ADVERTISEMENT

More on MU to SBC...

MUCO68

Silver Buffalo
Jan 27, 2011
1,215
312
83
For what it's worth.......This is from SaturdaydownSouth.com...

"
Trey Schapp of KABZ 103.7 The Buzz tweeted Wednesday that Southern Mississippi and Marshall would be leaving Conference USA for the Sun Belt Conference."


SOURCE: Southern Mississippi to the @SunBelt is a done deal and Marshall coming with them appears to be imminent. The hits keep coming for CUSA.
— Trey Schaap (@trey1037TheBuzz) October 20, 2021
 
For what it's worth.......This is from SaturdaydownSouth.com...

"
Trey Schapp of KABZ 103.7 The Buzz tweeted Wednesday that Southern Mississippi and Marshall would be leaving Conference USA for the Sun Belt Conference."
That was Wednesday though. Since then it appears Marshall is entertaining Judy's grift. Also rumors of a certain someone in the athletic department screwing things up.

I predict within a week fans are going to be really happy or they're going to really hate everyone in leadership.
 
"Also rumors of a certain someone in the athletic department screwing things up."

Who might that certain someone be?
 
The Board of Trustees of Coastal Carolina University held a “executive session” (legalese for secret meeting) yesterday to “discuss contractural issues in the athletic department”. Apparently it was to authorize their AD to agree to membership changes in the SBC.
 
The Board of Trustees of Coastal Carolina University held a “executive session” (legalese for secret meeting) yesterday to “discuss contractural issues in the athletic department”. Apparently it was to authorize their AD to agree to membership changes in the SBC.
No way?!?! You mean their admin is doing what needs to be done to allow conf expansion? Next you will tell us that water is wet
 
  • Like
Reactions: Marine03
The Sunbelt is now better than Conference USA and with the teams that the AAC is picked up it appears they will be better than that conference also. If the SBC does pickup Marshall. James Madison and Hopefully Liberty the SBC will most definitely be the best G% conference and could develop to be better than the B12 conference.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Catfanatic1979v1
The Sunbelt is now better than Conference USA and with the teams that the AAC is picked up it appears they will be better than that conference also. If the SBC does pickup Marshall. James Madison and Hopefully Liberty the SBC will most definitely be the best G% conference and could develop to be better than the B12 conference.


I agree. I'd rather not be the red headed step child of the AAC anyways. They wouldn't take us but that's how they would look at us.
 
The Sunbelt is now better than Conference USA and with the teams that the AAC is picked up it appears they will be better than that conference also. If the SBC does pickup Marshall. James Madison and Hopefully Liberty the SBC will most definitely be the best G% conference and could develop to be better than the B12 conference.
No, no, and a little bit more no.

The Sun Belt has been better than C-USA over the last few years, but even with the new changes, it won't be better than what the AAC is post-raid.
 
Well Riflearm2 I MUST DISAGREE with you. The AAC has down graded itself with the current additions they are taking from C-USA. AAC is losing what strength they had in both football and basketball and just scrambling to add schools to so it will be an option for the Saturday Sports mods to talk about. The Sun Belt is about to make the correct moves to make it a very interesting and competitive conference in the future.
 
Well Riflearm2 I MUST DISAGREE with you.
Facts don't side with your opinion. Go through the current Sagarin ratings for each school of what will be the new AAC and what is rumored to be the new Sun Belt. The new AAC is still significantly better rated, and that doesn't even take into account the large name brand advantage they will have between teams in the conferences.

AAC is losing what strength they had in both football and basketball and just scrambling to add schools to so it will be an option for the Saturday Sports mods to talk about. The Sun Belt is about to make the correct moves to make it a very interesting and competitive conference in the future.

Let's think about this for a minute. You say that the AAC is "just scrambling to add schools to [sic] so it . . . "

But in reality, they are raiding the exact conference that the Sun Belt is raiding, and the AAC is getting the first six picks while the Sun Belt is getting the leftovers. The AAC is getting the two teams that have combined to win the last four C-USA Championships, a third team from C-USA who is currently in the top 25, and a fourth team that won 18 games in 2017-2018 and has huge potential. The Sun Belt is getting Marshall, USM which hasn't finished two games over .500 in five years, an Old Dominion that has had one winning season in FBS (goes back to 2014), and an FCS.

Sorry, but it's hard to believe that AAC is now somehow worse than the proposed Sun Belt considering the AAC took the first six picks of the "draft," grabbed the teams with the resumes they did, and then had the Sun Belt grab four teams where one has been successful (Marshall, though not as successful as some of the ones the AAC grabbed), a USM that has been extremely average, and very bad program, and an FCS which hasn't shown the ability to do anything at the FBS level.
 
