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EMU Faculty wants the school to cut football

jocktalker said:
This is just the beginning. There are too many so called Division I schools. :confused:
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I agree. FIAU, Eastern Michigan, New Mexico State, UMass, South Alabama, Idaho, Idaho, Idaho, Idaho (and I mean that) can't be doing anything to help out their schools and community.
 
WV_Celt said:
I agree. FIAU, Eastern Michigan, New Mexico State, UMass, South Alabama, Idaho, Idaho, Idaho, Idaho (and I mean that) can't be doing anything to help out their schools and community.
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I would doubt that FIU or FAU are going anywhere. FAU has a beautiful new stadium. The recruiting budget for both is a tank of gas. Way too much talent in south Florida for them not to make it. FIU was on the right track a few years ago and then the had a knee jerk reaction to a sub par year and fired their coach. Glad they did because that's what got us Alex Mirabal
 
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EMU averaged 4,897 fans per game last year and raked in $27 million in subsidies. That's absurd.

Ball State just under 8K/game with $17 mill in subsidies.

UMASS averaged just over 11K/game and took in $29 million in subsidies.

Some other interesting stats:

UCF $25 million in subsidies
JMU $39 million :eek: in subsidies
ODU $28 million in subsidies
Houston $25 million in subsidies


http://www.cbssports.com/collegefoo...ps-for-fifth-straight-year-but-at-slower-rate

http://sports.usatoday.com/ncaa/finances/
 
The ease of getting the far-lefts in the "faculty senate" at any college, be it EMU, Marshall, WVU, or even Michigan or Ohio State to vote yes to "let's eliminate sports" is second only to getting them to vote for Comrade Sanders.

However, as to EMU, they may have a point. Ann Arbor and Ypsilanti might as well be one town. Between UM and the Detroit pro sports, EMU is never going to gain any traction. When no element of your community (students, town, alumni) care about your sports, it is time to quit, and EMU is at that point. Forcing students to pay for tickets they don't want to weekday games played at night north of parts of Canada outdoors (thanks, ESPN) is just pointless.

This is what the MAC is, and always has been, save for that brief period when we took it to the next level. Future phys ed teachers of Michigan vs future phys ed teachers of Ohio.

This is where this whole "pay the players" idiocy is taking us. There is no way to justify sports in most of the MAC and big chunks of the THE AMERICAN!!!!, CUSA, or Sun Belt.
 
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Herdmeister, I'm not knocking you, so please don't take this in a negative way.

I don't understand the amount of love/respect/admiration that the Florida schools get around here. FIU had a VERY brief period of time where they were anything, and it was due in large part to TY Hilton being amazing.

I get that West Virginians love Florida, I really do. But my goodness :rolleyes:
 
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WV_Celt said:
Herdmeister, I'm not knocking you, so please don't take this in a negative way.

I don't understand the amount of love/respect/admiration that the Florida schools get around here. FIU had a VERY brief period of time where they were anything, and it was due in large part to TY Hilton being amazing.

I get that West Virginians love Florida, I really do. But my goodness :rolleyes:
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I certainly have no love for Florida. I lived there and couldn't wait to move back. I'm just saying with all the SoFla talent, they are bound to get some plus with such large enrollments their fees will keep them afloat as well.
BTW, no offense taken.
 
The four "directional Floridas" that play I-A sports (Central, the woefully misnamed South, Atlantic and the simply oddly named International) are a quandry.

One one hand, no body cares. It is a, more or less, self-selected student, and thus eventually alumni base. If sports are your thing, then you become a Gator or a Seminole. And, in their towns, most people are not from there and the ones that are follow the long established schools.

But, the schools are all huge. Among the largest schools in the world. So large that they can run G5 athletics for just a little per student. And, importantly for their two leagues, they are located in the most fertile recruiting ground there is. An annual appearance there beats playing in Bowling Green or Mufresboro or Ruston all to hell.
 
WV_Celt said:
I agree. FIAU, Eastern Michigan, New Mexico State, UMass, South Alabama, Idaho, Idaho, Idaho, Idaho (and I mean that) can't be doing anything to help out their schools and community.
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I wouldn't include South Alabama or FAU in that discussion. There be life in Mobile, that is definitely a program to keep an eye on as time goes on. I don't know why, can't explain it, just a gut feeling.
 
South Alabama is just another UAB. A school in a state with Alabama and Auburn. Seriously now. Troy, which has had periods of mid major success doesn't even get a batted eye.

And again, no reason for the love FAU is getting. It doesn't matter how big the school is. It's in already saturated Florida. 7 FBS level programs is far too many.
 
