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Which one is better?

ohio herd

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Just for fun. I am curious. Lets say the basketball team goes 14-14 in the regular season. Then say they get hot and win the Tourney and go to the Big Dance. Lets also say the football team goes 10-3 but loses in the Conference championship game. Which team was better?
 
Since you're playing make believe here, can we answer the question as though both athletic teams were participating members of a legitimate D1 conference?
 
Legit fun message board question asked

Typical unsolicited negative reply by Someone somehow turning the hypothetical question into a way to demean the athletic program he/she is an alleged fan of.

Simply baffling.

I would say the answer that would be given the most on here would be b-ball since they were champions and that is all that matters.

An interesting what if. Would have been our 2000 season.

Who was better. B-ball goes 18-9
And finishes 2nd in the Mac east but gets upset in the first round. Or football who goes 6-5 with three conference losses in the MAC but backs into the championship game and wins it.

Flip the year from 2000 to 2020 would your answer be the same?
 
Winning your conference in basketball gets you in the biggest tournament in which fans all across the country know your name. Winning cusa in football gets you in a mid December afternoon game against a mediocre no name team.

So basketball winning no matter what trumps football.
 
Just for fun. I am curious. Lets say the basketball team goes 14-14 in the regular season. Then say they get hot and win the Tourney and go to the Big Dance. Lets also say the football team goes 10-3 but loses in the Conference championship game. Which team was better?
A lot of factors go into such a great question like this. The fact that the groundhog did not see his shadow, I think that favors the basketball team. Being an election and census year, I think favors the football team.

Totally a 50/50 tossup. Inspires great thought.
 
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Legit fun message board question asked

Typical unsolicited negative reply by Someone somehow turning the hypothetical question into a way to demean the athletic program he/she is an alleged fan of.

Simply baffling.

I would say the answer that would be given the most on here would be b-ball since they were champions and that is all that matters.

An interesting what if. Would have been our 2000 season.

Who was better. B-ball goes 18-9
And finishes 2nd in the Mac east but gets upset in the first round. Or football who goes 6-5 with three conference losses in the MAC but backs into the championship game and wins it.

Flip the year from 2000 to 2020 would your answer be the same?
You know Aaron the crazy thing about that 2000 season is we really didn't deserve the title. The MAC had a weird tie breaker system so we won the east that year even though we had the same record in conference 5-3 as Ohio. Ohio beat us that year in the head to head and had a better record 7-4 vs our 6-5. The reason we were declared champs of the east was because our east record was 4-1 and Ohio was 3-2. After that season they changed the system. It worked out great for us but sucked for Ohio.Had that system not been in place we never would have won a title that year. Life is funny some times how things work out. PS I am glad we won that title
 
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Football because of the totality of the season. A 14-14 basketball team is a disappointment even if they luck out and win the tourney.

8-5 in football is also a disappointing season.
 
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This is not a bash football response. But winning the conference tournament in basketball gets you to the big dance. So you are 1 of 64 teams that have a theoretically chance to win the national championship. I know that it’s not a big chance but it’s a chance. Softball, Soccer and basketball have recently felt that excitement and unfortunately football never will. Playing for a national championship trumps any bowl game. So other than the Access Bowl nothing is bigger in football at Marshall than winning the basketball conference tournament championship.

It was the same during our glory years. We finished the 1999 football season undefeated, we had a heisman finalist and first round draft pick QB and because we didn’t make a BCS bowl we played in the Motor City Bowl in December and nobody cared. It’s not a slight against what that team accomplished it’s just from a national perspective because of the difference between P5 and G5 and the fact that G5’s have zero chance for a National Championship, only a BCS game (formally) or a Access bowl currently means anything from a national perspective.
 
Winning your conference in basketball gets you in the biggest tournament in which fans all across the country know your name.

And if you ask the same fans who beat Wich St in the first round on the 2018 Tournament, no one has a clue or gives a shit. So no Marshall Basketball is not a household name.

