Credit Score

[riflearm2]

I don’t really pay attention to credit scores. Rates don’t really matter to me, because ya’ know, wealthy.

So I checked it today, and it came back with an 846.

Banker, how many “luxury” Huntington crackhouse apartments could I buy with an 846 credit score and a $325k house with plastic blinders and no mature landscaping as collateral?

 

[Rock98Dog]

Couple things -

First, what you see on those sites is calculated a little differently than it is calculated for real reports banks get. The weighting is a little different. Either way it’s good to know you are finally playing in the same ballpark as me and Rox.

Second, I only looked at credit reports because the banks I worked for generally required they be pulled. They don’t really tell you anything about whether a borrower or deal is good or bad in the commercial lending space. For example, I had a customer I had several million in debt with that only had a 660 score. The reason it was only 660 is because he had no personal debt and hadn’t borrowed money in his personal name in well over a decade. He had a paid for seven figure house and 8 figures in liquidity, not to mention his cash flow from his businesses was very strong.

Lastly, commercial lending is generally cash flow based, collateral is secondary and the guarantor is last. The credit score is below last and taking a personal residence as additional collateral for a business loan is dubious because bankruptcy courts can make screwy decisions when it comes to taking a personal residence if things go bad.

So the answer is zero. You could buy zero crackhouses given just an 846 credit score and a personal residence for collateral. Well, at least with a real bank that would be the case. I’m sure some credit union might let you buy one.

 

[SamSwimmer]

If a lender pulled it, probably be in the low 800's

 

[i am herdman]

If you have to ask, you can't afford it.

 

[19MU88]

Couple things -

First, what you see on those sites is calculated a little differently than it is calculated for real reports banks get. The weighting is a little different. Either way it’s good to know you are finally playing in the same ballpark as me and Rox.

Second, I only looked at credit reports because the banks I worked for generally required they be pulled. They don’t really tell you anything about whether a borrower or deal is good or bad in the commercial lending space. For example, I had a customer I had several million in debt with that only had a 660 score. The reason it was only 660 is because he had no personal debt and hadn’t borrowed money in his personal name in well over a decade. He had a paid for seven figure house and 8 figures in liquidity, not to mention his cash flow from his businesses was very strong.

Lastly, commercial lending is generally cash flow based, collateral is secondary and the guarantor is last. The credit score is below last and taking a personal residence as additional collateral for a business loan is dubious because bankruptcy courts can make screwy decisions when it comes to taking a personal residence if things go bad.

So the answer is zero. You could buy zero crackhouses given just an 846 credit score and a personal residence for collateral. Well, at least with a real bank that would be the case. I’m sure some credit union might let you buy one.

It's really funny that the moron equated a FICO credit score with wealth. it measures how you manage debt.

but the really vexing thing is, he trotted off to a message board to boast about his score? hell, I just assumed all the professionals around here are above fico 800. well everyone but the cabinet maker.

 

[ohio herd]

Couple things -

First, what you see on those sites is calculated a little differently than it is calculated for real reports banks get. The weighting is a little different. Either way it’s good to know you are finally playing in the same ballpark as me and Rox.

Second, I only looked at credit reports because the banks I worked for generally required they be pulled. They don’t really tell you anything about whether a borrower or deal is good or bad in the commercial lending space. For example, I had a customer I had several million in debt with that only had a 660 score. The reason it was only 660 is because he had no personal debt and hadn’t borrowed money in his personal name in well over a decade. He had a paid for seven figure house and 8 figures in liquidity, not to mention his cash flow from his businesses was very strong.

Lastly, commercial lending is generally cash flow based, collateral is secondary and the guarantor is last. The credit score is below last and taking a personal residence as additional collateral for a business loan is dubious because bankruptcy courts can make screwy decisions when it comes to taking a personal residence if things go bad.

So the answer is zero. You could buy zero crackhouses given just an 846 credit score and a personal residence for collateral. Well, at least with a real bank that would be the case. I’m sure some credit union might let you buy one.

yep I learned that lesson. I always tried to pay off everything for years and then found out it was impacting my score. So I added a couple of credit accounts and low and behold my score went up. Like you said I could always walk into my bank where I know many of the bankers and borrow whatever I needed.

 

[greengeezer]

I once checked my credit score and it was a few points below perfect, an A-. I asked how that could be and was told it was lowered because I had no recent record of debt. Funny how that works.

 

[big_country90]

The fact that rifle thinks that 846 “credit score” is real is hilarious.

 

[-CarlHungus-]

The fact that rifle thinks that 846 “credit score” is real is hilarious.

Explain so I can understand.

Mine is 832 according to the notifications I get from my personal finance app/asset tracking.

It says up to 850 is possible.

 

[mlblack16.]

Explain so I can understand.