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I don't know, they seem to get ok support compared to some of the listed schools, at least people do show up for their games some. I think they could become more than UAB in the athletic world, had a decent basketball program to at one point. I mean the only time UAB got support was when everyone knew the Sh** was gonna hit the fan. When they got axed, I felt South Alabama could have been a good replacement, but woulda like Ark. St. better. Just my two cents. Troy, made a short term name for themselves............then disappeared. I think they grew as much as they would grow but then again who knows.
 
Marshall is a bit of an outlier in college athletics, because we have FBS sports when we clearly can't afford it, but without them, there would be nothing to do from Labor Day to April. Boise State, Southern Miss, ECU...examples of other programs doing the same thing in a similar environment.

Anybody who tries to start a G5 FBS program within 100 miles of anything better to do is going to have a hard time building or keeping a following. There's too many piggies at the trough already, and the dilution of talent on the bottom end of FBS as more schools join just makes things worse for everybody.

If Charlotte is still drawing over 5k a game in 2021, I'll sh't my pants. On purpose for once.
 
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herdalicious said:
Marshall is a bit of an outlier in college athletics, because we have FBS sports when we clearly can't afford it, but without them, there would be nothing to do from Labor Day to April. Boise State, Southern Miss, ECU...examples of other programs doing the same thing in a similar environment.

Anybody who tries to start a G5 FBS program within 100 miles of anything better to do is going to have a hard time building or keeping a following. There's too many piggies at the trough already, and the dilution of talent on the bottom end of FBS as more schools join just makes things worse for everybody.

If Charlotte is still drawing over 5k a game in 2021, I'll sh't my pants. On purpose for once.
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With all the contracts that Charlotte has signed, they'll be ok for years to come. They and ODU have the most attractive OOC schedules in coming years of anyone in CUSA
 
Herdmeister said:
With all the contracts that Charlotte has signed, they'll be ok for years to come. They and ODU have the most attractive OOC schedules in coming years of anyone in CUSA
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Vanderbilt has 82 years worth of SEC schedules AND is located in a city with a metro population of 1.8 million. they rarely draw (on average) 5k more people than Marshall... in 2003 they averaged 400 more people per game...

scheduling is good for a few thousand casuals at established programs. maybe a few hundred for the just-add-water football programs ...
 
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It's funny how the eer based posters come here, having never been to FAU nor seen their beautiful campus or their very nice new beautiful stadium and lop them in with EMU. Yet they can see UConn as a powerhouse when they used to play them , but when Marshall beats them Uconn isn't deserving of D1 football , yet if they get them into the B12 they will be a powerhouse again.

Actually maybe their needs to be divisions in college football, and Marshall and wvu and ECU and UConn and Maryland all need to be in the same division.

LOL! It's pure economics people. If you have a school that has money like FAU you keep football. ( if you went to the Boca Bowl you too know they are a sleeping giant) If your emu in maction , not so much. Which is why we left Maction, we are now ahia u s Super Bowl , we used to be their rival.
 
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TheGreenhouseEffect said:
It's funny how the eer based posters come here, having never been to FAU nor seen their beautiful campus or their very nice new beautiful stadium and lop them in with EMU. Yet they can see UConn as a powerhouse when they used to play them , but when Marshall beats them Uconn isn't deserving of D1 football , yet if they get them into the B12 they will be a powerhouse again.

Actually maybe their needs to be divisions in college football, and Marshall and wvu and ECU and UConn and Maryland all need to be in the same division.

LOL! It's pure economics people. If you have a school that has money like FAU you keep football. ( if you went to the Boca Bowl you too know they are a sleeping giant) If your emu in maction , not so much. Which is why we left Maction, we are now ahia u s Super Bowl , we used to be their rival.
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I went to the Boca Bowl and FAU had great potential there. I would much rather have them that others in our conference. A trip to south florida is great for the program and fans. If we don't end up in a big bowl this year I wouldn't complain about going to Boca to face an AAC team at all. My wife has already penciled that trip in as a Christmas gift this coming winter.
 
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Herdmeister said:
With all the contracts that Charlotte has signed, they'll be ok for years to come. They and ODU have the most attractive OOC schedules in coming years of anyone in CUSA
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I have no doubt they'll have years of awesome-to-mediocre teams coming in and thumping the sh't out of them, and maybe for those games they'll draw a few warm bodies, but I just don't see a large fanbase turning out consistently in big numbers for years to watch them take their lumps in a low-level D-I conference, while Cam Newton is across town playing for the Super Bowl.

And I'll say this about ODU: they striped the stadium when we came there in 2014. Let's see if they can pull it off again this year, now that a little of the shine on their unbridled "upside" has been knocked off.
 
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In terms of "potential", Charlotte's best marketing plan would be to aim at fans of the visiting team. People who have moved there to find work. Chief among those would be, of course, Marshall, but there are others out there too. There are, at multiple levels, schools that do that. Rutgers, Vandy, Cincy, Tulsa. It seems Maryland has fallen into that level. It is OK, but really, who wants to play 12 de facto away games?