Now back to the original question. I have looked for the Neilson Ratings for our game vs. Wich St and cannot find them. I will bet anything our viewership
for USF Bowl and UCF last year surpassed the Friday game in San Diego. If I remember right the Gasprilla Bowl vs USF had slightly over 1 million views. I would be hard pressed to think a First Round afternoon matchup would surpass that.
 
Legit fun message board question asked

Typical unsolicited negative reply by Someone somehow turning the hypothetical question into a way to demean the athletic program he/she is an alleged fan of.

Simply baffling.
how was my response unsolicited when the OP obviously was soliciting responses? I'm not a fan of your program, nor have I alleged to be. It's people like you and your response that makes being a fan of your program not worthwhile.
 
And if you ask the same fans who beat Wich St in the first round on the 2018 Tournament, no one has a clue or gives a shit. So no Marshall Basketball is not a household name.

Now back to the original question. I have looked for the Neilson Ratings for our game vs. Wich St and cannot find them. I will bet anything our viewership
for USF Bowl and UCF last year surpassed the Friday game in San Diego. If I remember right the Gasprilla Bowl vs USF had slightly over 1 million views. I would be hard pressed to think a First Round afternoon matchup would surpass that.

I found that information in about 10 seconds and you are incorrect... Marshall and Wichita State basketball in the NCAA tourney drew 1.22 million viewers... Marshall and UCF football drew 1.15 million viewers (side note, it was UCF's least viewed bowl game ever).
 
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And if you ask the same fans who beat Wich St in the first round on the 2018 Tournament, no one has a clue or gives a shit. So no Marshall Basketball is not a household name.

Now back to the original question. I have looked for the Neilson Ratings for our game vs. Wich St and cannot find them. I will bet anything our viewership
for USF Bowl and UCF last year surpassed the Friday game in San Diego. If I remember right the Gasprilla Bowl vs USF had slightly over 1 million views. I would be hard pressed to think a First Round afternoon matchup would surpass that.


I think it was Hamrick that said the PR from the NCAA win was off the charts good and worth millions of dollars in publicity that we ordinarily wouldn't get. No one remembers any bowl games except the national championship. Winning a league title in any sport would trump a good season without that, the exception being a run in a post season tourney or MAJOR bowl - which we would never get in football if we don't win the league. jmho
 
I think it was Hamrick that said the PR from the NCAA win was off the charts good and worth millions of dollars in publicity that we ordinarily wouldn't get. No one remembers any bowl games except the national championship. Winning a league title in any sport would trump a good season without that, the exception being a run in a post season tourney or MAJOR bowl - which we would never get in football if we don't win the league. jmho

The biggest factor in terms of PR is the amount of people who "care" about the NCAA tournament, if for no other reason than they filled out a bracket and are gambling in some form... If a team like MU pulls an upset, not only do you get the week worth of national television/online exposure but you get millions of people looking you up to see if they should pick you in their bracket or if you might pull another upset.

Making the big dance is great... Winning a game (or more) is absolute gravy for the small conference schools... The key is to do it on a semi-regular basis and not wait 20+ years between tournament appearances.
 
The whole thing is a fallacy - its based on the idea that the success is the cause and the elevation of the program the symptom, when it's reversed.

While I'm sure many will blue-faced argue against this, winning the conference tournament and going to the NCAA's in 2018 did not tangibly change the position or trajectory of our basketball program. There has been no massive influx of talent, or huge pour-in of donations from throughout the community. Two years later, we're still here, doing the same thing, with about the same level of players, and hoping we can get lucky again. (Unfortunately, unless one of you guys has $100 million and knows some Nike AAU reps, this is sort of what we're stuck with.)

Elevating a program puts you in the range of winning titles and big games; if you manage to pull it off semi-consistently, you build a reputation, and people start to think of your program differently. A lucky win will get your name in peoples' mouths for a minute, but unless you're back again next year, nobody outside your fanbase will see what you did as anything but an anomaly.
 
