I have no problem losing to good teams. My problem is that this team seems so disinterested during those losses. We play with zero energy and very little effort on both ends. This has now happened in six of our nine losses. And I'm sorry but the wink set me off because Jon should know better. He's a senior, not an immature 18 year old. It's obvious there is something wrong internally. I guess part of the frustration is this mystery as to why this team tends to play like they simply don't care. I also don't think Danny's response helps the situation. I get this is Danny's dream job and he's having a blast, but he also needs to be reminded he doesn't walk on water. Maybe the arrogance from our players simply reflects what they are seeing from the coaching staff? Plenty of games left and I hope these players remember they are playing for the name on the front of the jersey not the back. We are a passionate fan base and will never accept being embarrassed (multiple times). This is Danny's 5th season and will most likely end with him having one ring in five seasons. I would say that's a job well done, but certainly not exceeding anyone's expectations.
Elmore Wink
- Thread starter brando3213
- Start date
Burks is averaging 13.6 shots per game this year. That's nearly 2 shots less than he averaged a game a season ago. His shooting percentage last season was 47.2% pretty good for a 2 guard, this year it's even better at 48% His points per game are 18 ppg this year and 20 last year. Which can be attributed to either his fewer FG attempts or the one area he has truly regressed in his free throw percentage. Which is 80% this year but was 89% a year ago.
As for his turnovers they are also exactly the same as they were a year ago at 3.1 TOs a game. Although, I do agree about the WKU game he had 7 in that one and many of them were down the stretch, but on the whole of the season CJ has been no worse there than last season.
Burks I think is getting unfairly criticized for Elmore's dip in production and efficiency when Burks has been pretty steady.
Elmore on the other hand is averaging 16.4 shots a game 1 more than he was a year ago and his shooting percentage has dipped from 44% to 37% including a dip from 83% at the foul line to 75% at the stripe.
Surprisingly Jon's turnovers are actually down from a year ago 3.8 vs. 3.3 this year but so are his assists from 6.8 to 5 this season. Points per game are also down despite taking MORE shots than he did a year ago because his shooting percentage has dropped way off both from the field and the foul line. Nearly 23 a game last year to 19 a game this year.
Both Elmore and Burks average just a shade under 2 steals per game so by every metric possible Burks has out played Elmore this year other than the fact that Elmore forces up 3 more shots per game than Burks.
Good #'s Trebel. My main concern coming off of Sat was our inability to get shots driving to the basket. A lot of offense is created with the pick & roll, Elmore getting to the rim as well as Burks......
The title of this thread says it all for me.
Last season, MU unexpectedly won CUSA. It was great and our NCAA tournament was fun too.
While it seems like a huge deal to MU about that season, in the grand scheme of things, it was pretty routine as plenty of schools have done this.
Problem is, last season afforded MU the possibility of more options to get into the NCAA tournament the next season. The momentum of last season would give them a solid chance against the big 3 teams OOC and an advantage over everyone else OOC.
OOC actually matters and with a solid showing against them with a win or two, the eye test would have helped us make our csse if we did not win CUSA...as our options are limited as it is.
Not only did it not happen, it was probably the worst case scenario we could have gotten. We got obliterated by the big 3 and lost plenty of winnable OOC games.
Now, MU is regressing back to last season, where it is literally going to hinge on 1 weekend of going unbeaten to get back to where they were last season...and frankly with this team playing, confidence is reduced.
So in short, we should not have to resort to Jon Elmore winking as a (even posted on here) reason to complain at this point in the season, but here we are...and honestly, losing focus at the top guy because the team hasn't shown up in 2 weeks.
You should just turn the TV off when basketball is on as you haven't a clue.
'bout that wink. Go ahead, Jon. If you drop 44 winking is ok by me.
Elmore, played much better last night and that is what we need! Good job, Elmore.
What's up with the censorship? I just made a post to mention that some people only (have the confidence) to post after a win, and they seem to remain hidden (under a rock) until then. My post disappeared. Now since I know the mod's read the posts where is my first name on the board. When are you going to un-ban it.
We really need West and Watson to play better, and have Williams chip in more points to go along with his solid defensive play last night. If you look at the metrics, West and Watson have been among our worst players this year and have performed well below average for a D1 player. As for Williams, we need a third scorer that can provide consistent 10+ points per game to take the pressure off Elmore and Burks like Peneva did last season. I want to see Williams shoot more when he gets open looks instead of deferring to Burks and Elmore most of the time.