Mine is 832 according to the notifications I get from my personal finance app/asset tracking.

It says up to 850 is possible.

 

[big_country90]

Explain so I can understand.

Mine is 832 according to the notifications I get from my personal finance app/asset tracking.

It says up to 850 is possible.

The companies that tell you they’re providing a credit score always inflate the actual score. It’s never accurate, and sometimes can be off by 100 points or more. I can’t tell you how many times I’ve had a client come to the bank and brag about their credit score being this or that because this company said so, and telling me they want a loan, only to pull their credit and it’s 590. You can see it coming a mile away. If you want to know your actual score(s), go to your bank and apply for a mortgage. They will tell you exactly what all three scores actually are.

 

[-CarlHungus-]

The companies that tell you they’re providing a credit score always inflate the actual score. It’s never accurate, and sometimes can be off by 100 points or more. I can’t tell you how many times I’ve had a client come to the bank and brag about their credit score being this or that because this company said so, and telling me they want a loan, only to pull their credit and it’s 590. You can see it coming a mile away. If you want to know your actual score(s), go to your bank and apply for a mortgage. They will tell you exactly what all three scores actually are.

Gotcha.

I haven't had to have mine checked I guess "officially" since I refi'd my mortgate like 8 years ago.

 

[TwolfHerdfan]

I just bought a new car from Moses. They said mine was 821. So that's not correct?

 

[i am herdman]

I just bought a new car from Moses. They said mine was 821. So that's not correct?

They make money or incentives getting you to finance through them.

 

[greengeezer]

I just bought a new car from Moses. They said mine was 821. So that's not correct?

If you paid sticker price for the car then yes, they probably lied to you. Lol

 

[TwolfHerdfan]

They make money or incentives getting you to finance through them.

Sure they do. The rates are better elsewhere.

 

[big_country90]

I just bought a new car from Moses. They said mine was 821. So that's not correct?

Probably. Just don’t know which one they use. In addition to what I said above, all three official credit agencies will give you a different score, and they can vary pretty significantly.

For instance, we use Equifax, primarily, because it tends to be more conservative. So if Moses uses Trans Union (no idea what they use) and it showed 821, Equifax could very well have you at 780. That might sound insignificant, but it shows the variance in the agencies’ reporting, and also starts to matter once your score starts to dip.

 

[riflearm2]

They don’t really tell you anything about whether a borrower or deal is good or bad in the commercial lending space.

His crackhouse only has four units. Those are almost always considered residential multifamily and not commercial, thus they don't need a commercial loan. Let me know if you need more education on your "expertise."

Couple things -

They don’t really tell you anything about whether a borrower or deal is good or bad in the commercial lending space. For example, I had a customer I had several million in debt with that only had a 660 score. The reason it was only 660 is because he had no personal debt and hadn’t borrowed money in his personal name in well over a decade. He had a paid for seven figure house and 8 figures in liquidity, not to mention his cash flow from his businesses was very strong.

You've told that story no fewer than five times on this board, and it doesn't prove what you think it does. It's a logical fallacy (Texas sharpshooter). You can always find anomalies and exceptions, but overall, FICO scores are a solid part of reviewing a borrower's credit worthiness and a reflection on if a "deal is good or bad." Should it be the only thing reviewed? Most of the time, no. But it is a solid indication.

If a lender pulled it, probably be in the low 800's

No. There is no logic behind that claim. Are credit scores from the three major bureaus slightly different than many of the FICO models? Sure. But claiming that it is "probably in the low 800s," a disparity of 45 points, is not rooted in common sense.

It's really funny that the moron equated a FICO credit score with wealth. it measures how you manage debt.

but the really vexing thing is, he trotted off to a message board to boast about his score? hell, I just assumed all the professionals around here are above fico 800. well everyone but the cabinet maker.

Take a hint, dork. Nobody interacts with you on here.

I

The fact that rifle thinks that 846 “credit score” is real is hilarious.

It is real, Mr. "The Earth is only 6000 years old!" FICOs are credit scores.

 

[big_country90]

It is real

Is it? Let me ask you this… Where did you get the score?

 

[herdfan06]

The companies that tell you they’re providing a credit score always inflate the actual score. It’s never accurate, and sometimes can be off by 100 points or more. I can’t tell you how many times I’ve had a client come to the bank and brag about their credit score being this or that because this company said so, and telling me they want a loan, only to pull their credit and it’s 590. You can see it coming a mile away. If you want to know your actual score(s), go to your bank and apply for a mortgage. They will tell you exactly what all three scores actually are.

The dealership had our credit scores being higher than Credit Karma when my wife and I purchased her car a few years. I am still convinced she paid that guy to crash into her car head-on in the middle of the night.

 

[herdfan06]

Is it? Let me ask you this… Where did you get the score?

