OK.....Please answer this...

[Herd020]

I support the Herd 10000000%. I HATE having to play in this bowl. However, all I heard was that it will be GREAT for recruiting. When I said the Florida recruits wouldn't even hear anything about the game, I was told I was being negative. Well, I have searched the local Florida papers for days now. I have seen nothing on the game. Attached is a link to the Miami Sports page today. I also checked the Palm Beach paper, and others in the area. Same thing. So again, I ask, how did this game help our recruiting?

http://www.miamiherald.com/sports/

 

[mu79grad]

I read where a number of high school athletes, who are thinking of going to MU, had attended at least one bowl practice. That can't hurt recruiting, imo.

 

[BleedsGreen33]

See I think people think this will boost recruiting and that is where I believe the mistake is made. It isn't likely some big recruit down there that hasn't thought about us is going to see this game or be looking to see this game, be wowed, and commit. It's the same as having two teams down there.

What this game does do is give our staff an extra trip down there to see the ones we are already in on. We aren't allowed to host players but they can show up on their own if they so choose. This game isn't swaying anyone.

Just because we add Georgia Southern or Georgia State doesn't mean all the sudden more Georgia recruits are going to want to come to Marshall. It just means that our staff will have another trip to Georgia that is not a recruiting trip. It's a game trip. It's an extra excuse to be there.

 

[Herd-in-ATL]

If Doc does end up at Pittsburgh, I hope all these potential recruits don't end up there as well...

 

[Herdstruck]

I don't doubt the team is contacting and talking to friends and locals about the game.

 

[Gochneaur645]

I have no idea how much it will help recruiting, but that's simply an added bonus if it does.

The main reason to play in this game is that it's against the best possible opponent that will earn us the most possible respect with a victory.

 

[andy4theherd]

Originally posted by Gochneaur645:

The main reason to play in this game is that it's against the best possible opponent that will earn us the most possible respect with a victory.

"...but they haven't played a single P5 team all year. How can we measure them?"
-every sports talking head from every news outlet all season

"yes, they beat a good NIU team...but they haven't played a single P5 team all year. How can we measure them?"
-every sports talking head from every news outlet after the bowl game

 

[Gochneaur645]

Did anybody give a crap that 12-1 Houston beat a lousy B1G team in the HOD bowl in 2011?

 

[Herd Fever]

If you don't think Doc and the staff hasn't informed recruits of the last 3 weeks about our game there then you're dumber then I thought

 

[andy4theherd]

Originally posted by Gochneaur645:
Did anybody give a crap that 12-1 Houston beat a lousy B1G team in the HOD bowl in 2011?

not sure what 2011 has to do with today or the season we just played in which EVERY SPORTS TALKING HEAD cited our lack of a P5 game all season long...


...and 2011 Houston beat UCLA in the regular season before beating Penn State in the HOD bowl. if you think 2014 Marshall beating NIU is bigger than that....well......lol.......

 

[houston_herd_fan]

"Best Possible Opponent" is relative. that term has 2 different meaning. NIU is the Highest ranked opponent, Illinois is the best possible opponent for national recognition.

The actual opponent is has ZERO upside. If we win we played another G5 team and should win if we are the best of the G5, if we lose well the national media says they were not as good as you all thought they were and we told you so.

Lose to Illinois it would be expected, but should we beat them it would be they beat a P5 team and might be as good as you thought they were.

Nothing against NIU, they are a good team, but there is no upside for us. Period. anyone who thinks different is an idiot. and I stand by that opinion regardless of who you are.

I did not call any particular person a negative name, if anyone thinks playing another G5 team over a P5 team, please explain cause I just don't see it. and please give me details cause using the term "The Best Possible Opponent" does not get it for me. I am talking about national recognition for this, explain how playing another G5 team gives better recognition than playing a P5 team from a national media and those who report and look at college football. Anyone who watches any college sports media talking points and listens to what they say both in actual; words and is smart enough to read between the lines can't say this is the better opponent from a national perceptive point of view.

If we want to have even a sliver of a chance to get to the next level this was a really stupid decision. And if we had no choice due to the conf admin I would rather see us back in 1-AA than deal with these people. either that or our Athletic department personnel have no clue or do not want to try to push to the next level and are happy where we are. If the powers that be don't want to get to the TOP level, we should just drop back down a level.

 

[Gochneaur645]

UCLA was 6-8 that year so yes, beating NIU would be a bigger deal. I was actually surprised to see Penn State was 9-3 heading into that game, but beating them only jumped Houston from 20 to 18.

Absolutely nobody will be impressed by a win over a soon to be 6-7 team. Nobody is clamoring about NIU's win over Northwestern or CSU's wins over BC and Colorado.

