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More "free stuff"

Sending everyone to college is not the solution. I know that seems funny considering I have 3 University degrees. However, as you point out Fever the cost and the payoff have reached a point of "diminishing returns." I sat next to a buddy of mine at the Purdue game. he is a union guy making 39 bucks an hour. With overtime that's pretty solid in my book. He told me they were begging to hire a guy at the plant where he works but couldn't get anyone to pass a DRUG TEST! My point is this. We need to steer kids in the right direction from the time they are little. That means teaching them MORALS at church. Teach them a work ethic at home.For goodness sakes our country is already in debt 16 trillion we can not sustain this kind of spending without causing the economy to fold at some point.
 
extragreen said:
Someone else not having to go through the tough times that you have doesn't cost you a thing. Matter of fact, it might just help you.
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Making sacrifices certainly help you...I agree. But by that logic wouldn't you want those who accrue debt to go to college to make that same sacrifice? I mean, it helps them and all.
 
Herd Fever said:
This is like when someone buys season tickets get mad that the person next to them who gets disconnected tickets because of a ticket promotion
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That's a fair point. I guess the difference is that buying tickets to a game is a choice that I can make, unlike taxes that are mandatory. With college loan debt forgiveness I have no choice but to subsidize that out of my own pocket through the taxes I pay. That would be the exact same thing as raising season ticket prices by $10 dollars a game and using the money to subsidize tickets for those who don't make the same sacrifices to buy them. At least with the tickets I could say... screw this, I ain't buying them anymore. Try that with taxes because you disagree with how your money is spent.
 
ohio herd said:
Sending everyone to college is not the solution. I know that seems funny considering I have 3 University degrees. However, as you point out Fever the cost and the payoff have reached a point of "diminishing returns." I sat next to a buddy of mine at the Purdue game. he is a union guy making 39 bucks an hour. With overtime that's pretty solid in my book. He told me they were begging to hire a guy at the plant where he works but couldn't get anyone to pass a DRUG TEST! My point is this. We need to steer kids in the right direction from the time they are little. That means teaching them MORALS at church. Teach them a work ethic at home.For goodness sakes our country is already in debt 16 trillion we can not sustain this kind of spending without causing the economy to fold at some point.
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You don't learn morals in the Church. You learn them in the household. Nowadays it seems like parents would rather have someone else teach their child morals and the ways of life then themselves.
 
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GK4Herd said:
That's a fair point. I guess the difference is that buying tickets to a game is a choice that I can make, unlike taxes that are mandatory. With college loan debt forgiveness I have no choice but to subsidize that out of my own pocket through the taxes I pay. That would be the exact same thing as raising season ticket prices by $10 dollars a game and using the money to subsidize tickets for those who don't make the same sacrifices to buy them. At least with the tickets I could say... screw this, I ain't buying them anymore. Try that with taxes because you disagree with how your money is spent.
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That's the thing, I would rather for my taxes to be used to take care of the sick and raise the college-educated base in this country then my taxes being used to build more Private and Government run Jails and Prisons
 
The Heroin drug epidemic is getting out of control to the point kids not teenagers but kids are dying of overdoses but yet NOTHING is being said about that in this presidential campaign. All I am hearing is dismissing women's rights and illegal immigration, neither of which is a grave problem in this country.
 
Herd Fever said:
That's the thing, I would rather for my taxes to be used to take care of the sick and raise the college-educated base in this country then my taxes being used to build more Private and Government run Jails and Prisons
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You're bringing totally separate issues into the equation...issues I don't necessarily disagree with you on. I believe government should help those who can't help themselves. There are plenty of programs to help the sick and those who want college but lack the means to help themselves. There's grants for college. There are tons of community colleges that able-bodied kids could get a job and work their way through. There are tons of government help already for those who want to take advantage of it. And as for jails? Legalize the low level drugs and they'll mysteriously empty.

