that accomplish? The damage had already been done. Marshall has already "profited" (gained something of value) by getting these recruiting images in the hands of their recruits. Getting Marshall to simply stop using the graphic not only doesn't help Syracuse, but it also doesn't hurt Marshall. Mocking Marshall publicly so that recruits see it does, somewhat, balance out that unfairness.

 

[herdfan429]

It's been like that for a long time. Recruits retweet each other's offers to congratulate them and expect the same in return. When Marshall steals work from other schools, it exposes the copycat scheme.


The same reason you think a lot of other incorrect things: because you're a moron.



*bought

Yeah, that's not the case.

Syracuse knows about it now. Their Director of Recruiting is tweeting to Huff and other Marshall athletic twitter accounts to make sure the two Syracuse employees who created it a year ago are paid by Marshall and using hashtags like "#smh." Their creative media guy, one of two who worked on that graphic, is tweeting about it. Their football recruiting artist, the other guy who created it, is also tweeting about it.



Almost all FBS and many FCS programs have a graphic designer on staff. Most of them are hired as assistant recruiting positions with their primary qualification being significant experience in graphic design. This type of recruiting graphic is the perfect reason why they are so in demand in football programs. A school's multimedia rights/trademark licensing company (Learfield-IMG) has absolutely nothing to do with these types of things.

Marshall has an employee in the football department whose primary job is to do this type of thing (create graphics, mainly for recruiting purposes). To resort to stealing the work of others from another school that created it a year ago is morally wrong, legally wrong, embarrassing, worthy of being mocked relentlessly, and is a fireable offense by whomever pushed it for Marshall to use and then swap out the signatures.

As a Twitter user mocked, Marshall even replaced the nice wood hangers with the cheap plastic ones. At least we were accurate with the theft.

Why not be adults and go through proper channels instead of Twitter.

 

[riflearm2]

Why not be adults and go through proper channels instead of Twitter.

Didn't I just go over this? Let me dumb it down for you:

1) Assume they "go through proper channels." What happens then? Marshall sends an email saying "sorry" and that they won't use that graphic in the future.
2) In the meantime, Marshall already gained something by using that graphic in recruiting.
3) In the meantime, Syracuse already lost something by wasting their time, money, and talent on something that another school now has used.

Are you familiar with "restorative justice." Syracuse, by publicly mocking Marshall, is using restorative justice. Hoping that the same recruits Marshall earned points with by using the stolen graphic, Syracuse will punish Marshall and hopefully gain points from those recruits.

Let me dumb this down again:

Pretend I stole money from your house. I spent the money. You caught me doing it. Now, would an "I'm sorry" suffice or would you want 1) your money back (in this case, hoping recruits realize that the work was actually Syracuse's and that Marshall stole it) 2) me punished for stealing your money in hopes that I don't do it again and/or some sort of punitive action (making sure Marshall doesn't earn any recruiting advantage from their theft)?

Let me dumb it down again:

Pretend Syracuse was playing Marshall and put a bug in our headsets to listen to our play calls. Would an "I'm sorry" suffice and let the public not know or would you want to make sure everyone knew that they had a huge advantage?

 

[johns1124]

It's an easy one to rectify.

Just say you had a Mass Media GA get a little overzealous and be done with it.

The person who tweeted it didn't know it was blatantly copied. It will be over.

 

[herdfan429]

Didn't I just go over this? Let me dumb it down for you:

1) Assume they "go through proper channels." What happens then? Marshall sends an email saying "sorry" and that they won't use that graphic in the future.
2) In the meantime, Marshall already gained something by using that graphic in recruiting.
3) In the meantime, Syracuse already lost something by wasting their time, money, and talent on something that another school now has used.

Are you familiar with "restorative justice." Syracuse, by publicly mocking Marshall, is using restorative justice. Hoping that the same recruits Marshall earned points with by using the stolen graphic, Syracuse will punish Marshall and hopefully gain points from those recruits.

Let me dumb this down again:

Pretend I stole money from your house. I spent the money. You caught me doing it. Now, would an "I'm sorry" suffice or would you want 1) your money back (in this case, hoping recruits realize that the work was actually Syracuse's and that Marshall stole it) 2) me punished for stealing your money in hopes that I don't do it again and/or some sort of punitive action (making sure Marshall doesn't earn any recruiting advantage from their theft)?

Let me dumb it down again:

Pretend Syracuse was playing Marshall and put a bug in our headsets to listen to our play calls. Would an "I'm sorry" suffice and let the public not know or would you want to make sure everyone knew that they had a huge advantage?

If it’s copyrighted then pursue legal channels. Marshall fvcked up we get that. But seriously that image isn’t going to sway recruits one way or another, unless they were 6 or mentally handicapped. Force Marshall into a lawsuit win cash public apology etc

 

[riflearm2]

If it’s copyrighted then pursue legal channels. Marshall fvcked up we get that. But seriously that image isn’t going to sway recruits one way or another, unless they were 6 or mentally handicapped. Force Marshall into a lawsuit win cash public apology etc

Do you think before you post? You first said that Syracuse should be more professional and not mock Marshall on Twitter. I point out how doing that results in no punishment for Marshall and no gain for Syracuse. Now, you're saying that they should litigate against Marshall to get money and a public apology.