I found that information in about 10 seconds and you are incorrect... Marshall and Wichita State basketball in the NCAA tourney drew 1.23 million viewers... Marshall and UCF football drew 1.15 million viewers (side note, it was UCF's least viewed bowl game ever).

Not to mention the multiple repeated showings of the game and results on the tv later that night.
 
Reality:

- Nice THEORETICAL question. Fact is MU has a one in 100000 chance of again having an upset win in the CUSA tournament, so it is like asking “which would be better, having a rich uncle you never heard about leave you a billion $$, or winning the lottery?” Fact is, you have a better chance at catching coronavirus than either.

- Which is better? How about DEMANDING EXCELLENCE in basketball, sailing though this box of cupcakes, and talking about the NCAA with realism as soon as January, and getting a realistic seed such that winning a game, or two, or three, is not an upset? As to football, sad that the theoretical dreams of most involve MU losing, rather than winning.

- All of this “big dance” non-sense. It is a symptom of Marshall fans, MU being named neither for a state nor a city; and of WVians generally, WV being a back-water place mostly and the whole “I have a cousin from Richmond” meme, that winning at sports = “name recognition”. Quick, name, without ever looking it up, every team in last year’s tournament, their school colors, where they are located, public or private, and mascot. If you cannot, and you cannot, you have no argument.

- What RhinoD and herdalicious said is true. This program did not get any better by making the NCAAs once, every 30 or so years. We are, bluntly, mediocre. We accept mediocrity.
 
The whole thing is a fallacy - its based on the idea that the success is the cause and the elevation of the program the symptom, when it's reversed.

While I'm sure many will blue-faced argue against this, winning the conference tournament and going to the NCAA's in 2018 did not tangibly change the position or trajectory of our basketball program. There has been no massive influx of talent, or huge pour-in of donations from throughout the community. Two years later, we're still here, doing the same thing, with about the same level of players, and hoping we can get lucky again. (Unfortunately, unless one of you guys has $100 million and knows some Nike AAU reps, this is sort of what we're stuck with.)

Elevating a program puts you in the range of winning titles and big games; if you manage to pull it off semi-consistently, you build a reputation, and people start to think of your program differently. A lucky win will get your name in peoples' mouths for a minute, but unless you're back again next year, nobody outside your fanbase will see what you did as anything but an anomaly.


Isn’t this true for about 300 other D1 basketball programs. Same could be said for football as well. Of the 130 or so programs that play D1 football at the FBS level, maybe 10 garner a vast majority of the coverage and championships year in and year out. Jmo
 
Reality:

- Nice THEORETICAL question. Fact is MU has a one in 100000 chance of again having an upset win in the CUSA tournament, so it is like asking “which would be better, having a rich uncle you never heard about leave you a billion $$, or winning the lottery?” Fact is, you have a better chance at catching coronavirus than either.

- Which is better? How about DEMANDING EXCELLENCE in basketball, sailing though this box of cupcakes, and talking about the NCAA with realism as soon as January, and getting a realistic seed such that winning a game, or two, or three, is not an upset? As to football, sad that the theoretical dreams of most involve MU losing, rather than winning.

- All of this “big dance” non-sense. It is a symptom of Marshall fans, MU being named neither for a state nor a city; and of WVians generally, WV being a back-water place mostly and the whole “I have a cousin from Richmond” meme, that winning at sports = “name recognition”. Quick, name, without ever looking it up, every team in last year’s tournament, their school colors, where they are located, public or private, and mascot. If you cannot, and you cannot, you have no argument.

- What RhinoD and herdalicious said is true. This program did not get any better by making the NCAAs once, every 30 or so years. We are, bluntly, mediocre. We accept mediocrity.

When Doc wins another league title and gets an Access Bowl bid, let me know.
 
I found that information in about 10 seconds and you are incorrect... Marshall and Wichita State basketball in the NCAA tourney drew 1.23 million viewers... Marshall and UCF football drew 1.15 million viewers (side note, it was UCF's least viewed bowl game ever).

