I've seen and heard some recent hate on Danny D and the program and don't understand it. Like it or not we are rebuilding, and doing it well. The amount of young talent we have on the floor is exciting. With the departure of Sustic we have ZERO seniors. If you can't see how much IB and Marco have grown already this season you're blind. Taylor is going to be a good one. We lost 60 points a game with Elmore, Burks, and Watson. You don't just replace that overnight at a school like Marshall. We are not Duke, UNC, or KY. I am disappointed with the development of a few players, but I put that on the kids, not the staff. You can give them opportunities, but can't force them to work. Those kids one day will realize the opportunity they missed and regret it. We are going to compete for titles, and though we main not win every year, we are going to have some local talent that our kids can look up to. #GoHerds
To the Basketball Haters
- Thread starter leftygolfer1
- Start date
I am not a basketball hater, I am a basketball realist, who do we ever beat of any note? The idea we are improving is starting to sound a lot like we hear in football. We have a real contrast in our two primary sport head coaches, one won't say anything and the other one won't shut up. They do appear to have one thing in common, neither is overly endowed with coaching ability.
Jesus Christ, I hate the term “haters”. Who “hates” anything concerning Marshall on this board, outside of our wvu-staying-at-home-for-bowl-season friends?
I like the team we have, but we’re an average team with a lot of growing to do and a lot of potential for growth with the young talent. But stop with the “haters” BS. It’s ok to criticize things you don’t like...like getting your doors blown off by a MAC school on your home floor.
I like the team we have, but we’re an average team with a lot of growing to do and a lot of potential for growth with the young talent. But stop with the “haters” BS. It’s ok to criticize things you don’t like...like getting your doors blown off by a MAC school on your home floor.
Roster building is a major role of a head coach in any sport at the college level. Losing a ton of production to graduation is on Dan.
Jesus, this is phenomenal. So coaches do a bad job of recruiting character, do a bad job of their due diligence in who they sign, fail to motivate their players, and can’t get them to do the most basic of functions of why the players are given $80,000+ scholarships, and it’s no fault of the coaches.
Not being a Duke or UK has nothing to do with player development. If anything Marshall has a benefit in today’s college basketball climate in terms of player development. Kids aren’t bolting after one year. Obviously you’re not just going to insert an Elmore or Burks but you can and should easily have a team that can beat Toledo and Akron. It’s Dan’s 6th season. With the success the program has had this season should have started much differently. That’s not me being a “hater”. I do agree and have made it known on here many times that these kids will be good. It’s going to take time for them to develop and they are doing that with each game. I’m frustrated with things such as getting our brains beat in by Toledo at home but I’m also not going to let that get in the way of me celebrating the success the team has either. I have no doubt that come February/March this team will be solid and can very easily make a run for the CUSA championship again. Next year I think they will be very competitive. This is a fun team to watch, especially with Taylor in the mix now. I agree with Sean though, enough with the haters nonsense. The expectations were set in the 2017-18 season and now people expect that to continue. Don’t you? I wouldn’t waste my time posting on here if I didn’t think the team had any potential. About the only person you will find who does that on here is Sam C or someone who’s for an opposing team.
Speaking of Sam: A request. If you (Sam) have taken the opportunity to watch Taylor in the last 3 games, what are your initial impressions? Reigning CUSA freshman of the week. You are always touting your basketball acumen, so how does the young man help this team going forward?
Merry Christmas to all!
Merry Christmas to all!
First, totally associate with Sean Hammond's comments. No one "hates" the basketball staff and certainly no the team. My only purposes were, first to discuss basketball, something some here simply do not want to do, then second to discuss it in a fair and non-delusional basis, as some of the things said here remind of the WVU fan base at its most delusional, which is sad.
As to this team, they are what we thought they are. Duquesne looks very tough, and then comes CUSA, which is what it always has been, plenty of empty wins available. Lowest pod in this idiotic bonus play deal, quick exit.
As to this team, they are what we thought they are. Duquesne looks very tough, and then comes CUSA, which is what it always has been, plenty of empty wins available. Lowest pod in this idiotic bonus play deal, quick exit.
Yes, but what is your opinion of Andrew Taylor, now that you have seen him play?
I doubt Sam has seen Taylor play. I've seen him play and he is just what this team needs. Knows what to do with the ball, who to get it to, when to shoot, when not to shoot.
Probably a fair statement. Of course with CUSA being such a bad league, lots of empty wins are available. Ending in the lowest pod will also provide a lighter schedule in February. But this team is going nowhere, and it is really sad to think otherwise. Fandom is great. Supporting your team is great. Go Herd. But reason is a part of things, and it is unreasonable to think elsewise than this is a lost year already..