As to ODU, well it is pretty far from any pro teams (AAA baseball is there but who cares) and pretty far from any real big time programs. It is a big enough city, but horid traffic and fairly low income with a lot of short term military residents. Still, if it can draw 12 or 14K on a Saturday afternoon, then it is what it is.

As to FAU, Boca Raton is NOT Miami. It is a different market. Much slower. Much less Latin, much less poor folks. Really driving down to Miami to see the pro teams is a chore. If you aim at sports minded old folks from up north with plenty of $$ and plenty of free time, why could you not build up a reasonable following? (I would say the same thing about Coastal Carolina, which is moving up to the Sun Belt next year).

FIU has zero point zero potential. It is Miami. Nobody cares. Nobody will ever care.
 
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What is the reason that the NCAA has never enforced the attendance requirement for FBS??? Or has it been repealed? In 2014, there were 8 schools who averaged less than 15,000 fans: Akron, Ball St., FAU, FIU, Idaho, Kent St., NMSU, and Northern Illinois.

In 2015, four of those averaged more than 15,000, but 6 more schools fell into the below 15000 category: EMU, UMass, GaSt, ULM, UNT, and Charlotte.

This means that technically, Ball State, Idaho, Kent St., and Northern Illinios should be relegated to FCS (and probably more if they counted actual butts in seats).

What gives?
 
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Charlotte 49ers have Tons of $$$$$. Other than football, they compete VERY WELL in all sports in CUSA. From where I come from----MONEY Talks! For the Love of John Marshall...give them time in building a football program.

For you young puppies, check out The Herd's (lack of success) football program from 1960---1984. Hell, it was my junior year [1967-68] before I witnessed Marshall even win a football game (Bowling Green in the mud at Fairfield). Right Herdmeister---you were a student then! The HERD averaged less than 10,000 fans too. Marshall had the second longest losing streak in America (behind Columbia--now that's a football household name). Charlotte will pass most of CUSA schools in a Flash. Marshall could be one of "those" schools in Charlotte's rear view mirror.

HerdZilla22 in Charlotte
 
CarolinaHerdZilla22 said:
Charlotte 49ers have Tons of $$$$$. Other than football, they compete VERY WELL in all sports in CUSA. From where I come from----MONEY Talks! For the Love of John Marshall...give them time in building a football program.

For you young puppies, check out The Herd's (lack of success) football program from 1960---1984. Hell, it was my junior year [1967-68] before I witnessed Marshall even win a football game (Bowling Green in the mud at Fairfield). Right Herdmeister---you were a student then! The HERD averaged less than 10,000 fans too. Marshall had the second longest losing streak in America (behind Columbia--now that's a football household name). Charlotte will pass most of CUSA schools in a Flash. Marshall could be one of "those" schools in Charlotte's rear view mirror.

HerdZilla22 in Charlotte
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And Marshall was also dropped to 1-AA when it was created. I agree with you about Charlotte, thy just happened to fall into that category. That being said, I think they probably should have been further along in FB before they moved up.
 
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THUNDERGround said:
What is the reason that the NCAA has never enforced the attendance requirement for FBS???

What gives?
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It is unenforcable. The original real purpose of the rule was to force the MAC and the old Big West down to I-AA. The MAC just rebelled and eventually they eventually just gave up. The one valid point the MAC has was that there were a lot bigger schools that did not draw flies either.

The point is that attendence figures are totally unaudited. There are 100 tricks. First, since nobody is coming anyway, you just give an unwanted ticket to every student and count them as used. Akron has local businesses buy and shred tickets. Cincinnati simply gives tickets away. 100 tricks.

At the end of the day, if a school/state is willing to p*** away money at this, the NCAA will let them.
 
It's sad, really. I'm just saying that there needs to be a common metric in accounting for attendance: Butts in seats. Physical ticket count. I mean, EMU averaging 4000 and change? C'mon... I hate it for them, but they are just not competitive. There are others too.
 
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Charlotte will never pass Marshall. They scrap the bottom of the barrel for recruits and even those recruits they have to fight for against 1AA, JUCO, and D2 schools.
 
CarolinaHerdZilla22 said:
Charlotte 49ers have Tons of $$$$$. Other than football, they compete VERY WELL in all sports in CUSA. From where I come from----MONEY Talks! For the Love of John Marshall...give them time in building a football program.

For you young puppies, check out The Herd's (lack of success) football program from 1960---1984. Hell, it was my junior year [1967-68] before I witnessed Marshall even win a football game (Bowling Green in the mud at Fairfield). Right Herdmeister---you were a student then! The HERD averaged less than 10,000 fans too. Marshall had the second longest losing streak in America (behind Columbia--now that's a football household name). Charlotte will pass most of CUSA schools in a Flash. Marshall could be one of "those" schools in Charlotte's rear view mirror.