Well after some trying, obviously I'm not as good with Google as you. Can you post the links to educate me on how you found it? Not being a jerk, I really cant find it.
 
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Fact is MU has a one in 100000 chance of again having an upset win in the CUSA tournament.

Not a fact. Ridiculous exaggeration and conjecture.

How about DEMANDING EXCELLENCE in basketball, sailing though this box of cupcakes, and talking about the NCAA with realism as soon as January, and getting a realistic seed such that winning a game, or two, or three, is not an upset?

How does one DEMAND EXCELLENCE in your view? Does it involve making up ridiculous exaggerations like 100000 to one odds or 50 point spreads and declaring them as "facts"? Or does one just need to avoid any statements that indicate that they might actually enjoy watching and being a fan of Herd basketball? Is an optimistic statement not allowable? Because I know any time someone posts something that may be considered optimistic, you do come back here and spout your "realism" and accuse the poster of being "no better than delusional WVU fanboys".

We are, bluntly, mediocre. We accept mediocrity.

Ahh...there it is...that SamC "realism" again. What's the intent of this statement? Are you expecting everyone to read this, take a deep look inside, and say "You know what? The Real SamC is right...I need to stop having any hope and just mope around and make sky-is-falling statements about how basketball sucks and spread some misery." (Side note - was there ever a fake SamC? Or is this just your constant reminder to the rest of us that you're a "realist" and aren't capable of optimism or enjoyment?)

Letsgoherd1106 was right in the other thread. Sam, and his attitude, is a gimmick. He does a good job at getting us all riled up with the "FACTS" and "REALISM" and all the history lessons and the anecdotes about being no better than WVU fans, but there's no substance here. There's no solutions presented. Just a lot of thin "we have to demand more!!!" and "we accept mediocrity!!!" The one thing that isn't mediocre? His ability to get responses (and yes I know I'm feeding right into it right now). Since obviously that's the goal, I'll go ahead and say it - Good job, Sam. I can't say you're worth the price of admission here, but you're definitely something.
 
found that information in about 10 seconds and you are incorrect... Marshall and Wichita State basketball in the NCAA tourney drew 1.23 million viewers... Marshall and UCF football drew 1.15 million viewers (side note, it was UCF's least viewed bowl game ever).

Source?
 
Not a fact. Ridiculous exaggeration and conjecture.

Hyperbole at best. But seriously do you see this crew of s***birds having anything more than a being struck by lightening chance? Really? Seriously? This team isn’t any good. The only saving grace is nobody they play is very good either.


How does one DEMAND EXCELLENCE in your view?


If you don’t know, nothing I say can explain it to you.

Stopping saying “I’m OK with it” is a big start.



Is an optimistic statement not allowable?

Accuse the poster of being "no better than delusional WVU fanboys".

First, I’m not in charge of what is or is not “allowed” in the first place. But is if OK to be “optimistic” ? Sure it is. But optimism and delusion are two different things.

An optimist, looking at this team, would look for, I don’t know, look for .600 basketball. An optimist, looking at the state of our basketball team over time would see serious issues, but an occasional puncher’s chance. Put us on a plain with Morehead State, or Radford, or Utah Valley State or any of the other 200 or so one-bid league teams. An optimist, looking at MU in the general system of college basketball, would see a school that many people outside our little group have no idea of who or what it is.

That is optimism.

Delusion, and, yes, that is the WVU fanboy trademark, is a different thing.
 
Thanks Sam for your non contribution to this thread. It wasn’t a bash football or bash basketball thread it was which would be better thread.

Sam I think what another poster said about you was true I think you are a troll. So I’m going to stop letting your continuous ultra hypocritical posts bother me anymore. You are just trolling and you think it’s really cool to be the go against the grain guy that loves to be disliked on message boards because you are a realist. By the way your accept mediocrity in basketball bullsht is so ridiculous when you act like Doc is Bear Bryant and our football team has been completely mediocre in the majority of his seasons.

the point of this thread was what would be better for Marshall I’m assuming nationally a 500 regular season basketball team winning the tournament and going to the NCAAs or having a great record in football regular season but not winning CUSA and the consensus is winning the basketball tournament. Because that gets you a chance to win the national championship something that no G5 team will ever get to do in football. So from a national perspective getting to the tourney would top anything in football outside of going to the Access Bowl. This isn’t a statement against Doc Snyder Pruett or Cam Henderson it’s just a fact of life of football in the G5.
 