Trebel06....[perhaps you did not HERD Jon's interview after the victory over UTEP...."I am so relieved, I have been pressing this season & not only letting myself & the team down...but the great fans that are packing The CAM." "Tonight I had fun---something that has been missing this year"...I'm glad the coaching staff & Coach D'Antoni have remained supportive of me...I love Marshall..."
HERDZILLA22...still believing in this TEAM......the weather is getting warmer in CHARLOTTE
So brando3213....the facts that Coach Dan & his staff earned a CUSA Championship in 2018 & a first round victory over Greg Marshall & Wichita State...does not matter or earn your pleasure. BTW...a FIRST for Marshall basketball...no HERD team in the past ever won a NCCA basketball tournament contest to advance to round two. The fact that players Dan & his staff recruited are GETTING THEIR DEGREES----does not matter or earn your pleasure. The fact that attendance under Coach Dan & his staff has moved the needle from about 1200 to around 8700 fans at THE CAM does not matter or earn your pleasure. The fact that Dan's & his staff's players are wearing the M on their jerseys with respect & honor---both on campus & in the community visiting ill children in Huntington hospitals...does not matter nor earn your pleasure.
No Dan does not walk on water.......He is not above himself.....He loves the LORD and only Jesus walked on water and this distinction is reserved for our Savior.
HERDZILLA22
You mean the WVU government.
You mean the WVU government.
You mean the WVU government.
(Gary Sweeney) in Charlotte
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You mean the WVU government.
WINK WINK...yep that darn WV government...
HerdZilla22 in Charlotte
Well, in West's defense he does play good defense. Little dude a angry pit bull defender. I do like that.
Maybe last year was a "miracle on wood" and we expect too much. Or the season was hyped to sell tickets.....
He is a thief! Will prob set the record for steals before he is finished.....
I think he will as well. as of right now he has 110. Skip Henderson holds the record at 208.
If he only averaged 2 in our remaining 9 games, and taking the worse case scenario of one and done in the conference tourney, that would give him 130 for his first two years.
That would leave him two years to get 79 and break Skip's record.
I forget what a stud Skip Henderson was! How many college ballers are their school’s all-time leader in points AND steals? 429 - you should be able to find out quickly.....
He is good in terms of causing TOs and has been solid on defense, but by the metrics his offensive rating and production is the worst among the 8-man rotation. He needs to take more shots and get involved in the offense. One thing to also consider, he has the highest turnover rate per possession of the 8-man rotation as well. I don't like pouring on him because I like him as a player, but he played much better last season. We really need everyone else besides Burks and Elmore to chip in more on offense in order to take the pressure off of them.
Happy for Jon. For us to be successful down the stretch that will need to continue (especially on the road vs the top half of the league). Jon vs. Jackson should be a lot of fun tonight.
We looked as well as we did during that 2 week stretch because we were getting production from others. Kinsey was giving us double-doubles, scoring in the teens and occasionally put up 20. Williams was knocking down shots, hit the game winner vs WKU. West was doing the same, hit the game winner vs ODU. Beyers was giving us good minutes, blocked the shot vs Charlotte. Watson stepped up and gave us good minutes when DD benched Burks vs WKU. Even when we looked like trash in OOC play, Darius George was coming off the bench, giving us some length/athleticism, while knocking down the 3 at a good rate.
You’re 100% correct. Those guys need to step up if we want to make a run. That needs to start tonight & on the road vs UNT. It’s time to climb out of the funk if we want to do anything. Elmore & Burks need two others to run with them. It doesn’t have to be the same two every night. A combination of Kinsey, Williams, West, Watson, George, & Beyers. We get double figures and a good defensive effort from any two of those on any given night and we can win the conference again—possibly regular season too. If not, this will be a very disappointing campaign.
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This is Danny's 5th season and will most likely end with him having one ring in five seasons. I would say that's a job well done, but certainly not exceeding anyone's expectations.
Not sure why that comment hurt your feelings. I won't take away anything Danny has accomplished thus a "job well done". I am looking more beyond this season when Jon and CJ (and Watson he's been very important to our success) are gone. Would you not agree that Danny would be the first to tell you if he had not won a ring in five seasons it probably wasn't working out? He's the first to set high expectations for the program. I'm sorry a 50 point loss vs a below average team upset me and several other fans. One of many embarrassing losses his season. Hopefully the USM game was a wake up call. I guess what shocked me was seeing our kids quit. I never expected that from a Danny coached team.
I'll be watching tonight. Will be a great game and great crowd. Jackson vs. Jon should be a special matchup. Big game if we want to secure an NIT bid (as a fall back).
brando3213...have you ever had a female "kick you to the curb"....It stung for a while...and hopefully you got over it! The dang 50-point loss to So Miss IS ONLY ONE GAME....you and others need to get over it! The TEAM put it aside and had a great win over UTEP led by Elmore's 44 points.