HerdZilla22 in Charlotte
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Actually, Zilla, as big of fan as I am, I never attended Marshall. I went to Fairmont State out of HS and then years finished up in Florida. I've been a MU Alumni Assn member for over 40 years...
 
Herd Fever said:
Charlotte will never pass Marshall. They scrap the bottom of the barrel for recruits and even those recruits they have to fight for against 1AA, JUCO, and D2 schools.
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The difference in Charlotte and Marshall is, well, the difference in Charlotte and Huntington. MU sports works because WTF else is there? In sports terms, Cincy and its Reds and Bengals is 3 hours away. Charleston has rinky-dink low minor baseball, big deal. The Hole is more than 3 hours away, and, well, USPAM is not really that big a deal. Lexington? Columbus? In other terms, Huntington, or even Huntington-Charleston-Ashland-Ironton-Portsmouth has exactly what? It is not the worst place in the world, but whatever type of music or other entertainment you are into, you are lucky if you see more than 10 national acts per year (less than that if you are not into country). A couple of bars with live music in each town. That is it. CLT has NFL, NBA, and AAA baseball. Plus its less than 2 1/2 to multiple major colleges. Half a dozen. Plus national level acts are in there all the time, and it has a great local entertainment scene. In that environment UNCC is a tiny blip on the radar, and always will be.
 
Look at where college football thrives best. Small college towns with an alumnus that can drive within 3 hours. Major cities usually don't spawn great college followings. GT struggles in Atlanta even.
 
TheGreenhouseEffect said:
Look at where college football thrives best. Small college towns with an alumnus that can drive within 3 hours. Major cities usually don't spawn great college followings. GT struggles in Atlanta even.
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USC and UCLA do a pretty good job. Even SDSU he in San Diego.

Arizona State and Arizona don't do too bad either.

And don't forget those Longhorns in Texas, the Utes in Salt Lake City, and the Buckeyes in Columbus
 
The Real SamC said:
The difference in Charlotte and Marshall is, well, the difference in Charlotte and Huntington. MU sports works because WTF else is there? In sports terms, Cincy and its Reds and Bengals is 3 hours away. Charleston has rinky-dink low minor baseball, big deal. The Hole is more than 3 hours away, and, well, USPAM is not really that big a deal. Lexington? Columbus? In other terms, Huntington, or even Huntington-Charleston-Ashland-Ironton-Portsmouth has exactly what? It is not the worst place in the world, but whatever type of music or other entertainment you are into, you are lucky if you see more than 10 national acts per year (less than that if you are not into country). A couple of bars with live music in each town. That is it. CLT has NFL, NBA, and AAA baseball. Plus its less than 2 1/2 to multiple major colleges. Half a dozen. Plus national level acts are in there all the time, and it has a great local entertainment scene. In that environment UNCC is a tiny blip on the radar, and always will be.
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"UNCC is a tiny blip on the radar, and always will be." Real Sam..."How much time have you spent on
Charlotte's campus? You seem to have all the answers for the 49ers NEVER being significant. Enrollment is nearing 30,000 (some believe Charlotte will become North Carolina's largest University)......MAJOR construction taking place on & near campus. Charlotte's rail system (train) will connect uptown & UNCC in 2017. Major shopping centers, restaurants, various retail stores, housing, major hospital & hotels (built or more being built). Charlotte 49ers will become a target for Conference expansion before any present CUSA school is approached. FOOTBALL does not drive conference acceptance alone. It is called location, location, location---academics, $$$$$$ & media density. Once Charlotte moves (year ???) to a more appealing conference...RECRUITS will want to attend school in the Queen City. Contrary to Herd Fever's comments...."Charlotte scrapes the bottom of the barrel for recruits." Just Wait & See!

Yes...we have the Panthers, Hornets & AAA baseball--Knights (Chicago White Sox).....but Charlotte continues to grow with new folks moving to our great city weekly. Most have no loyalty to North Carolina's ACC schools or even to nearby South Carolina (2 1/2 hours away). College football fans will identify with the 49ers while they continue to build a college program. WINNING=== FAN SUPPORT! Jerry Richardson Stadium (yes the owner of the Carolina Panthers) seats about 15,000 now...HOWEVER it was built with expansion plans to seat about 60,000 + WHEN TIME presents itself. Sam...I hope you & I live to see my comments come true. IT WILL HAPPEN. If you do not believe me...call Head Coach Lambert (ex HERD staff) and ask him!

Just wait & see.....Just wait & see......Just wait & see.........Jealousy creates fools!

HerdZilla22 In CHARLOTTE
 
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