Because that gets you a chance to win the national championship something that no G5 team will ever get to do in football.

In reality, anybody who thinks that any team other than the same blue bloods, even in this really out-of-whack year, where we will probably end up with a national champion that we all look back on 10 years later and say “really?”, is living in a fantasy world.

Yes, I could enter a local qualifier for the US Open, win, win the sectional, and then beat Woods and Mickelson at Winged Foot next June. Because every golfer in America has that “chance”.

But that isn’t going to actually happen, and nobody, seeing me on the practice tee, is going to say “boy, that guy has a shot at the US Open.”
 
Credit where it is due - Sam this is one of the more levelheaded posts I've seen from you. The problem is that the sentiment is hidden in waaaay too much hyperbole.

I think you see things in others' posts that literally aren't there. I don't see posts anywhere that are putting us on a pedestal with the Dukes, UK's, etc of the college basketball world. We all know where CUSA is in the pecking order (middle to high mid-major - it's not the MAAC but neither is it the AAC). We also are going to naturally have some green-tinted glasses in our views of things. We'll always see Marshall a little higher on the rungs of recognition than what might be realistic. There's no requirement that a "realist" needs to come in here and preach us all back down to earth. A bit of blissful ignorance is healthy and fine for a fan base such as ours. There aren't swaths of fans from opposing schools coming to the HerdNation message boards to see what we think about our chances at winning games we maybe shouldn't win, so when you state that we look silly or stupid to "the rest of the college basketball world" I think you're the one propping us up on a pedestal. The rest of the college basketball world doesn't care enough to come over here to laugh at us!

So this year - our record isn't good. At large bids and postseason tournaments are pretty much out of the question. The team has stunk it up at times, some of it due to questionable if not outright bad coaching decisions, recruiting practices, player attitudes, and so on. That's true and it's done and there ain't much we can do about it at this point.

What's left for us to consider is what can be done with the rest of this season. It's clear (to some, and you're welcome to disagree) that there is some young talent on this team. Most seem pretty happy with the 2 recruits coming in next year. CUSA is pretty poor overall this year and we've beaten 2 of the top 4 teams and have competed well with the other two. It's not out of the question to think that should we figure some things out and put together a few wins, we could find ourselves in a position to back our way into the NCAA tournament again this year. We could just as easily bow out in the first round of the CUSA tourney and be done. One of those scenarios will have people stretching towards delusional optimism and the other will bring out the "naysayers and realists" who told us all how it was stupid to feel like anything but failure was possible to begin with. As with everything else, the truth is likely somewhere in between. I think it's OK to get some enjoyment out of it.
 
Reality:

- Nice THEORETICAL question. Fact is MU has a one in 100000 chance of again having an upset win in the CUSA tournament, so it is like asking “which would be better, having a rich uncle you never heard about leave you a billion $$, or winning the lottery?” Fact is, you have a better chance at catching coronavirus than either.

- Which is better? How about DEMANDING EXCELLENCE in basketball, sailing though this box of cupcakes, and talking about the NCAA with realism as soon as January, and getting a realistic seed such that winning a game, or two, or three, is not an upset? As to football, sad that the theoretical dreams of most involve MU losing, rather than winning.

- All of this “big dance” non-sense. It is a symptom of Marshall fans, MU being named neither for a state nor a city; and of WVians generally, WV being a back-water place mostly and the whole “I have a cousin from Richmond” meme, that winning at sports = “name recognition”. Quick, name, without ever looking it up, every team in last year’s tournament, their school colors, where they are located, public or private, and mascot. If you cannot, and you cannot, you have no argument.

