The US Army just played the trump card on the fool in charge

[i am herdman]

The Army drug the investigation of this bergdhal character long enough for the new Republican controlled congress to be put in place. Drug it out long enough so the defender in chief can't block it our put the pressure on them.

Remember the fool walking around with this guy's parents and playing the heroic rescue of this fine American young man?

Well, guess what, Commander, your boy is going to be found guilty of deserting and you played him up like a hero.

He is going to federal prison, sir.

By the way, you knew that good men lost their lives looking for him and even more good men had been trying to find him for a long time. And, you brought his nut bag parents out and paraded them around.

Payback is a bitch, sir. God bless the Generals and other military officers who used the system to their advantage.

 

[raleighherdfan]

I agree with you herdman but the media will find more important matters to discuss.........."conveniently" we now have "suicide" plane crashes in Europe and airstrikes in Yemen to watch 24/7.

By the way......wasn't Obummer's administration going to bring peace and tranquility to the world? Love these Arab springs. Somebody send in John (Wayne) Kerry to save the day!!! Give the Iranian's nukes..........yep, that will calm things down over there.

Attempting to contemplate the future disasters this leaderless administration has set in motion are becoming too many to analyze. The next Prez is inheriting a bigger shit storm than Obummer ever had to worry about. At least he found time to visit Jimmy Kimmel's show and give us his bracket picks. No other issues in the world warrants more time than this.

 

[Walden Pond]

Originally posted by raleighherdfan:
the media will find more important matters to discuss

Yeah, people really don't care much about this. It has little to no effect on the daily lives of most Americans. Until it does, people aren't going to worry a lot about it. The economy, taxes and jobs are the bigger issues.

Everyone would likely agree that this thing looks bad for Obama, but it's not going to turn away any of his supporters. Democrats aren't going to flock to the Republican way of life over this. The deciding factors on that are still the large safety net and adopting New York and Los Angeles culture.

 

[Chris884MU]

I'm glad he was charged but I doubt he spends any time in prison. Going back to 2009 Rolling Stone article it was clear this guy was off his rocker a little. Somebody should have caught that and prevented him from ever being in a forward position. Secondly, the minute he asked his CO what might happen if he just walked off, he should have been locked up.

The whole rose garden charade was just another example of some view perception and theatre over substance. They really think people are that stupid...just like Hillary trying to convince people about the "video" was causing the chaos in Benghazi and that her emails were safe because a secret service agent was guarding the server. But as Walden said, it won't matter to the sheeple anyway. They would vote for Obama or Hillary even if they were caught walking out of Fort Knox with gold bars.

 

[herdfan429]

I'm no expert n the ucmj and military law but exactly how is the congaree involved in anyway In a desertion trial?

 

[CockyHerd]

Let's at least admit that we had no business being over there in the first place.

We have no understanding of the culture in the Middle East. We gasp at some atrocities and then ignore others based on the amount of oil you have.

We want to jump in the sandbox and ask everyone to just get along. It's not going to happen. They've been killing each other for centuries.

 

[i am herdman]

Cock what does that have to do with the price of tea in china?

What does congress have to do with it? They can put pressure in Obama not to step in the way.
Posted from Rivals Mobile

 

[pj(HN)]

Herdman? You drinking again? LOL...

 

[raleighherdfan]

"We have no understanding of the culture in the Middle East."


I would actually suggest that we do.........which is exactly why we will always need to be in the sandbox. Only in a dream world scenario would one think by simply NOT being there (or wishing to have never gone there), that their actions would no longer pose potential threats to others outside their "cultural" beliefs and practices.

As some accurately state......."the world can be an ugly place." And I for one, would rather be in the country that's at the top of that mound of ugliness. Unfortunately to stay there demands involvement.

The faux outrage over "oil" is also misguided and usually hypocritical. Without it, our own development and modern day comforts wouldn't be much better than those who have spent centuries living and killing each other over religious hate and zealotry in dirt cities.

 

[CockyHerd]

Originally posted by raleighherdfan:

"We have no understanding of the culture in the Middle East."


I would actually suggest that we do.........which is exactly why we will always need to be in the sandbox. Only in a dream world scenario would one think by simply NOT being there (or wishing to have never gone there), that their actions would no longer pose potential threats to others outside their "cultural" beliefs and practices.

As some accurately state......."the world can be an ugly place." And I for one, would rather be in the country that's at the top of that mound of ugliness. Unfortunately to stay there demands involvement.

The faux outrage over "oil" is also misguided and usually hypocritical. Without it, our own development and modern day comforts wouldn't be much better than those who have spent centuries living and killing each other over religious hate and zealotry in dirt cities.

And exactly what is your understanding of the Sunni, Kurd, and Shiite cultures? And what exactly can we do to "help' them?
Other than kill them and convince ourselves that it makes us safer. All the while we spend billions of dollars and sacrifice thousands of lives.