I hope the guys meet So Miss in Texas during tourney time---"Paybacks will be HELL...."
Oh BTW there is help already in Huntington for next YEAR..... and some great talent that will be wearing the GREEN & White...Going Forward. The SHIP is on track and HERD HOOPS will continue to RISE.....lead by a YOUNG 71 year old coach!
HerdZilla22 in Charlotte
Zilla, I am a fan of Danny's and like what he is done for the program. And he has increased attendance. But there is no need for you to exaggerate the point. The attendance was not down to 1200 a game before he got here.
Every fan base needs homers. Glad you're on our team. Disappointing loss at home. Lets see if the kids will bring it on the road next week.
Gut wrenching and some of the dumbest basketball I’ve seen in a long time, both teams. Poor decision after poor decision.
Our great man to man gave up 101 down at Southern Miss and 116 tonight back home at the CAM!! Whew! Sure glad this game wasn't down in San Antonio!!
Guys, apart from our starting seniors and 1 or 2 others off the Bench, mainly Watson, the talent is just NOT THERE, or is young and inexperienced, or a combo of both. Some of these guys just have not panned out, or come close to what Danny and staff have envisioned. To be blunt a couple of the non seniors should be strongly advised/encouraged to be looking elsewhere for their basketball homes in 2019-20, like maybe the Mountain East conference. Need a couple of skilled, tough and experienced interior players for next season, and Danny needs to have staff heavily recruiting in the juco ranks or perhaps among the available graduate transfers.
Guys, apart from our starting seniors and 1 or 2 others off the Bench, mainly Watson, the talent is just NOT THERE, or is young and inexperienced, or a combo of both. Some of these guys just have not panned out, or come close to what Danny and staff have envisioned. To be blunt a couple of the non seniors should be strongly advised/encouraged to be looking elsewhere for their basketball homes in 2019-20, like maybe the Mountain East conference. Need a couple of skilled, tough and experienced interior players for next season, and Danny needs to have staff heavily recruiting in the juco ranks or perhaps among the available graduate transfers.
At this point we are going to be lucky to stay in the top 5. Even if we do, we will probably end the season around .500. We beat 1 decent team in conference on the road (ODU). A split next weekend is probably the best we can hope for.
We just don’t have it this year which is a shame because it should have been a very special year.
We just don’t have it this year which is a shame because it should have been a very special year.
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Dumb is a poor choice of words so I amend that. I’ll go with unaware/missed opportunities to take advantage of game situations.
Perhaps Sustic. for one. He has played less than Koljanin did last season, and the latter is gone/was encouraged to leave.
If Sustic had shown any ability to contribute within the system, believe he would have been playing enough along with Byers to perhaps, even if only at times, allow Williams to play at the 4 slot, which is better for Jansson's offensive strengths, IMO.
Believe at one time, Danny D. had even mentioned or toyed with the idea of redshirting Byers, who had 3 years of eligibility coming to MU. That might have been before Bennett got hurt, however.
Thanks for the response. For the record, Jannson's natural position is a 3 stretch 4. He was also recruited as such, but as i have said many times on here....Jannson a team player and play wherever coach asks him to play.
SIG you are totally WRONG. Tom Herron had the program in such bad shape....no one was coming his last year. Glow sticks and all for Donnie Jones' return with CFU (still pisses me off that Donnie was scorned by HERD fans)...Donnie Jones is a CLASS MAN! And, friends to this day with the D'Antoni guys!
I sat in an empty (almost ) CAM and I can count without using my toes.....I am talking about ACTUAL asses in the seats...not season ticket holders that quit COMING to basketball games...of which, all schools report attendance numbers......IT's ASSES IN SEATS THAT COUNTS! Just like HERD football reports 28,000 thousands and not actual 15,000 asses in The JOAN!!!!! I am a season football ticket holder...again I count well....and see darn WELL.
HerdZilla22 (G Sweeney in Charlotte)
Just so I have this correct you are pissed off that Herd fans became upset with Donnie after it was discovered he prepared and interviewed for a job when his team was still playing? I'm sure this happens often, but still does not make it right. If that is your definition class then we can certainly agree to disagree.
No question attendance dipped at the end of Herrion's tenure. Danny has been such a positive addition to the program. I take nothing away from the job he's done up to this point. Hopefully I'm wrong and please call me out in a few years, but I am somewhat concerned about the future of the program. We need a lot of guys to take major steps forward next year and it's hard to see that transpiring. Either way I won't miss a game!
How bout that senior leadership. What an embarrassment.