- What RhinoD and herdalicious said is true. This program did not get any better by making the NCAAs once, every 30 or so years. We are, bluntly, mediocre. We accept mediocrity.

Blah, blah, blah. You are never going to be happy, no matter who the coach is, you have a fundamental disrespect for our league, which is where we are going to be, probably forever. Marshall sports are just not for you, you need to find something else. Nothing that happens here will suit you.

You need to find something else, and move on.

This is what SamC says about people commenting on the football team. It's a classic "Do as I say, not as I do" situation.
 
Reality:

- Nice THEORETICAL question. Fact is MU has a one in 100000 chance of again having an upset win in the CUSA tournament, so it is like asking “which would be better, having a rich uncle you never heard about leave you a billion $$, or winning the lottery?” Fact is, you have a better chance at catching coronavirus than either.

- Which is better? How about DEMANDING EXCELLENCE in basketball, sailing though this box of cupcakes, and talking about the NCAA with realism as soon as January, and getting a realistic seed such that winning a game, or two, or three, is not an upset? As to football, sad that the theoretical dreams of most involve MU losing, rather than winning.

- All of this “big dance” non-sense. It is a symptom of Marshall fans, MU being named neither for a state nor a city; and of WVians generally, WV being a back-water place mostly and the whole “I have a cousin from Richmond” meme, that winning at sports = “name recognition”. Quick, name, without ever looking it up, every team in last year’s tournament, their school colors, where they are located, public or private, and mascot. If you cannot, and you cannot, you have no argument.

- What RhinoD and herdalicious said is true. This program did not get any better by making the NCAAs once, every 30 or so years. We are, bluntly, mediocre. We accept mediocrity.
We must demand mediocrity in football, too, as that is what we've been getting. Demand excellence in basketball? Well then, demand excellence in football, also. Oh, and go ahead and name all 80 teams that appeared in bowl games last year. Everything you spout about basketball can also be spouted about football. All you have to do is insert "football" where you've typed in "basketball."
 
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Isn’t this true for about 300 other D1 basketball programs. Same could be said for football as well. Of the 130 or so programs that play D1 football at the FBS level, maybe 10 garner a vast majority of the coverage and championships year in and year out. Jmo
Exactly - its the truth for everybody. Reputation always trails behind performance; its why a G5 has to have like 3 Top 25 seasons in a row to be taken seriously, or why Notre Dame is consistently in the preseason Top 15 despite not having actually won anything significant in 30 years.
 
It seems to me that the best sport to coach at this level is basketball. Even a string of solid seasons like we have had recently will get you on the hot seat in football. . Even a spectacular season ( one with a Top 25 ranking- 1999, 2002, 2003 and 2014 ) will still never put you in a position to play a meaningful bowl game it seems. At least with basketball, getting hot at the end of the year, seems to wipe away any mistakes made during the regular season. Whatever the case, I am still always 100% a Marshall supporter.
 
I think you see things in others' posts that literally aren't there. I don't see posts anywhere that are putting us on a pedestal with the Dukes, UK's, etc of the college basketball world.
Fire, quality post. Really.

But, when people post that “we have a chance at winning the national championship” yes they are.

When, in previous years, people post long threads about Elmore and Peneva and their NBA prospects, yes they are.

We all know where CUSA is in the pecking order (middle to high mid-major - it's not the MAAC but neither is it the AAC).

I really believe you do.

I question some on here really do not.

When I see posts about this league, I really question of some of these people have seen a basketball game in the last 30 years.

When I see posts that think this CIT joke was anything, I really question some of the fan base.

There's no requirement that a "realist" needs to come in here and preach us all back down to earth.

Well, then what is the point. I hate to keep going back to the WVU analogy, but a giant circle jerk where “we are good” is responded to with “yes we are” and then with “no, you don’t understand, we are great” and so on, is just a circle jerk.

It is the Paul Feinbaum show. There is a reason people laugh at that.

It's clear (to some, and you're welcome to disagree) that there is some young talent on this team. Most seem pretty happy with the 2 recruits coming in next year.

