Sun Belt kicks out Idaho & New Mexico State

[andy4theherd]

i don't disagree with your premise, but ucf is a bad example. yeah, ucf has been around for more than 35 years, but a large portion of that was spend a d3/d2/fcs.

and you think schools creating football teams out of thin air in the 21st century would fare better?

those years at lower levels created fans.... more than making an announcement saying "University of Chicago West Side is starting a football team tomorrow"....

 

[herdit44]

and you think schools creating football teams out of thin air in the 21st century would fare better?

those years at lower levels created fans.... more than making an announcement saying "University of Chicago West Side is starting a football team tomorrow"....

it's not easy and i'm not sure they'd fare better, but it's an apples to oranges comparison. the programs that are moving up today are spending only a handful of years below fbs level, they're largely building a fan base at the fbs level. ucf spend 30 years as a lower level team, charlotte spent 2, fiu spent 3, fau spent 4...

 

[connsinfonia]

I've said this before, but ODU and UNCC both have some serious BBall history in addition to their market size.

UNCC was a pretty serious contender in CUSA 1.0 (when CUSA was a major conference in BBall) before the basketball-only schools were kicked out. They've been a bit down since then, but still have as many good seasons as bad, and a few NIT appearances.

ODU has six losing seasons in the last twenty-four, and one in the last twelve. They have 7/4 NCAA appearances in the span, 5/2 NIT, 4 CIT/CBI in those two time-spans. This means they've missed a tournament eight times in the last twenty-four seasons, twice in the past twelve. They also have a better chance than we do of adding another winning season to those numbers this year.

And yeah, both schools aren't that great in football. But they've had teams what, a combined ten years, and a combined three years in FBS? They're doing pretty good, if you ask me. And these are two schools which know how to spend on athletics, and started football and joined FBS because they want to succeed in athletics. They'll get much better, and sooner than people seem to think. Give ODU two more years, Charlotte four, and they'll be very surprising.

 

[Herdmeister]

If it were all about student numbers and markets, UCF would be in the SEC. The size of school doesn't mean squat. UNCC and ODU have not impressed me in the least, in anything.

I would love to have had the basketball success of either of them.

 

[letsgoreds]

You do KNOW that the big brick things down at the east end of campus are the dorms, right

and this makes us not a commuter school compared with the other schools mentioned? I live the Herd blinders you have on sir!

 

[Herd Fever]

I've said this before, but ODU and UNCC both have some serious BBall history in addition to their market size.

UNCC was a pretty serious contender in CUSA 1.0 (when CUSA was a major conference in BBall) before the basketball-only schools were kicked out. They've been a bit down since then, but still have as many good seasons as bad, and a few NIT appearances.

ODU has six losing seasons in the last twenty-four, and one in the last twelve. They have 7/4 NCAA appearances in the span, 5/2 NIT, 4 CIT/CBI in those two time-spans. This means they've missed a tournament eight times in the last twenty-four seasons, twice in the past twelve. They also have a better chance than we do of adding another winning season to those numbers this year.

And yeah, both schools aren't that great in football. But they've had teams what, a combined ten years, and a combined three years in FBS? They're doing pretty good, if you ask me. And these are two schools which know how to spend on athletics, and started football and joined FBS because they want to succeed in athletics. They'll get much better, and sooner than people seem to think. Give ODU two more years, Charlotte four, and they'll be very surprising.

ODU and Charlotte has had the worst 2 recruiting classes in the conference the last couple years and you think they will turn things around?? Yes they are in fertile recruiting grounds but the get a scrap at the bottom of the barrel when it comes to homegrown recruits

 

[The Real SamC]

and this makes us not a commuter school compared with the other schools mentioned?

As I explained, yes, MU has many features of a "commuter school" but also a substantial dorm, off campus and "greek" housing elements as well.

The difference between MU and, say Georgia State is MU's role within West Virginia contrasted to Georgia State's role in Georgia. Fact is, as I explained, people self-select to a great degree. If sports are really important to you, then you don't go to places like GA State (UAB, ODU, UNCC, UNT, UTSA). Those states have schools with genuine true major programs of national merit. Consequently, at the end of the day, virtually no one really cares about GA State sports, which is why virtually no one attends GA State sports. Because people inclined to like sports self-select away from places like that.

WV has WVU. Hardly the same thing as Georgia (Alabama, Auburn, Texas, UNC, NC State, Texas, Texas A&M, etc).

However, MU has thousands of fans who love the Herd. Whether they went to HHS or not.

 

[andy4theherd]

it's not easy and i'm not sure they'd fare better, but it's an apples to oranges comparison. the programs that are moving up today are spending only a handful of years below fbs level, they're largely building a fan base at the fbs level. ucf spend 30 years as a lower level team, charlotte spent 2, fiu spent 3, fau spent 4...

Marshall's core 20k fanbase that show's up to every game regardless of record or opponent was built at the 1AA level...

 

[jsnisdman]

If sports are really important to you, then you don't go to places like GA State (UAB, ODU, UNCC, UNT, UTSA). Those states have schools with genuine true major programs of national merit. .