 

[riflearm2]

Is it? Let me ask you this… Where did you get the score?

From Unda.

Experian has different products including different FICO models. Different types of lenders use different FICO models from Experian depending on their industry.

 

[i am herdman]

His crackhouse only has four units. Those are almost always considered residential multifamily and not commercial, thus they don't need a commercial loan. Let me know if you need more education on your "expertise."


You've told that story no fewer than five times on this board, and it doesn't prove what you think it does. It's a logical fallacy (Texas sharpshooter). You can always find anomalies and exceptions, but overall, FICO scores are a solid part of reviewing a borrower's credit worthiness and a reflection on if a "deal is good or bad." Should it be the only thing reviewed? Most of the time, no. But it is a solid indication.


No. There is no logic behind that claim. Are credit scores from the three major bureaus slightly different than many of the FICO models? Sure. But claiming that it is "probably in the low 800s," a disparity of 45 points, is not rooted in common sense.


Take a hint, dork. Nobody interacts with you on here.

I

It is real, Mr. "The Earth is only 6000 years old!" FICOs are credit scores.

Knows more than people in the banking industry.

 

[riflearm2]

Knows more than people in the banking industry.

Reading is important, and as I routinely point out, you lifelong WV educated deplorables struggle mightily with it.

Tell us, HerMan, is it true that the overwhelming majority of loans for properties with 1-4 units are considered multifamily residential loans instead of commercial loans? If so, what does his rambling about commercial loans regarding a property like Middle-Class Murox’s crackhouse have to do with anything?

 

[i am herdman]

Reading is important, and as I routinely point out, you lifelong WV educated deplorables struggle mightily with it.

Tell us, HerMan, is it true that the overwhelming majority of loans for properties with 1-4 units are considered multifamily residential loans instead of commercial loans? If so, what does his rambling about commercial loans regarding a property like Middle-Class Murox’s crackhouse have to do with anything?

I am not a banker. I would ask someone in that arena if I were you.

 

[big_country90]

is it true that the overwhelming majority of loans for properties with 1-4 units are considered multifamily residential loans instead of commercial loans?

You’re actually mixing lingos somewhat. 5+ units is considered “multi-family” if you want to get technical. Whether it’s 1-4 units, or 5+, the bank’s underwriting policy will typically determine whether or not it’s underwritten as commercial, small business, or retail residential.

 

[i am herdman]

You’re actually mixing lingos somewhat. 5+ units is considered “multi-family” if you want to get technical. Whether it’s 1-4 units, or 5+, the bank’s underwriting policy will typically determine whether or not it’s underwritten as commercial, small business, or retail residential.

He's going to tell you what your policy is.

 

[Rock98Dog]

If it will serve as your primary residence a building up to 4 units can qualify for a “residential” mortgage loan that can be sold on the secondary market. If the property is purchased for investment purposes then there are significant restrictions concerning that route. For example, FHA will not guarantee an investment loan for a 4-plex, so you will pay higher rates and fees.

I’ll admit that I really never messed with loans so small, it was a waste of my time because it’s just as easy to do a $5 million loan as it is a $500k loan. I did have some customers that owned dozens, or even hundreds, of smaller properties, but it was a pain. Why own 400 units spread over 50 miles when you can just own two 200 unit complexes for the same money and a fraction of the management headache?

 

[SamSwimmer]

No. There is no logic behind that claim. Are credit scores from the three major bureaus slightly different than many of the FICO models? Sure. But claiming that it is "probably in the low 800s," a disparity of 45 points, is not rooted in common sense.

Have a tri-merge pulled specifically with the purpose of obtaining a mortgage & I'd be willing to bet it comes lower than you think, especially if they're the first hard hit (a likely 3 to 5 drop). And that hit is already on a score likely to be lower than what you're seeing on credit reporting services.
You very well might be in the 820's but that's pretty rare. And my comments are aimed at the scoring system, not you. On any given week I pull five to 15 credit reports & just based on what I see, whatever a borrower is seeing on their apps, the tri-merge comes back noticeably lower.

 

[riflearm2]

If it will serve as your primary residence a building up to 4 units can qualify for a “residential” mortgage loan that can be sold on the secondary market. If the property is purchased for investment purposes then there are significant restrictions concerning that route. For example, FHA will not guarantee an investment loan for a 4-plex, so you will pay higher rates and fees.

I’ll admit that I really never messed with loans so small, it was a waste of my time because it’s just as easy to do a $5 million loan as it is a $500k loan. I did have some customers that owned dozens, or even hundreds, of smaller properties, but it was a pain. Why own 400 units spread over 50 miles when you can just own two 200 unit complexes for the same money and a fraction of the management headache?

In other words, what I said was entirely accurate and your rambling about commercial loans didn't apply to what I asked about. Thanks. Can you explain that to HerMan, please?