I don’t know. I would love to be wrong, but I see bad young players. They will soon be older bad players. IMHO.

One of the scenarios will have people stretching towards delusional optimism and the other will bring out the "naysayers and realists" who told us all how it was stupid to feel like anything but failure was possible to begin with.

Or we could all DEMAND BETTER.
 
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DEMAND BETTER - what the hell does that even mean? I can see your point if we are talking about the local talent at the nudie bar....I mean you have some ugly fat smelly women up there & everybody yells: We demand BETTER!! Then, either the hot curvy chicks come out to the satisfaction of the patrons, or the place empties out.....
Put that into basketball equivalency so we soft heads will unnerstan’ it....
 
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DEMAND BETTER

I think what he is talking about is a Basketball that makes the NCAA tournament once every 3 decades. A football team that one was the most winning teams in NCAA football in the early 90's, to being in the Top 25 1999- 2002, and 2014. To now under achieving in a god awful conference where (theoretically) they have more advantages then the other Schools in CUSA. We have gone complacent (especially a AD) and everyone seems to think that it's all good. It's ok to win once conference championship a decade, Its ok with a HC who has a dismal P5 record, It's ok to go three decades between NCAA appearances.

That's cause no one is Demanding Better!
 
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Just for fun. I am curious. Lets say the basketball team goes 14-14 in the regular season. Then say they get hot and win the Tourney and go to the Big Dance. Lets also say the football team goes 10-3 but loses in the Conference championship game. Which team was better?
MBB season. In football it's championship or bust. Making the NCAA tournament is the ultimate goal of every NCAA team. Of course advancing when you get there is huge, but getting your ticket punched gets a banner.

MBB 17-18 season > 2013 Football season

That is not to say that the 2013 football season wasn't a good season, but it's not on the level of making the NCAA tournament. 2014 was, but that's it.

MBB 17-18 season = 2014 Football Season.

If the 2014 football team goes undefeated and makes the Access bowl it becomes greater and if they would have won an access bowl then it becomes the NCAA Tournament equivalent of making the Elite8 or Final 4.

Now had MBB 17-18 made it two the sweet 16 or elite8 that season would be more of an achievement than the 2014 football season.
 
MBB season. In football it's championship or bust. Making the NCAA tournament is the ultimate goal of every NCAA team. Of course advancing when you get there is huge, but getting your ticket punched gets a banner.

MBB 17-18 season > 2013 Football season

That is not to say that the 2013 football season wasn't a good season, but it's not on the level of making the NCAA tournament. 2014 was, but that's it.

MBB 17-18 season = 2014 Football Season.

If the 2014 football team goes undefeated and makes the Access bowl it becomes greater and if they would have won an access bowl then it becomes the NCAA Tournament equivalent of making the Elite8 or Final 4.

Now had MBB 17-18 made it two the sweet 16 or elite8 that season would be more of an achievement than the 2014 football season.
Damn good post bleeds
 
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Sam you make up your own reality! I’ve literally seen nobody like you and I’ve been on herdnation for years.

I am not, nor is anyone else saying we have a great shot at winning the national championship in basketball. What I’m saying is if you get into the NCAA tournament you at least have a chance. I don’t care if it’s a .00000000000001% chance it’s still a chance. 2 seasons ago we were down to the final 32 teams playing for the NC in basketball. It was amazing. None of us thought we would win the championship but we were there and we had a chance.

Football will never have that chance at Marshall. The Access Bowl is the only thing that would come close from a national perspective. That isn’t a slam on football nor is it a slam of Doc. It’s just reality for G5’s.

Also people understand that CUSA is a mediocre basketball league too. Nobody puts it on a pedestal. The problem is CUSA isn’t mediocre in football it’s horrible. If you look at the last 5 years of NCAA tournament games in basketball the CUSA champ has advanced to the round of 32 in 4 of the last 5 years. That same 5 years CUSA has had zero Access Bowl teams.