Facts don't side with your opinion. Go through the current Sagarin ratings for each school of what will be the new AAC and what is rumored to be the new Sun Belt. The new AAC is still significantly better rated, and that doesn't even take into account the large name brand advantage they will have between teams in the conferences.



Let's think about this for a minute. You say that the AAC is "just scrambling to add schools to [sic] so it . . . "

But in reality, they are raiding the exact conference that the Sun Belt is raiding, and the AAC is getting the first six picks while the Sun Belt is getting the leftovers. The AAC is getting the two teams that have combined to win the last four C-USA Championships, a third team from C-USA who is currently in the top 25, and a fourth team that won 18 games in 2017-2018 and has huge potential. The Sun Belt is getting Marshall, USM which hasn't finished two games over .500 in five years, an Old Dominion that has had one winning season in FBS (goes back to 2014), and an FCS.

Sorry, but it's hard to believe that AAC is now somehow worse than the proposed Sun Belt considering the AAC took the first six picks of the "draft," grabbed the teams with the resumes they did, and then had the Sun Belt grab four teams where one has been successful (Marshall, though not as successful as some of the ones the AAC grabbed), a USM that has been extremely average, and very bad program, and an FCS which hasn't shown the ability to do anything at the FBS level.
They took markets ! Is the SBC better team wise maybe not now but potential is there and will happen quickly IMO. Payouts from what heard not much difference after their contract redone. ESPN did this for reason kill cusa. We had no choice sorry !
 
  • Like
Reactions: 5150
They took markets ! Is the SBC better team wise maybe not now but potential is there and will happen quickly IMO. Payouts from what heard not much difference after their contract redone. ESPN did this for reason kill cusa. We had no choice sorry !

They may have taken markets, but they also took a better overall haul than the Sun Belt did. Again, all you have to do is run the Sagarin numbers for each of the proposed new conferences.

It’s hard to argue what some people on this thread have when you realize they took the teams that have won the last four C-USA championships and the only team ranked in the top 25.
 
Last edited:
They may have taken markets, but they also took a better overall haul than the Sun Belt did. Again, all you have to do is run the Safari numbers for each of the proposed new conferences.

It’s hard to argue what some people on this thread have when you realize they took the teams that have won the last four C-USA championships and the only team ranked in the top 25.
Sunbelt had two ranked last year. Where would you want us to be stay in CUSA ? We had no choice !
 
Sunbelt had two ranked last year. Where would you want us to be stay in CUSA ? We had no choice !
AAC didn’t want us and we are in the best spot left at the table !
What? How old are you? This discussion hasn’t been about Marshall staying in C-USA. This discussion hasn’t been about Marshall going to the AAC.

It was about which of the two new conferences would be better. Work on your reading before arguing against things I’ve never mentioned.
 
AAC didn’t want us and we are in the best spot left at the table !
Exactly goherd17! And - you’ll notice that spell check doesn’t propose a better choice, just throwing cold water on the proposed move. Sagarins aren’t the end all be all! The fanbase has always been southern oriented. This gives us several schools w/in an 8 hour drive of Huntington. The reaffiliation with ESPN has some damn good intrinsic value, and all the other sports (save soccer) have a home as well. We’ll have to wait 5 days for it to be official, but this is a home run imo.
WS
p.s. Who can do a layover showing the current & proposed schools?
 
What? How old are you? This discussion hasn’t been about Marshall staying in C-USA. This discussion hasn’t been about Marshall going to the AAC.

It was about which of the two new conferences would be better. Work on your reading before arguing against things I’ve never mentioned.
Really Rifle - The OP didn’t start the thread making the assertion one way or the other about AAC 2.0 vs SBC 2.0 - as usual you like to hijack threads for your own purposes. Simmer down! It is going to be, regardless of the opinions of this message board, one thing or the other. Hurling insults at fellow HN posters doesn’t reflect well…..
 
What? How old are you? This discussion hasn’t been about Marshall staying in C-USA. This discussion hasn’t been about Marshall going to the AAC.

It was about which of the two new conferences would be better. Work on your reading before arguing against things I’ve never mentioned.
I’m 54 and been Herd Fan since was 6. So have good day sir . And I think long run SBC will be better why it’s the south and they love football. Tv contracts won’t be much different IMO
 
I’m 54 and been Herd Fan since was 6. So have good day sir . And I think long run SBC will be better why it’s the south and they love football. Tv contracts won’t be much different IMO
No lie, I have been a Herd fan since I was 5. I honestly had a Marshall football short when I was in kindergarten!
 
AAC is the better conference but to claim the gap is big, simply isn't true. In fact, it's pretty d*mn close and I could see it going back and forth over the next few years, especially if SMU and Memphis go to the B12. The difference between 1st and 3rd in overall rankings is four points. The two conferences are separated by roughly two.