I don't know that I agree with you. Olympic sports are pretty important. Old Dominion owns 28 National Championships. I think everyone saying they have "potential" is an understatement.

 

[The Real SamC]

Olympic sports are pretty important. .

Among regular students? Really?

I have never met somebody who attended any college because they really wanted to watch world class track and field.

 

[oldeherd]

the guy thinks marshall is not a commuter school because we have some dorms on campus, but uab, charlotte, odu, and gsu are commuter schools even though they have dorms on campus. logic defies him.

To say MU is not a commuter school is asinine. What, with around 14,000 students we have at most 2000 tops on campus resident students? Largest single source of students is Huntington itself, and no doubt most of them live at home. Hell back in my day the most campus activity on Friday afternoons was the Kanawha Valley suitcasers packing and heading out back to Charleston, etc. Doubt that has changed one bit.

One factor that does need to change if MU is to significantly grow the student enrollment would be providing newer modern style dorms. Plans include demolition and replacement of the large men's dorm, Holderby Hall, and its Spartan rooms and common bathrooms with a modern dorm with suite facilities, which is what this generation of students want and expect.

 

[Herd Fever]

I don't know that I agree with you. Olympic sports are pretty important. Old Dominion owns 28 National Championships. I think everyone saying they have "potential" is an understatement.

Lol nobody gives 2 shits about Olympic Sports unless your an SEC or Big 10 school.

It's an embarrassment that schools like ODU, UNCC, and FIU are in this conference

 

[Tim Hensley]

They all bring significant metro areas.

 

[ARandomHerdFan]

 

[jsnisdman]

Lol nobody gives 2 shits about Olympic Sports unless your an SEC or Big 10 school.

It's an embarrassment that schools like ODU, UNCC, and FIU are in this conference

Actually what is embarrassing is for someone who supports a university that doesn't even have a baseball stadium to say that another conference member who has the largest athletic budget in the entire conference, better athletic facilities, and 26 more National Championships than Marshall doesn't belong. Am I missing something here?

 

[Herd Fever]

First it was 28 now it's 26

Like I said before and have always said ODU, UNCC, and FIU has no business in the conference

 

[Herdmeister]

First it was 28 now it's 26

Like I said before and have always said ODU, UNCC, and FIU has no business in the conference

I wouldn't be at all surprised that if the AAC were to expand, you won't need to worry about UNCC or ODU being in our conference. They will be invited to AAC. Way too much potential to stay down. All they needed was a commitment to football and they got it. Both are twice the size of MU with larger budgets, bigger metro areas, better recruiting areas and easier travel.

 

[jsnisdman]

First it was 28 now it's 26

Like I said before and have always said ODU, UNCC, and FIU has no business in the conference

ODU has 28 National Championships, Marshall has 2. 26 more is correct.

 

[TwolfHerdfan]

I wouldn't be at all surprised that if the AAC were to expand, you won't need to worry about UNCC or ODU being in our conference. They will be invited to AAC. Way too much potential to stay down. All they needed was a commitment to football and they got it. Both are twice the size of MU with larger budgets, bigger metro areas, better recruiting areas and easier travel.

You can't be serious? WOW!

 

[Chris McLaughlin]

You can't be serious? WOW!

I get the surprise/shock but if you take a step back and think about it, everything @Herdmeister said is true.

 

[andy4theherd]

ODU has 28 National Championships, Marshall has 2. 26 more is correct.

bwwahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha

ODU
woman's basketball NC x3
men's and woman's sailing x15
woman's field hockey x9

bwahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha



and technically we have 3.... 2 in football and 1 in men's basketball (1947 NAIA)

incoming academic smack is incoming.......

 

[andy4theherd]

bragging about sailing and women's field hockey championships has to rank up there with UCF fan's inventing booing........

 

[Herd Fever]

These ODU fans haven't grasp the concept of being a G5 program yet. When your in the G5 the only sport that matter is football and your success there.

Nobody gives a **** about Sailing......point black
When was the last time ODU was nationally competitive in Woman's basketball? The 90s??
And Field Hockey LMFAO, the only people that care about field hockey are the creeps that want to see women running around in skirts.

Like it said, it was a VAST MISTAKE FOR CUSA TO BRING IN ODU

 

[TwolfHerdfan]

I get the surprise/shock but if you take a step back and think about it, everything @Herdmeister said is true.

It may be true but adding those two would not help the AAC's cause in attaining P5 status. IF they ever are seriously considered. And I doubt ECU would want UNCC in the league. jmo

 

[Herd Fever]

I get the surprise/shock but if you take a step back and think about it, everything @Herdmeister said is true.

It's might be true about their market, budget, and facilities.

But their athletic prestige is for a program who should have stayed at the 1AA level. I could point out many 1AA programs with an higher budget or has better facilities than us. But they still don't have the athletic prestige as a Marshall or Southern Miss or a UTEP, or Louisiana Tech.

ODU, UNCC, FIU, and North Texas should have either broke in thru the Sun Belt or stayed there

 

[Chris McLaughlin]

It may be true but adding those two would not help the AAC's cause in attaining P5 status. IF they ever are seriously considered. And I doubt ECU would want UNCC in the league. jmo

Agreed. I was just commenting on the facts Herdmeister listed.