First off I think it sucks we don’t demand more from our basketball team. I think Dan has been extremely mediocre this year. Now I think he’s been the best basketball coach we have had since Huck but that’s literally not saying much because Dana and Billy were only here a minute and the next coaches after them all sucked. I hate the fact we have not won the regular season title in Dans 6 years here (we won’t win it again this year) I hate the fact we lost several games at home this year to fellow mid majors. But he did take us to the NCAA 2 seasons ago and won our first game ever there so yes it buys him a little time. But after winning the CIT which exactly nobody cares about last season. Anything short of a deep CUSA tournament run this year will have a lot more people on the upset with Dan train if we don’t jump out of the gate in 20-21.

So even though Im a fan of Dan and would like him to do better I am not blind.

Everything that you say about basketball applies 10 times more in football. Thinking that Marshall should win the worst conference in FBS football more than one time in 10 years is not saying we should be undefeated every year or any of the other nonsense that occurs in the Sam Twilight Zone.
 
MBB season. In football it's championship or bust. Making the NCAA tournament is the ultimate goal of every NCAA team. Of course advancing when you get there is huge, but getting your ticket punched gets a banner.

Wrong. By “championship” do you mean conference, or national? Either way, of the 130 I-A teams, probably 100, maybe 110, have zero shot at the national championship. Certainly many don’t even have a shot at their conference. You think UK or Vandy is EVER going to win the SEC? WVU or Oklahoma St. the Big 12? Purdue or Indiana or Rutgers the Big 10? Any of three fourths of the ACC? Nah.

Because the goal in football is, for most schools, to go to a bowl and win that bowl.

MU, one of the smallest public schools in I-A, is already awesome just by being I-A. Lots of schools bigger and with better situations cower in I-AA or below. And we consistently go to bowl, win most of the time, and are in the upper half of I-A all the time. Just existing at this level is over-achieving.

Now on to basketball. Wrong. Making the tournament is not the “ultimate goal”. UK happy with that? Duke? Louisville? But even below that, you think Dayton would be happy to get a participation trophy AKA banner? WVU? Ohio State? Wichita? San Diego St? Gonzaga? No, the goal is to win for the blue bloods, but even at the mid-major level, the goal should be to win at least a game, and sometimes more. That is why people watch the games. If just making it was the “ultimate goal” then they wouldn’t even play the games.

But more importantly there are 350 Div I basketball programs. Plenty of schools far smaller than MU, far less resources, far worse situations. Of course, MU is Div I in basketball. It is supposed to be? We should be in the Mountain East with Concord and Fairmont?

I am not, nor is anyone else saying we have a great shot at winning the national championship in basketball. What I’m saying is if you get into the NCAA tournament you at least have a chance. I don’t care if it’s a .00000000000001% chance it’s still a chance. 2 seasons ago we were down to the final 32 teams playing for the NC in basketball. It was amazing. None of us thought we would win the championship but we were there and we had a chance.

Football will never have that chance at Marshall. The Access Bowl is the only thing that would come close from a national perspective. That isn’t a slam on football nor is it a slam of Doc. It’s just reality for G5’s.

You are absolutely right. There are only 20 to 30 teams that have even a shot at the national championship. If that is all you think about, then MU sports are just not for you. If you are Catholic, become a Notre Dame fan. If not, pick one. Clemson, Alabama, Auburn, or go for a long shot like Texas A&M or Florida. MU football is just not for you. Having a good record and going to a bowl is not for you. Move on.

But in basketball you are happy, every 30 years, to wear the dark jerseys for one game, or one time actually 2, in some basketball tournament where everybody has a “chance” but the same 10 teams always actually win. That satisfies you.

So, being an average to a little larger than average sized school in a group of 350 plus schools and once in a generation playing in the just under 20% of those that “have a chance” is fine. Being one of the smallest public schools in a group of 130 and, every year, being in the top 45 or so % of those, and most years, being in the upper half of those is not interesting to you. Got it.

This isn’t for you . Move on.
 
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