The problem is that we're drawing the line in the middle of the able bodied and lazy. We are subsidizing those who are capable of helping themselves, but aren't willing because it is hard. And when there is a natural backlash from those who make sacrifices and give up stuff while these able-bodied people take the easy path, people try to play it politically as though this is some heartless conservative thinking. It's not political to me. It's natural for people who work their tails off to get things to be upset with others who expect it handed to them.
 
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See that's the thing with me. I received Grants and family contributions for my college education(something about Jamaican families and College loans don't mix) but I still worked to pay my rent, bills and college living expense. But honestly I never cared how someone else financed their college education. I just cared that they got one. And I see what your saying about able-bodied people that are lazy. Yes it is frustrating and I have cut off a lot of my High School buddies that had the same mindset. But that doesn't mean I don't want the government to pitch in more when it comes to raising the college-educated base in this country and I don't care if my tax money goes towards. That's better then my tax money being used to make petty criminals into harden criminals or making sure these Private prison corporations profit lines greater
 
GK4Herd said:
Making sacrifices certainly help you...I agree. But by that logic wouldn't you want those who accrue debt to go to college to make that same sacrifice? I mean, it helps them and all.
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My point was that forgiving the debt would clear up some money for college grads, that would be spent on consumer products. This would be in effect an economic stimulus that would help you and me.
 
Debt forgiveness as an economic stimulus? I guess that might help a little. But no more than just sending the money to reimburse me for my kids education and letting me spend it. I might even have you put in a new kitchen for me.
 
GK4Herd said:
Debt forgiveness as an economic stimulus? I guess that might help a little. But no more than just sending the money to reimburse me for my kids education and letting me spend it. I might even have you put in a new kitchen for me.
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I see nothing wrong with that. Debt Forgiveness and reimbursement to parents who had to take out loans to finance their child education. Public education should be a right for the people to expect the government to finance. I mean they already do it for DC students who attend a 4 year university anywhere in the country and maintain a 3.0 GPA.
 
WV has scholly's for those with 3.0 average or above. I feel even those who might be slow but work hard have a right to go to college too.Like I always say dont cut one penny to americans until money going to foreigners is stopped I dont know anybody who gets a welfare check. I know those who get foodstamps. They keep more food than me. lol
 
Herd Fever said:
Public Funding = Taxes and like I said, I would rather my taxes go to paying for college education for the youth then it go towards building Jails. I mean just the state of California alone has built 22 prisons and counting while they have only built 1 university since 1980. But you don't see the issue there
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Fever that may be true for Cali, but not nationwide. Look at this.

https://nces.ed.gov/fastfacts/display.asp?id=84

This shows 1,000 more 4 year schools now than in 1980.
 
Herd Fever said:
I see nothing wrong with that. Debt Forgiveness and reimbursement to parents who had to take out loans to finance their child education. Public education should be a right for the people to expect the government to finance. I mean they already do it for DC students who attend a 4 year university anywhere in the country and maintain a 3.0 GPA.
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why should higher ed be a right? not saying i oppose some of that, just curious why you're so adamant that it should be a birthright of us citizens.
 
It won't be higher ed after the libs get their way. It really already isn't in a lot of cases. How can it be higher if everybody gets it? It's lower to accommodate all the idiots they have to take now.

That's why this socialist garbage is so threatening. Like it or not, some people are better and smarter. Without them having the incentive to achieve and do better than others, they will simply sit on the ball and say to hell with it. The country will be circling the drain at that point.
 
"How can it be higher if everybody gets it?"

Because it's higher education than high school.
 
When I was in college, a kid could work and pay his/her way through...or, at a minimum, nearly pay all of it. Today, not a chance. Read an article stating tuition back in 1974 would cost $2000 in today's dollars....and that compares to the reality of $10K tuition cost our children face. I've lived both - going to college back then and paying tuition today. Seems about right to me.

I don't believe college should be "free". However, it should be affordable. From an "affordability" standpoint, I'm not talking about Ivy League or top tier public institutions like Uof M......but young person attending an avg-type college...like Marshall, OU, WVU, etc with a much smaller debt load.
 