 

[herdalicious]

Originally posted by Gochneaur645:
the best possible opponent that will earn us the most possible respect with a victory.

Are there more people "in the know" who think NIU is the better team, or is the knee-jerk of the vast majority of fans that Illinois is better by virtue of their size and conference affiliation? Judging from the way this season went, I'd have to go for the latter. The vast majority of college fans give more stroke to a win over a bad Big 10 team than even the best MAC team in the history of the conference. So if your concern is national perception, I wouldn't worry too much about it.

I have nothing against NIU, I just saw Marshall play three MAC teams this year already, and I feel absolutely no excitement whatsoever over a fourth. The other reason is that, in my mind, this is just a post-season MAC game, or would have been back in 2002 when it still felt like Marshall was playing for something.

 

[andy4theherd]

there is 1 post in the "NIU Look a Like" thread......... that is all you need to know......


(there was 2 pages in the Maryland (7-5) thread last season)

 

[Gochneaur645]

Originally posted by houston_herd_fan:

"Best Possible Opponent" is relative. that term has 2 different meaning. NIU is the Highest ranked opponent, Illinois is the best possible opponent for national recognition.

The actual opponent is has ZERO upside. If we win we played another G5 team and should win if we are the best of the G5, if we lose well the national media says they were not as good as you all thought they were and we told you so.

Lose to Illinois it would be expected, but should we beat them it would be they beat a P5 team and might be as good as you thought they were.

Nothing against NIU, they are a good team, but there is no upside for us. Period. anyone who thinks different is an idiot. and I stand by that opinion regardless of who you are.

I did not call any particular person a negative name, if anyone thinks playing another G5 team over a P5 team, please explain cause I just don't see it. and please give me details cause using the term "The Best Possible Opponent" does not get it for me. I am talking about national recognition for this, explain how playing another G5 team gives better recognition than playing a P5 team from a national media and those who report and look at college football. Anyone who watches any college sports media talking points and listens to what they say both in actual; words and is smart enough to read between the lines can't say this is the better opponent from a national perceptive point of view.

If we want to have even a sliver of a chance to get to the next level this was a really stupid decision. And if we had no choice due to the conf admin I would rather see us back in 1-AA than deal with these people. either that or our Athletic department personnel have no clue or do not want to try to push to the next level and are happy where we are. If the powers that be don't want to get to the TOP level, we should just drop back down a level.

Here's a list I complied of those sites who rank the best/most interesting bowl games to watch from 1 to 38. These aren't cherry picked, just every list I saw in the first couple pages of a Google search.

Boca Bowl rank on the left, HOD Bowl rank on the right.


Awful Announcing- 8/23
Yahoo Sports- 10/37
NFL.com- 12/36
Fanbuzz- 13/36

ESPN- 14/34

USA Today- 14/33
LA Times- 15/35
Sports on Earth- 16/33
CBS- 17/37
Athlon- 17/37
Scout- 17/36
Fansided- 24/34
247- 26/33

11 of those 13 sites have the Boca Bowl in the top half with 3 of them in the top third. 12 of the 13 have the HOD Bowl in the bottom 6.

That suggests to me that nobody gives one flying crap about Illinois. Even with all of the P5 nonsense out there, all but the craziest realize who the best team in Illinois is.

Beating a team that scraped by to 6 wins in the worst P5 division by grinding out close wins over Youngstown and Texas State while losing at home to 3-9 Purdue will not earn a lick of respect.

I've said it here before, but absolutely nobody outside of WV cared that we beat Maryland. That game maybe got 15 seconds on SportsCenter. Nobody cared that CSU beat Wazzu last year. And both of those teams are way better than 2014 Illinois.

This post was edited on 12/22 10:30 PM by Gochneaur645

 

[houston_herd_fan]

I have no clue weather NIU or Il is the better team. However unless you do not listen to the media (ESPN), you would understand a win against Il would give much more media respect than a win against NIU. A loss against Il will get a lot less disrespect than a loss to NIU.

No upside to playing NIU, only downside. very little downside (if any) to losing to Il, but a big upside to beating them. Sorry if my rant lost the point I was trying to make.

and my point is in regards to how the national media will discuss win/loss. anyone who thinks the national media doesn't matter, you are lost with your green glasses and blinders.

 

[andy4theherd]

Originally posted by Gochneaur645:
UCLA was 6-8 that year so yes, beating NIU would be a bigger deal. I was actually surprised to see Penn State was 9-3 heading into that game, but beating them only jumped Houston from 20 to 18.