He's going to tell you what your policy is.

Why do you do this to yourself? Banker just admitted that he really didn't mess with those types of loans while admitting his comment didn't apply to what I mentioned, so now you're doubling-down on these suits?

You’re actually mixing lingos somewhat. 5+ units is considered “multi-family” if you want to get technical. Whether it’s 1-4 units, or 5+, the bank’s underwriting policy will typically determine whether or not it’s underwritten as commercial, small business, or retail residential.

I am not mixing lingos "somewhat." What I said is entirely accurate and the lingo is correct. 1-4 units are usually multifamily residential. 5+ are commercial. Want some proof:

 

[riflearm2]

Have a tri-merge pulled specifically with the purpose of obtaining a mortgage & I'd be willing to bet it comes lower than you think, especially if they're the first hard hit (a likely 3 to 5 drop). And that hit is already on a score likely to be lower than what you're seeing on credit reporting services.
You very well might be in the 820's but that's pretty rare. And my comments are aimed at the scoring system, not you. On any given week I pull five to 15 credit reports & just based on what I see, whatever a borrower is seeing on their apps, the tri-merge comes back noticeably lower.

Not 45 points lower.

 

[SamSwimmer]

Not 45 points lower.

Have a tri-merge pulled by a lender & see what comes back (you'd be crazy to actually do that for an internet point) but I bet the middle score is closer to 800 than 820. Plus, I have borrowers send me screenshots of their reporting apps all time to argue our numbers aren't right because the app is reporting something much higher.

I'm not saying it's right, I'm just telling what I see on a daily basis.

 

[big_country90]

In other words, what I said was entirely accurate and your rambling about commercial loans didn't apply to what I asked about. Thanks. Can you explain that to HerMan, please?


Why do you do this to yourself? Banker just admitted that he really didn't mess with those types of loans while admitting his comment didn't apply to what I mentioned, so now you're doubling-down on these suits?


I am not mixing lingos "somewhat." What I said is entirely accurate and the lingo is correct. 1-4 units are usually multifamily residential. 5+ are commercial. Want some proof:

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From an underwriting perspective, “multi-family” and “commercial” are synonymous. You saying 1-4 units are residential and 5+ are commercial is literally the same thing I’m saying, only I'm saying that banks won’t call it “multi-family” unless it has 5+ units. So 1-4 units are underwritten similarly and 5+ units are underwritten similarly. People use the term “multi-family” loosely when referencing a 4 unit building, but the banking industry doesn’t view it that way. Has to be 5+ to be called that.

Also, why did you post multiple screenshots that say exactly what I said? Did you even read them?

 

[riflearm2]

Also, why did you post multiple screenshots that say exactly what I said? Did you even read them?

What?! You’re the one who said I was mixing the lingo. I showed, overwhelmingly, that what I said is standard, used widely, and not mixing the lingo.

 

[19MU88]

I just bought a new car from Moses. They said mine was 821. So that's not correct?

Probably is correct, at least one of major bureaus.

 

[19MU88]

Take a hint, dork. Nobody interacts with you on here.

You just did, idiot.

I suppose if I wanted more attention or "interaction" I could beg for attention like you. Take your recent activity, Boasting about your credit score and "wealth" when it's clear you don't even understand want makes up the score or what it's telling you.

I don't need any interaction or attention. I stop by here for a break and enjoy herdman and michigans wit and also enjoy laughing at you and greed.

Congrats you made me type more than I like.

 

[extragreen]

also enjoy laughing at you and greed.

By the way, how's that Georgia thing going for you??

 

[19MU88]

By the way, how's that Georgia thing going for you??

I believe I told you. The country needs to go through this one way or another. People can now see our corrupt government for themselves. Many have bought the years of fake news and lies, Trump has exposed our corrupt government taking away the will of the people so no matter what happens this is good.

Just hope it's not too late for the US. Because even if your dumbass thinks that you won, you lose and we all lose the more the globalist swamp rats stay in power and the more they are able to propagandize morons like you.

 

[i am herdman]

You just did, idiot.

I suppose if I wanted more attention or "interaction" I could beg for attention like you. Take your recent activity, Boasting about your credit score and "wealth" when it's clear you don't even understand want makes up the score or what it's telling you.

I don't need any interaction or attention. I stop by here for a break and enjoy herdman and michigans wit and also enjoy laughing at you and greed.

Congrats you made me type more than I like.

Good to see you posting on the forum, 19MU88. Thanks for you input and interaction.

 

[riflearm2]

Good to see you posting on the forum, 19MU88. Thanks for you input and interaction.

Still mad about that whole having to do taxes for your adult child, eh?

Congrats you made me type more than I like.

Anytime that you type is more than what anybody likes.