What do you think Marshall would rather have - another school mock it on Twitter or have to pay an attorney, the cash from the suit, and apologize?

Syracuse is doing Marshall a favor by not doing more than just mocking on Twitter.

 

[Chris McLaughlin]

His program invested their time, money, and talent into producing something. Marshall stole it without compensating them for any of it. Just as important, Marshall would be using the stolen work to compete with recruits. And Marshall went out of its way to remove the signature of the original creator and put their logo and signature over it.

Could their recruiting director have emailed Huff or a Marshall athletics administrator? Sure. But what does that accomplish? The damage had already been done. Marshall has already "profited" (gained something of value) by getting these recruiting images in the hands of their recruits. Getting Marshall to simply stop using the graphic not only doesn't help Syracuse, but it also doesn't hurt Marshall. Mocking Marshall publicly so that recruits see it does, somewhat, balance out that unfairness.

Sorry man I just don't agree. I understand where you're coming from but I believe in being professional and taking the high road whenever possible.

The tweet from the guy who actually made the graphic was appropriate. The RD tweeting Huff directly and following it up with the Control Copy/Paste gif is something I’d expect from a teenager.

 

[riflearm2]

Sorry man I just don't agree. I understand where you're coming from but I believe in being professional and taking the high road whenever possible.

The tweet from the guy who actually made the graphic was appropriate. The RD tweeting Huff directly and following it up with the Control Copy/Paste gif is something I’d expect from a teenager.

So how do you think Syracuse should have handled it?

 

[MichiganHerd]

One has to wonder how it would have been handled, had the shoe been on the other foot.

Methinks WV rednecks would have had a field day embarrassing the Orange. I don't even know anybody from WV that would have done anything differently, other than use a little more foul language within their tweet, along with some bad grammar and misspelled words.

 

[greengeezer]

I wish some other school would steal our “thunderclap” and refuse to ever give it back.

 

[riflearm2]

One has to wonder how it would have been handled, had the shoe been on the other foot.

Methinks WV rednecks would have had a field day embarrassing the Orange. I don't even know anybody from WV that would have done anything differently, other than use a little more foul language within their tweet, along with some bad grammar and misspelled words.

Agreed.

I just don't understand the "keep it professional and go through the proper channels." What does that mean - have Babers or an athletic department official reach out to Huff or a Marshall official privately? What does that do? At best, it leads to Marshall saying "oh, sorry, we won't do it again."

Bullshit. Syracuse has already been harmed/damaged from this and Marshall has gained from it. Why wouldn't every single school rip off every other school if the total punishment consisted of privately being asked not to in the future?

Somebody at Marshall, almost assuredly within the football program, purposely stole from Syracuse. Mocking them is not only perfectly acceptable but is also doing Marshall a favor instead of litigating.

 

[johns1124]

So how do you think Syracuse should have handled it?

I don't think there is much punitive damage to be had. No loss of revenue. Who knows maybe Huff and 'Cuse RC know each other and he is giving Huff a hard time.

One way of poking at Coach he is doing an amateurish job.

 

[MichiganHerd]

Agreed.

I just don't understand the "keep it professional and go through the proper channels." What does that mean - have Babers or an athletic department official reach out to Huff or a Marshall official privately? What does that do? At best, it leads to Marshall saying "oh, sorry, we won't do it again."

Bullshit. Syracuse has already been harmed/damaged from this and Marshall has gained from it. Why wouldn't every single school rip off every other school if the total punishment consisted of privately being asked not to in the future?

Somebody at Marshall, almost assuredly within the football program, purposely stole from Syracuse. Mocking them is not only perfectly acceptable but is also doing Marshall a favor instead of litigating.

Syracuse handled it masterfully. Used a little humor at Marshall's expense to call them out, while simultaneously doing so in a humorous, tasteful manner, which could only bring them a little pub. Marshall should consider paying Syracuse some money for teaching them an invaluable lesson.

 

[riflearm2]

I don't think there is much punitive damage to be had. No loss of revenue.

You don't know what punitive damages are. The loss of revenue or absence of it doesn't have anything to do with punitive damages. Punitive damages are intended to punish a party for particular egregious illegal actions with no regard or relationship to financial impact it had on the victim.

Worse, Huff has continued retweeting recruits who are posting that graphic even though he was told (at least via Twitter) about the infringement a day(s) earlier.

 

[mlblack16.]

or mentally handicapped

I like it.

Set them up with the HELP program immediately and get them on the football team!

 

[Jartard]

I wish some other school would steal our “thunderclap” and refuse to ever give it back.

Agreed. Thankfully the teams didn’t score much under Doc and they were limited. The weird, “First down, first down, first down”, some of the fans do can go too.

 

[sluggo72]

Is the thing from Syracuse copyrighted? On the phone and don’t see the logo

 

[riflearm2]

Is the thing from Syracuse copyrighted? On the phone and don’t see the logo

A copyright exists in ownership from the original creation. You don’t have to go through a legal process to necessarily have it copyrighted. It’s an added, legal protection.

 

[sluggo72]

I