Absolutely nobody will be impressed by a win over a soon to be 6-7 team. Nobody is clamoring about NIU's win over Northwestern or CSU's wins over BC and Colorado.

i think you are on the Boca Raton city council or something....

that 6-8 UCLA team that "NIU would be a bigger deal than played in the PAC 12 Championship game losing to Oregon 49-31. on what planet in what dimension is beating ANY NIU team in the history of the world better than beating a P5 team that played in the conference championship?

2011 UCLA beat:
Oregon State
Washington State
Cal
Arizona State
Colorado

2014 NIU beat:
Northwestern

 

[andy4theherd]

comparing the bowl matchup rankings is borderline moronic....

do you think the Boca Bowl with NOT Marshall vs NIU would garner the same ranking?

would the HOD Bowl with Marshall vs Illinois rank the same as LA Tech?


..........

 

[Herd Fever]

Night before one of our biggest bowl games in program history and the fans are still bitching about it.

I really don't know who made this season more unbearable the playoff committee or Marshall "fans"

 

[Gochneaur645]

Originally posted by andy4theherd:

Originally posted by Gochneaur645:
UCLA was 6-8 that year so yes, beating NIU would be a bigger deal. I was actually surprised to see Penn State was 9-3 heading into that game, but beating them only jumped Houston from 20 to 18.

Absolutely nobody will be impressed by a win over a soon to be 6-7 team. Nobody is clamoring about NIU's win over Northwestern or CSU's wins over BC and Colorado.

i think you are on the Boca Raton city council or something....

that 6-8 UCLA team that "NIU would be a bigger deal than played in the PAC 12 Championship game losing to Oregon 49-31. on what planet in what dimension is beating ANY NIU team in the history of the world better than beating a P5 team that played in the conference championship?

2011 UCLA beat:
Oregon State
Washington State
Cal
Arizona State
Colorado

2014 NIU beat:
Northwestern

The way you present that info is obviously unfair. NIU only played 2 P5 teams. Sure UCLA beat 5, but they played 11. P5 teams would lose all kinds of games to G5 teams if they had to play several on the road each year.

Also, UCLA only played in the title game because USC was ineligible and every other team in that division had a losing record in conference. 2014 Marshall, Boise, NIU, and several other G5 teams would have murdered 2011 UCLA.

 

[Gochneaur645]

Originally posted by andy4theherd:
comparing the bowl matchup rankings is borderline moronic....

do you think the Boca Bowl with NOT Marshall vs NIU would garner the same ranking?

would the HOD Bowl with Marshall vs Illinois rank the same as LA Tech?


..........

I do think that would affect the rankings, but it wouldn't overcome such a large difference. People want to see good teams play each other. Even the most biased P5 idiot doesn't find Illinois to be good or deserving of a bowl game.

 

[Gochneaur645]

Originally posted by houston_herd_fan:

I have no clue weather NIU or Il is the better team. However unless you do not listen to the media (ESPN), you would understand a win against Il would give much more media respect than a win against NIU. A loss against Il will get a lot less disrespect than a loss to NIU.

No upside to playing NIU, only downside. very little downside (if any) to losing to Il, but a big upside to beating them. Sorry if my rant lost the point I was trying to make.

and my point is in regards to how the national media will discuss win/loss. anyone who thinks the national media doesn't matter, you are lost with your green glasses and blinders.

See, I disagree. Even the media will think more of an NIU win. I know our weak schedule has been trumpeted all year, but that's (deservedly) because of how bad the middle and bottom of it were.

Boise was ranked ahead of us even when we were undefeated despite no P5 wins. Colorado State had 2 P5 wins and was ranked behind us. NIU also had a P5 win and was ranked behind us.

I'm still failing to see any evidence of the upside of a win over 6-6 Illinois or how a loss to them would not kill our credibility.

 

[andy4theherd]

if we played Illinois and barely beat them (3 points or less) and the game was down to the wire it would be a negative. there would be a whole lot of "see, we told you so" about our team. if we played Illinois and curbed stomped them (like i think we would because they are not that good) it would get the attention of the media and answer that "how good are they" question that was asked all season.

if we beat NIU by 100 points you will see more than one headline that reads, "Marshall - 2014 CUSA and MAC Champs!" and it wont just be from Landon and the HD....


nobody has ever said Illinois is better than NIU. i think they are a lot closer than most of the big proponents of the Boca Bowl will admit (see scores vs Northwestern). the bottom line is there is ZERO buzz about this game. yes, several bloggers have it rated high on the "must watch" scale.... but honestly, nobody outside of Marshall and NIU fans care. this board has been dead since the debate about playing NIU/Illinois died down. Maryland had 1 more win than Illinois. they beat some horrible ACC teams to get bowl eligible. the excitement leading up to that game wasn't matched by a single game this season..... and that is sad.....