I agree tuition costs are out of control. Faculty aren't making more though, but facilities and dorms are getting nicer and nicer in a higher ed arms race.

The root of the problem is student loans and colleges have ZERO skin in the game for seeing that these loans get paid back. For profit "universities" are the worst offenders (Strayer, etc), preying on first generation college kids that don't have the family knowledge of the value of a real degree over that of sham one.

However, part of the issue also lies with expensive private schools and naive 18 year olds as well that can't possibly get a return on their "investment" when they go into mid to high 5 figure debt for their liberal arts degree at a mid-level (but very expensive) private school like (*insert Elon or Sewanee, etc...) because it just seems like such a nice campus and place. High school guidance counselors need to educate families and 18 year olds on the realities of student loan debt.

If I were in charge I'd do the follow:
- No more federally funded student loans for for-profit universities. That's it, done. Money saved from this (the gov't is losing billions on this deal) would go to fund a publicly funded community college system that can feed into established 4 year universities for students that are inclined to go to on to receive 4 year degrees
- Public and private non-profit universities will have penalties and/or incentives for having a higher/lower percentage of their loan-taking students that default or successfully paying back their federally funded loans. School X should not be able to year-after-year without any penalty be churning out "graduates" that continually default on their loans.
- With money saved again from not funding these for profit degree mills I'd also look into advertising directly to kids about the importance of affordable no frills education. Your campus does not need to have shiny buildings, state of the art gym, gourmet cafeteria, and an organic food market in the student union. It needs to give you a hell of an education. Heaven forbid you share a bunk bed and community showers in a ghetto dorm room during your freshman year. There are good ways in commercials or print to get this concept across.
 
Of course. It's already lower ed, but currently it's for big suits and ties who run the universities to fleece idiots into borrowing money to pursue a worthless degree.
 
You still couldn't get in though. Guess the bar wasn't quite low enough.

Hammer dee nail in dee cab-net. DURRRRRRRRR
 
Not interested. Unless I can just walk up and buy it, I don't want it. You all had to talk like queers to woo your women. That's terrible. I'm not doing that.

And I'll stay here anyway. What are you going to do?
 
You don't have the guts to talk to a woman in any kind of voice. I guess that makes you a real man....without a woman.
 
It takes guts to talk like a queer? All right then. Go for it. I'd rather not.

When I want something, I order it in a deep monotone voice. "One McDouble." If I could say "one night of screwing" and that was on a menu somewhere for a decent price, I'd consider it.

That's not how it is though. You have to say honey, love, sweetie, stupid bullshit like that to sweet talk. That's gayer than hell and I'm not doing it.
 
If it did then I could say all those cute words you said to your wife. Think back all those years how you said you loved her. How sweet and lovely you said she was. Called her honey and sweetie pie.

Said all that in a voice like you were talking to a little baby puppy dog. If you've got kids, you talked the same way to them when they were little.

I'm not doing that stuff.
 
You soften up your voice to talk to your wife and kids. Don't worry, every man does these days. It's pansy nation. The only way to avoid it is to say to hell with the whole deal.

If a man can honestly say he just ordered up a whore and she agreed to do whatever he wanted without all the relationship bullshit, then I'll tip my hat. Anything else is a feminized embarrassment and I'm not interested in it.
 
coming from a man who is gay and afraid to speak to others. calling fever a bum only because he is black. finally a real racist. You are not even welcome back home. They hate snobs in lesage. you better withdraw your 401k money before they fire you. Im a type write machine and they call me kennnyyyyy. male secretaries,,classic
 
Walden===I can type better than you and Im good at answering the phone,,hello im kennnnyyyyrifle burned him and called him at work. wont say it here but got his last name.
 
Hell, you don't even have a job at all. Not a secretary. Not anything but an old bum. Worthless. Contributing nothing else to society. Why even live?
 
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