Through Oct. 23rd:

SMU - 77.24
Tulsa - 66.04
East Carolina - 65.04
Temple - 54.32
South Florida - 60.19
Memphis - 66.7
Navy - 60.9
Tulane - 59.06
Charlotte - 56.58
FAU - 67.46
UTSA - 74.59
UAB - 67.28
Rice - 51.97
North Texas - 51.24
Total: 878.61
Avg.: 62.76


Marshall - 67.85
ODU - 52.72
Southern Miss - 48.09
James Madison - 65.03
Appy State - 73.75
Arkansas State - 54.86
Coastal Carolina - 75.48
Georgia Southern - 54.28
Georgia State - 62.79
Louisiana - 72.08
ULM - 54.46
South Alabama - 56.53
Texas State - 50.64
Troy - 60.08
Total: 848.64
Avg.: 60.62


 
AAC is the better conference
Finally, somebody who is able to read!

but to claim the gap is big, simply isn't true.
I don’t recall anyone saying it is “big” right now. I remember somebody saying it is significant. And it is. The 2.1 difference is about the same as the difference between the SEC East and the PAC 12 South, and any sane person would much rather play the PAC 12 South over the SEC East, because the SEC East is far better . . . shown by a 2.98 difference over the PAC 12 South.

And teams more than halfway through the year tend to continue how they’ve played up to that point. So the separation is likely to widen.


. In fact, it's pretty d*mn close
No, it really isn’t. A 2.1 difference for a conference is significant.
 
It’s all relative. The gap between 1 and 2 is significant if your 2 but if you are 125, the gap between 1 and 2 is very small.

In the case of these two conferences, one additional team out of 14 having a great year . . . or a not so great year could make the difference.

The AAC is a better conference but the SBC is closing the gap and the gap isn’t nearly as big as it once was.
 
The AAC of the past few years has really occupied a space somewhere between G5 and P5. It doesn’t occupy that space anymore. The Sun Belt has done remarkably well at building its brand. The key to the Sun Belt is it is made up of teams with fan bases with passion. Not as “big time” or as many fans as elite level football, but a much better overall level of passion. I think the AAC is materially better, mainly because the SBC teams need to prove they can sustain before I trust them more than the better AAC programs. However, the two leagues solidly occupy the same space now. To your average let’s say SEC fan, I’m not sure there is much difference in an App-Marshall game and a Memphis-ECU game. I feel we will be in a good spot in the SBC. Our future and that of our conference mates will be what we make it. Commit and win.
 
Speaking basketball. There are 31 division 1 basketball conferences. Last year CUSA was ranked 13th. The SBC was 23rd. Thus their champion was forced to play in a play in game to make the tournament
 
Speaking basketball. There are 31 division 1 basketball conferences. Last year CUSA was ranked 13th. The SBC was 23rd. Thus their champion was forced to play in a play in game to make the tournament

Irrelevant going forward because the 2023 versions of C-USA and the SBC will be massively different.
 
Speaking basketball. There are 31 division 1 basketball conferences. Last year CUSA was ranked 13th. The SBC was 23rd. Thus their champion was forced to play in a play in game to make the tournament
Where was the Sun Belt rated 23rd? Sagarin had them 16th and 19th, Net had them at 18 and RPI had them 15.

And yes, their champion was forced to play in the play in game but that’s only because App State was 7-8 in conference play and went on a crazy run to win the SBC tournament.
 
Where was the Sun Belt rated 23rd? Sagarin had them 16th and 19th, Net had them at 18 and RPI had them 15.

And yes, their champion was forced to play in the play in game but that’s only because App State was 7-8 in conference play and went on a crazy run to win the SBC tournament.
Thanks for sharing the info. I actually look at the move as a tremendous opportunity for our program to take SB basketball and raise it up a notch or two. I am sure ODU feels the same.
 
  • Like
Reactions: W-S HerdFan
It’s all relative. The gap between 1 and 2 is significant if your 2 but if you are 125, the gap between 1 and 2 is very small.

In the case of these two conferences, one additional team out of 14 having a great year . . . or a not so great year could make the difference.

The AAC is a better conference but the SBC is closing the gap and the gap isn’t nearly as big as it once was.
Plus you get a bump from UTSA which is having a great season but always sucks. I say Marshall and even So. Miss are better adds than any of the teams that the AAC picked over them. Of course I am saying that based on say the past 25 years not cherry picking 2-3 seasons.
 
  • Like
Reactions: W-S HerdFan
Irrelevant going forward because the 2023 versions of C-USA and the SBC will be massively different.
I totally agree. I was just pointing out that we are joining what was a very bad basketball league. Obviously ODU, Marshall and JMU will make it stronger. Those 3 and Louisiana have probably the best basketball tradition in the what will be new SBC
 
I was just pointing out that we are joining what was a very bad basketball league.
Actually, you would be, if not wrong, at least incorrect. MU would be leaving one bottom league where the tournament champion is seeded something like 13th for another bottom league where the tournament champion is seeded something like 13th. Red apples to green apples.