Where did the football team go this year? Nowhere! And it was a lost season!
Why does it always have to be basketball vs football? Both are average currently. Neither should be.
I don’t get it either. I also don’t j deter and why some men can’t provide constructive criticism without being up in Doc jock strap or DD jock. Both have some terrible losses on their resume holding the program back. Both have plenty of questionable recruiting misses. We all knew Elmore and Burkes were gone after last year but we did not have anybody backing Elmore up last year. We should have had a freshman playing last year ready to step in and go along with Taylor as it was questionable he would be playing until the second semester.
why hasn’t Green developed more in football? There are plenty of valid questions within both programs at Marshall but the basketball lovers see nothing wrong with them and the football defenders see nothing wrong there.
I am looking for some signature wins in both sports or at least some quality OOC wins. Outside of Wichita State in the tournament who have we beat in OOC play in basketball? In football we haven’t been able to win a nice OOC win against a P5 team since Purdue. Maybe next year we can get one with two big home games. At least I hope so. Should be fun.
I would actually be fine with WVU's success. Going to the tournament damn near every year and a Final Four in the last decade. I understand why Dan talks all the time, it's for recognition. At some point you need to produce.
We don't have to be a Blue Blood level program. But we need a coach who can win Conference USA. In Basketball and Football. We don't have that in either sport right now. That makes us a low level program.
The program two years ago made the NCAA tourney and won a game. When was the last time that took place? Like Never! Come on man its a rebuilding season and by the end of the year this team will be much improved, and honestly if the NCAA had the done the right thing and let Taylor play this would be looking way different in the W column.
No doubt Taylor is a distributor and can get the ball to open, hopefully, teammates. This should allow West, for one, to get better, more open, shots. But unless some of our better shooters can start hitting with greater accuracy, we will still be a very average team at best. Surely, players like Williams cannot continue to shoot in the 20 to low 30 percent range from distance the entire season. Team as a whole needs to work diligently on SHOOTING, IMO. West can't continue to miss too many foul shots; Kinsey and Brooks-Harris with all their athleticism and leaping ability need to concentrate on their shooting from 15 feet in, and in the paint, close to the basket. All the "oohs" and "aahs" from a high wire move mean nothing afterwards if followed up with bricks for shots!! Better shooting overall will cure a lot of this team's current ills. Hopefully we'll see significant improvement in that area as the season progresses!
I think it comes down to whats used to "be critical" of either sport:
In basketball, its, "Dan needs to do better" "We're young and have to develop." "The season is early, hopefully we can recover." "I liked the effort by ______ we just need to execute better."
Vs.
"Doc needs to be fired" "MU is accepting of mediocrity" "Isaiah Green is TERRIBLE! AWFUL!" "This team is PATHETIC!!!"
There are literal threads dedicated to questioning everything about the football program over a 10 pt loss to someone but there is relatively little pessimism over a 30 pt loss in basketball.
One is not nearly as brutal as the other.
When people like goddamn Sam attempt to find optimism in a major letdown football season, he's ridiculed by everyone on here by being a Doc defender.
Leftygolfer basically says, 'I won't blame the coaching staff for our relative lack of prepararion and inexcusable blowout losses. Thats on the players! Its their fault! Not Dan's and they'll learn their lesson someday!'
Whats the difference between the two? Not much. Both are admitting the teams are not as good as they could be but also trying to find positives within.
Except one is being accepted as a status quo for criticism while the other sounds like a presidential tweet.
I have said Dan is on course to have a 2016 football season this year...so far its looking like it. But there aren't any "Fire Dan" threads. No pessimistic comments reading like its Doomsday or anything. Its hopeful posts and accepted positive notes from the losses.
Yet, even when the football team wins, its never enough and treated as such...as though MU can't simply win, it has to have a criteria of winning and unless it fits that exact list, it doesn't count.
MU fans might be the only fans that complain when their football team wins...but are totally silent in criticism when MU basketball wins an ugly game against a terrible lower level program.
At least the football coaches get off their butts and recruit a much larger area .From what I hear is DD does not want to leave his office and leaves recruiting to his assistants.