 

[maclid]

I'm going to save my true thoughts on this situation until after the game. We only have 24 hours left of the careers of Cato, Rouse, Shuler, Roberts, Frohnapfel, etc.. I think its time to cheer on the game. This conversation I suspect will last the whole summer.

 

[oldegoldmountaineer]

I doubt if recruits read the newspapers. Not many under 30 do.

 

[Greenis Envy]

While you guys are bitching (still) about seemingly nothing that would make a bit of difference to our "image" or whatever you think we need to be striving for or improving upon or deserve, I'll be in Boca Raton tomorrow with all the Marshall fans and players who want to be there, enjoying the 80 degree sunshine a few blocks from the Atlantic Ocean... but I sure wish I were instead, getting ready for the great midwest, preparing to miss Christmas, playing a totally irrelevant P5 team in a totally irrelevant matchup with no history, no relevance and no interest. Dang, you Illini guys are right!

 

[Gochneaur645]

Originally posted by andy4theherd:
if we played Illinois and barely beat them (3 points or less) and the game was down to the wire it would be a negative. there would be a whole lot of "see, we told you so" about our team. if we played Illinois and curbed stomped them (like i think we would because they are not that good) it would get the attention of the media and answer that "how good are they" question that was asked all season.

if we beat NIU by 100 points you will see more than one headline that reads, "Marshall - 2014 CUSA and MAC Champs!" and it wont just be from Landon and the HD....


nobody has ever said Illinois is better than NIU. i think they are a lot closer than most of the big proponents of the Boca Bowl will admit (see scores vs Northwestern). the bottom line is there is ZERO buzz about this game. yes, several bloggers have it rated high on the "must watch" scale.... but honestly, nobody outside of Marshall and NIU fans care. this board has been dead since the debate about playing NIU/Illinois died down. Maryland had 1 more win than Illinois. they beat some horrible ACC teams to get bowl eligible. the excitement leading up to that game wasn't matched by a single game this season..... and that is sad.....

We'll just have to disagree. I think curb-stomping NIU would send a much larger message than curb-stomping Illinois. I think we're all underestimating the media's ability to distinguish one of the 3 best G5 teams from one of the 20 worst P5 teams.

Yeah, it sucks that the best available team this year was from the same conference that we unwisely scheduled 3 other games against, but that's not a reason to pass on them.

I also disagree with there being no buzz about this game. It's not going to be a top national story, but I think it's getting more attention than your average pre-Christmas bowl game. You say nobody other than MU/NIU fans care, but who exactly outside of Marshall/Maryland cared about that game? And what evidence is there to say they would care about MU/Illinois?

 

[The Real SamC]

Originally posted by Greenis Envy:
but I sure wish I were instead, getting ready for the great midwest, preparing to miss Christmas, playing a totally irrelevant P5 team in a totally irrelevant matchup with no history, no relevance and no interest. Dang, you Illini guys are right!

/thread.

Please, all of you, MOVE ON.

 

[Herd Fever]

What's funny is this bowl has been covered good in the Palm Beach Post as well as the Sun Sentinel. 2 newspaper that cover the Palm Beach area

Then when you open the link above, you find an article about today's bowl

 

[Herdstruck]

They should go to Dallas anyway...fly out there and shiver during the horribly irrelevant bowl game against two teams who have no recent history.

Enjoy Boca Raton!

 

[The Real SamC]

Originally posted by Herd020:
Attached is a link to the Miami Sports page today. I also checked the Palm Beach paper, and others in the area. Same thing. So again, I ask, how did this game help our recruiting?

And here you go:


http://www.dallasnews.com/sports/college-sports/

http://www.nbcdfw.com/news/sports/


http://www.wfaa.com/sports/

http://dfw.cbslocal.com/category/sports/

http://www.myfoxdfw.com/

http://www.star-telegram.com/sports/

In all you will find one overriding theme. Either a token mention, or complete ignoring, of the fact that ESPN, Inc. rented the rotten Cotton Bowl for a meaningless game between LA Tech and a Big 10 bottom feeder.

Cowboys. Mavs. Texas A&M. Texas. TCU. High school. Baylor.

The DFW Metroplex is waking up and totally ignoring this non-event.

And, when (and not if) LA Tech joins pretty much everybody with a pulse in assreaming Illinois, the media will ignore that too. 40 seconds on Sports Center, and that only because the sports world is still half shut down today.

Yes, 10 or 20 years from now, when nobody remembers how s***y Illinois was this year, LA Tech can say "back in '14, we beat a Big 10 team". Which of course, Herd fans, real Herd fans, already can recite our victories over ACC, SEC "Big East" and other conferences from other years, and know that we get to beat Illinois' fellow Big 10 field filler next fall.