21 - UNT (leaving) 18-10 13th - Appy State 17-12 16/play in
19 -ODU (leaving) 26-8 14th - Georgia State 24-9 14th
18 - Marshall (leaving) 24-10 13th - Georgia State 24-10 15th
17 - MTSU (maybe leaving for MAC) 27-7 13th - Troy 22-14 14th
16 - MTSU (maybe leaving for MAC) 24-9 15th - UALR (leaving) 29-4 12th
15 - UAB (leaving) 19-15 - Georgia State 24-9 14th

Looks like two mirror images. Win the conference, get about a 13 seed. Maybe one more gets a NIT, everybody else in the irrelevant pay-to-play nothings.

In fact, even if we reject the MTSU to the MAC rumor, that still makes MTSU the ONLY program that will remain in CUSA 4.0 that has EVER won CUSA basketball. In total national terms, CUSA 4.0 would have nothing of significance that has happened since Carl Malone played at LTU, or probably the events of Glory Road, sixty years ago.

I know DD likes to push the myth that CUSA basketball is not small time.

It is small time.
 
  • Like
Reactions: W-S HerdFan
Actually, you would be, if not wrong, at least incorrect. MU would be leaving one bottom league where the tournament champion is seeded something like 13th for another bottom league where the tournament champion is seeded something like 13th. Red apples to green apples.

21 - UNT (leaving) 18-10 13th - Appy State 17-12 16/play in
19 -ODU (leaving) 26-8 14th - Georgia State 24-9 14th
18 - Marshall (leaving) 24-10 13th - Georgia State 24-10 15th
17 - MTSU (maybe leaving for MAC) 27-7 13th - Troy 22-14 14th
16 - MTSU (maybe leaving for MAC) 24-9 15th - UALR (leaving) 29-4 12th
15 - UAB (leaving) 19-15 - Georgia State 24-9 14th

Looks like two mirror images. Win the conference, get about a 13 seed. Maybe one more gets a NIT, everybody else in the irrelevant pay-to-play nothings.

In fact, even if we reject the MTSU to the MAC rumor, that still makes MTSU the ONLY program that will remain in CUSA 4.0 that has EVER won CUSA basketball. In total national terms, CUSA 4.0 would have nothing of significance that has happened since Carl Malone played at LTU, or probably the events of Glory Road, sixty years ago.

I know DD likes to push the myth that CUSA basketball is not small time.

It is small time.
He did not push that idea. His hope was to make it better by adding JMU and Liberty. Again, that was BEFORE the CUSA defections. He would have REALLY preferred a new league with most CUSA east along with JMU and Liberty
 
He did not push that idea.
Every time he speaks, he does.
His hope was to make it better by adding JMU and Liberty.
JMU, which a whopping 5 total NCAAs, the last being 9 years ago and three of those being in a row in the early 80s, and which has fired its last FIVE coaches, all of which had losing records; and Liberty, which was in the Big South, which is right with the MAAC, HBCUs and Southland as the bottom Div I conferences not 4 seasons ago, and which is now in the hardly better ASUN, home of such powers as Central Arkansas, Kennnesaw State, and North Florida, with 5 NCAAs and one win (matching DD) do not make CUSA better.

They perpetuate what it is. A bottom one-bid conference where the winner gets seeded about 13th.

CUSA 4.0, on the other hand, will be a bottom of the bottom one-bid conference where the winner gets seeded 15th or 16th. Which is why DD wants it so.
 
Just pointing out the facts, using hard numbers and logic.

CUSA 3.0: bottom basketball conference, winner gets about a 13th seed
SBC: bottom basketball conference, winner gets about a 13th seed

CUSA 4.0: absolute bottom of the bottom basketball conference, winner will get a 15 or 16 seed.

Basketball coach advocating against football maintaining itself in a proper conference, just to make the already easy basketball path one tick easier: Fireable.
 
Finally, somebody who is able to read!


I don’t recall anyone saying it is “big” right now. I remember somebody saying it is significant. And it is. The 2.1 difference is about the same as the difference between the SEC East and the PAC 12 South, and any sane person would much rather play the PAC 12 South over the SEC East, because the SEC East is far better . . . shown by a 2.98 difference over the PAC 12 South.

And teams more than halfway through the year tend to continue how they’ve played up to that point. So the separation is likely to widen.



No, it really isn’t. A 2.1 difference for a conference is significant.

Nerd alert:

There is a way statistically to determine how "significant" that difference is....

Just run a student's T test on those sagarin rankings above.
 
  • Like
Reactions: W-S HerdFan
ADVERTISEMENT

Latest posts

ADVERTISEMENT