I have some similar thoughts. I don’t understand how a decent amount of our fans make excuses for some of the losses we have in basketball and then make excuses why we WIN games in football.
to me both teams warrant criticism. There is nothing wrong with constructive criticism in ALL sports. I guess I just think you can applaud sports and be critical as well. That doesn’t mean you are a homer or hater. Facts are we haven’t beaten anybody in OOC since we beat WVU in basketball but is ok because we did win an NCAA tournament. On the football side the comments are we haven’t beaten anybody with a pulse yet we beat La Tech and FAU (on their home field).
the truth is in football we have had some decent wins but we have lost way too many games we shouldn’t lose. There is no reason we shouldn’t have played for the championship this year. In Hoops we shouldn’t be accepting of blow out losses at home to MAC teams. We shouldn’t be having to make up for the loss of Elmore and Burkes this year. Should we have a step back some...sure but we should have had a PG playing last year preparing for this year.
I want all programs to be successful no matter who the coaches are. I just want to win and. It hear excuses why we lose.
lexky - if you think about it, DD did recruit a pg for the 17-18 season. West played the point position the last 2 seasons, starting as a freshman. I think ppl don’t regard him as a point guard. MU could get away w/ it because of Elmore and CJ. Then, Taylor lands in our laps last fall, so they knew he was going to be playing starting mid-December. If he stays, Andrew will play the 1 for 4 years. Unlike football, where you can have 3-4 point guards (read QB’s) on the roster, there aren’t enough spots to recruit quality starting point guards.
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I agree to a point however there still should have been one more PG/G ready to play. You have to have someone step in. We knew we were losing two studs only had one guy ready.
that is just like we weren’t prepared for Penava jumping ship. We were counting on a big guy that needed to be in shape. There should have been someone else to help Penava had he been there but we had too many recruiting misses. Sure we have had some great one but you can’t have the misses when you only have 13 scholarship players. We have had way too many over the years.
…...I think your last sentence would apply to about 90% of Division I basketball programs......and as for Peneva, my only criticism on the staff was not babysitting the kid through that 2-3 weeks of time when he was most vulnerable to the guy whispering in his ear about e & fortune....
In my mind DD was counting Taylor being about to play from the start but the NCAA was stupid. Remember Elmore won his fight against the NCAA but I assume Taylor's father is not an attorney. If Taylor had played the first 10 games we would have won 6 or 7 of them but now DD has this group for two full years. Should be fun
I don't follow Herd basketball closely. But I keep reading poor shooting is a concern. Indiana is not far away from Huntington, and there are plenty of shooters that go to MAC, MVC, and OVC programs. Maybe Dan should head out my way and try to get some of these kids.
I’d say whipping the Dukes by 22 gives us some good momentum going into 1/2 Rice conf opener
Nice 22 point win against a 10-1 Duquesne team.
Getting better every game.
Getting better every game.
The problem is you never admit when you are wrong, you just disappear. This will prove to be wrong. I don’t expect to win the conference this year..but I believe we are gaining some confidence and will finish in the top half.
with the NCAA you can’t count on that plus a reserve would have been with the program last year for a full season before Taylor ever transferred here. We would have recruited well ahead of when we got Taylor. We knew several years ago Elmore and Burkes would be fine after last year.
i tray like Taylor. I just think we needed more preparation ahead of him. Too many scholarship have been given to players that haven’t worked out and are tied up.
I really cant debate your point and agree but DD is doing a better job then the last 5 MU hoops coaches including winning an NCAA tourney game. I think he deserves the benefit. BTW, in this transfer rich age of college hoops Bob Huggins recruited a bunch of kids that didn't work out as well. the problem at MU is DD has to recruit kids and develop them. That process takes time and some kids will bust. The good news is he has his team in place for this year and and next. Enjoy the ride
GoHerdMarshallYe. You made the statement of the year when speaking of Doc versus DD. While the accomplishments are similar " one is accepted as status quo for criticism while the other sounds like a presidential tweet." .Man that is classic.
The accomplishments are similar. But if there's no improvement in the next 5 years, then I suspect there will be more calls for Dan's head, just like for Doc.
Without doubt both programs can improve.Both programs are playing at a average level.However, neither are a train wreck. Both coaches are IMO doing a solid job of keeping us competitive with limited resources and a dwindling fan base. Not saying we shouldn't shoot for the stars but why be miserable 365 days a year because we didn't win the conference.I love Marshall and glad it is one of the schools I graduated from. That being said,we have to be good at selling to out recruit others. Hitting a homerun with every recruiting class is not easy. Even Bob Pruitt had some bad classes mixed in with good ones. There are other places that are nicer, try driving outside Cabell County sometime. MH should be looking right now for up and comers to pursue after next season.I am convinced next year will be Doc's last. I see us having nother 8-4 type season and that will be average enough for many to force a retirement or firing. Hope DD continues to coach at least another 4-5 years.
This talk of Dan not doing a good job all of sudden because the NCAA didn't allow Taylor to play the first semester blows my mind! Do you realize that team we beat yesterday was 10-1?
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