I have no faux outrage over oil but we didn't need Iraqi oil......We already have our long standing deal with the devil in Saudi Arabia.

 

[pj(HN)]

We need to lay the blame of the current middle east situation squarely at the feet of the Allies post the Great War (WWI) and how we handled the redistribution of geo-political boundaries of the Ottoman Empire and those leaders the west installed to preserve the west's new found lease on oil fields... Couple this with the post WWII "Jewish" guilt western leaders where feeling and bam... We have what we have...

 

[wvkeeper(HN)]

Yes, the Middle East was a paragon of peace prior to WWI.

That is incredibly myopic. Did that help? No. But it did not create the animosity between Shiite and Sunni factions. It merely is redistributed among different borders than it was before.

While Bush is at fault for destabilizing the region by removing a secular dictator (who, yes was an abominable despot) the rudderless FP of the Obama administration has made things worse. There are few "heroes" among the U.S. decision makers since 1953.

A good book to understand the "ethos" of the Middle East is Strong Horse by Lee Smith and why none of the Heads of State in the region respect the President or his State department.

 

[raleighherdfan]

Originally posted by CockyHerd:

Originally posted by raleighherdfan:

"We have no understanding of the culture in the Middle East."


I would actually suggest that we do.........which is exactly why we will always need to be in the sandbox. Only in a dream world scenario would one think by simply NOT being there (or wishing to have never gone there), that their actions would no longer pose potential threats to others outside their "cultural" beliefs and practices.

As some accurately state......."the world can be an ugly place." And I for one, would rather be in the country that's at the top of that mound of ugliness. Unfortunately to stay there demands involvement.

The faux outrage over "oil" is also misguided and usually hypocritical. Without it, our own development and modern day comforts wouldn't be much better than those who have spent centuries living and killing each other over religious hate and zealotry in dirt cities.

And exactly what is your understanding of the Sunni, Kurd, and Shiite cultures? And what exactly can we do to "help' them?
Other than kill them and convince ourselves that it makes us safer. All the while we spend billions of dollars and sacrifice thousands of lives.

I have no faux outrage over oil but we didn't need Iraqi oil......We already have our long standing deal with the devil in Saudi Arabia.

This has been discussed endlessly here. It was never about "needing Iraqi" oil for our use. If you actually believe that's why we are there..... then it makes total sense why you simply think we shouldn't be involved more fully in the middle east.

Who said I was for helping Sunni, Kurd, or Shiite cultures over our own interests first? Hell, I am for America first. Period. Foreign Policy is not an exact science for sure. But a policy that simply states....."We don't need to be over there because they have been killing each other for centuries", is naïve and poses an even greater risk than actually being involved in the process (of whatever is going on in the cesspool of the middle east).

 

[Chris884MU]

Well said wvkeeper

 

[CockyHerd]

Originally posted by raleighherdfan:

Originally posted by CockyHerd:

Originally posted by raleighherdfan:

"We have no understanding of the culture in the Middle East."


I would actually suggest that we do.........which is exactly why we will always need to be in the sandbox. Only in a dream world scenario would one think by simply NOT being there (or wishing to have never gone there), that their actions would no longer pose potential threats to others outside their "cultural" beliefs and practices.

As some accurately state......."the world can be an ugly place." And I for one, would rather be in the country that's at the top of that mound of ugliness. Unfortunately to stay there demands involvement.

The faux outrage over "oil" is also misguided and usually hypocritical. Without it, our own development and modern day comforts wouldn't be much better than those who have spent centuries living and killing each other over religious hate and zealotry in dirt cities.

And exactly what is your understanding of the Sunni, Kurd, and Shiite cultures? And what exactly can we do to "help' them?
Other than kill them and convince ourselves that it makes us safer. All the while we spend billions of dollars and sacrifice thousands of lives.

I have no faux outrage over oil but we didn't need Iraqi oil......We already have our long standing deal with the devil in Saudi Arabia.

This has been discussed endlessly here. It was never about "needing Iraqi" oil for our use. If you actually believe that's why we are there..... then it makes total sense why you simply think we shouldn't be involved more fully in the middle east.

Who said I was for helping Sunni, Kurd, or Shiite cultures over our own interests first? Hell, I am for America first. Period. Foreign Policy is not an exact science for sure. But a policy that simply states....."We don't need to be over there because they have been killing each other for centuries", is naïve and poses an even greater risk than actually being involved in the process (of whatever is going on in the cesspool of the middle east).

I never said, "we needed Iraqi oil". Quite to the contrary. I was only respomding to your "faux outrage" comment.

We were in Iraq for the reasons that were "sold" to the American Public by Bush and Cheney. And W's Daddy issues. As well (As you stated) as by the actions of many admoinistrations prior.

Obama has continued the chain of mistakes and errors.

 

[raleighherdfan]

Originally posted by CockyHerd:

Originally posted by raleighherdfan:

Originally posted by CockyHerd:

Originally posted by raleighherdfan:

"We have no understanding of the culture in the Middle East."