 

[andy4theherd]

the only people that care about field hockey are the creeps that want to see women running around in skirts.

why you gotta bring Walden into this?

 

[jsnisdman]

These ODU fans haven't grasp the concept of being a G5 program yet. When your in the G5 the only sport that matter is football and your success there.

Hey Einstein, I'm a Marshall fan. Notice that I've been on this board longer than both you and Andy? I just prefer to read and not engage in such trivial matters as I'm overseas representing the good ole' U-S-A in more important matters.

 

[Herd Fever]

Hey Einstein, I'm a Marshall fan. Notice that I've been on this board longer than both you and Andy? I just prefer to read and not engage in such trivial matters as I'm overseas representing the good ole' U-S-A in more important matters.

Cool Beans

 

[The Real SamC]

The number of people that care that ODU won a championship is women's sailing (not recognized by NCAA, only 19 schools even have sailing) , or field hockey (last one was when current students were 2) is very close to zero. I'm sure some people care about women's basketball. Which ODU was good at, three decades ago.

This does not change the point that the "potential" of these schools is very low. Because if you care about sports, and you live in that state you self-select towards Virginia or Virginia Tech. People that don't care that much about sports make other decisions, and those people fill the ranks of the alumni. Same in all these other "high potential" programs.

The idea that you can just look at a school's town size or enrollment as a number without any analysis (which is, pretty much the AAC Lie) and say it has "potential" is, well, stupid. Imagine a conference with teams in such megaopolises like Oxford, College Station, Starkville, Athens, Gainsville, Auburn, Tuscalossa, and Fayetteville, et al. Seem to be doing OK.

 

[Herd Fever]

I can only think of only a few programs that are located in Major US cities and have been successful

USC
UCLA
Texas
Miami
Florida State
Ohio State
Pittsburgh
Minnesota

 

[andy4theherd]

Hey Einstein, I'm a Marshall fan. Notice that I've been on this board longer than both you and Andy? I just prefer to read and not engage in such trivial matters as I'm overseas representing the good ole' U-S-A in more important matters.

further proof nobody gives a shit about ODU... they don't even have fans here defending their honor.....

thanks for your service though! my brother-in-law is on the Truman kicking ISIS ass while we argue about sports.

 

[herdit44]

since you included minneapolis on your list as a major city and "successful" is a relative term, others you'd have to include are:

miami
nc state
georgia tech
arizona
unlv
louisville
vanderbilt
memphis
boston college
tcu

 

[Herd Fever]

I included Miami, but I cant believe I forgot about BC, Georgia Tech, NC State, Arizona(even though I would consider Tucson just a huge college town)

UNLV and Memphis are G5 Programs, Vanderbilt historically sucks in Football, and TCU is in Fort Worth not Dallas

 

[herdit44]

I included Miami, but I cant believe I forgot about BC, Georgia Tech, NC State, Arizona(even though I would consider Tucson just a huge college town)

UNLV and Memphis are G5 Programs, Vanderbilt historically sucks in Football, and TCU is in Fort Worth not Dallas

like i said, "success" is relative. memphis and unlv do have a good bit of basketball success. vanderbilt sucks mostly in football, but have had a lot of success with their other sports, and they're still an sec program.

tucson and fort worth are both larger cities than minneapolis, hell fort worth by itself is the 16th largest city in the united states ahead of cities like charlotte, detroit, denver, seattle, boston, etc.

 

[WV_Celt]

Sailing is almost as impressive rifle.....

 

[The Real SamC]

Texas is a statewide school, and while Austin is fast growing today, the town could hardly be described as a "major city" even as late as the mid 80s.

Las Vegas was one fifth the size it is now when UNLV was big.

Tallahassee's TV market is half the size of ours.

Louisville is borderline a "major city".

Vanderbilt is unsuccessful.

Those are nitpicks, really. I agree with Herd Fever's point.

If market size mattered, Chicago and NYU would fight it out, every year.

 

[Herd Fever]

Texas is a statewide school, and while Austin is fast growing today, the town could hardly be described as a "major city" even as late as the mid 80s.

Las Vegas was one fifth the size it is now when UNLV was big.

Tallahassee's TV market is half the size of ours.

Louisville is borderline a "major city".

Vanderbilt is unsuccessful.

Those are nitpicks, really. I agree with Herd Fever's point.

If market size mattered, Chicago and NYU would fight it out, every year.

What would you consider a Major City and a Large City?(Not trying to be condescending since we agree here)

For me it is a City in the TOp 15 would be Major and all cities from 16-49 as large

 

[herdit44]

What would you consider a Major City and a Large City?(Not trying to be condescending since we agree here)

For me it is a City in the TOp 15 would be Major and all cities from 16-49 as large

i personally like how the 11th largest city in the united states isn't a major city, but the 30th largest city is borderline in his eyes. even if you go by metro area, austin is still larger than louisville. must be similar to his definition of a commuter campus.

 

[Jeepers Creepers]

Sailing is almost as impressive rifle.....

At least Rifle is an NCAA-sanctioned sport.

#17AndCounting