I would actually suggest that we do.........which is exactly why we will always need to be in the sandbox. Only in a dream world scenario would one think by simply NOT being there (or wishing to have never gone there), that their actions would no longer pose potential threats to others outside their "cultural" beliefs and practices.

As some accurately state......."the world can be an ugly place." And I for one, would rather be in the country that's at the top of that mound of ugliness. Unfortunately to stay there demands involvement.

The faux outrage over "oil" is also misguided and usually hypocritical. Without it, our own development and modern day comforts wouldn't be much better than those who have spent centuries living and killing each other over religious hate and zealotry in dirt cities.

And exactly what is your understanding of the Sunni, Kurd, and Shiite cultures? And what exactly can we do to "help' them?
Other than kill them and convince ourselves that it makes us safer. All the while we spend billions of dollars and sacrifice thousands of lives.

I have no faux outrage over oil but we didn't need Iraqi oil......We already have our long standing deal with the devil in Saudi Arabia.

This has been discussed endlessly here. It was never about "needing Iraqi" oil for our use. If you actually believe that's why we are there..... then it makes total sense why you simply think we shouldn't be involved more fully in the middle east.

Who said I was for helping Sunni, Kurd, or Shiite cultures over our own interests first? Hell, I am for America first. Period. Foreign Policy is not an exact science for sure. But a policy that simply states....."We don't need to be over there because they have been killing each other for centuries", is naïve and poses an even greater risk than actually being involved in the process (of whatever is going on in the cesspool of the middle east).

I never said, "we needed Iraqi oil". Quite to the contrary. I was only respomding to your "faux outrage" comment.

We were in Iraq for the reasons that were "sold" to the American Public by Bush and Cheney. And W's Daddy issues. As well (As you stated) as by the actions of many admoinistrations prior.

Obama has continued the chain of mistakes and errors.

Yeah. Sure. It was about Bush's "Daddy" issues......that's exactly why we were there.

Now I see why you admit to not understanding Kurds, Sunni, and Shiite culture.

It also appears you didn't understand the basis for my faux outrage comment. My original "faux oil outrage" had nothing to do with Iraq policy specifically and was based purely within the context of well intentioned liberals continually belly aching over the fact Arab Nations hate us because of our interests in oil throughout M.E. A never ending lazy effort to continually blame "oil" as the reason for all things anti America out of that region.

 

[gunnerbj]

I disagree. If (when) the Article 32 Hearing supports the charges against him to go to Court Martial, he's toast. The Jury will be comprised of his peers mostly (enlisted soldiers and a smattering of officers perhaps), not civilians. He will be found guilty of desertion and sent to Leavenworth for life. Were he facing a civilian Grand Jury and a civilian court, anything is possible (ref OJ Simpson). Facing charges under the UCMJ is a completely different ball game thank God. His only hope in this instance would be the appeal process (post conviction) in my opinion where it reaches the desk of the Commander in Chief for final disposition or a Pardon decision.

 

[i am herdman]

Originally posted by gunnerbj:
I disagree. If (when) the Article 32 Hearing supports the charges against him to go to Court Martial, he's toast. The Jury will be comprised of his peers mostly (enlisted soldiers and a smattering of officers perhaps), not civilians. He will be found guilty of desertion and sent to Leavenworth for life. Were he facing a civilian Grand Jury and a civilian court, anything is possible (ref OJ Simpson). Facing charges under the UCMJ is a completely different ball game thank God. His only hope in this instance would be the appeal process (post conviction) in my opinion where it reaches the desk of the Commander in Chief for final disposition or a Pardon decision.

Agreed. There is going to be a lot of pressure to not embarrass the POTUS. I believe he will be found guilty of desertion which is punishable by death. He will not get death, but a life sentence and I then believe and the Commander In Chief will reduce his sentence before leaving office.

 

[herdfan429]

I Don't know how fast the military justice system works but if this reaches Obamas desl before he's done you can guarantee he'll be pardoned
Posted from Rivals Mobile

 

[pj(HN)]

I don't think the Commander and Chief will insert himself into this...

 

[wvkeeper(HN)]

Originally posted by pj(HN):
I don't think the Commander and Chief will insert himself into this...

Really?

 

[pj(HN)]

Bringing a POW home is just a bit different then inserting oneself into the Military Justice System... But one never knows... He might...

 

[gunnerbj]

Classifying this deserting traitor (my opinion and character classification of him) as a POW is really borderline and tough for me to digest. He sought out the enemy voluntarily, disowned the USA, and left his weapon in camp. He's fortunate that I'm not serving on the jury.

 

[ThunderCat98]

Can you really be a POW when you leave of your own accord? Didn't he intend to turn himself in to the people that were "holding" him?
Posted from Rivals Mobile

 

[i am herdman]

Eisenhower would have already had this guy shot by firing squad.