Burdette following Caldwell
- Thread starter Jartard
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Revolving door. Lack of contributions to the athletic department puts the school in this position. Pay up or shut up! It takes money to have a good program.
That Caldwell she sure was special. I certainly understand all the love she’s getting from the Herd faithful. It’s amazing the love she had for her dream job. Is her husband still an assistant with us or did she get him an assistant coaching job at Tennessee too?
Cali we have agreed on like two things ever I think. You may want to reconsider your position on this topic since I agree with you. Haha
😀Actually Aaron I agree with you more than you would guess.
It makes my stomach turn the amount of love that she gets on here and herd fans and Facebook. I mean we have had players leave after playing here 4 years that got more crap for leaving than she does.
I’ll also never get over the hypocrisy of Marshall fans. If people like you, you can do whatever but if you aren’t anything you do is horrible. This is just the latest example of Marshall fans turning a blind eye to anything KC does by taking a coach that there were people that wanted her to be the head coach with KC gone.
My loyalty is to Marshall period. If KC would have came here and coached 3 years and had similar success and turned that into a big time job I would have thanked her profusely for what she did and wished her well. I still wouldn’t care about how she did in her next job but I would hold no ill will to her.
I keep looking for anything that showed appreciation to Marshall giving her a shot or for MU hiring her husband into a job that that head coach didn’t want him. All I see is players leaving, she takes her top assistant. In her press conference at UT she acted like she had been their coach for 10 years.
I really hope Coach Huff has a great year and some P5 plucks him to hear all the BS on here about he’s wanted to get out of here since he got here.
No fault for her taking the job. There are about 8-12 elite women's programs in the country. UT is one of them. We will suck again just like we have ever since the program has been around
And in her press conference she implied that she can get recruits to answer the phone now because she is at Tennessee, but couldnt get anyone to answer the phone when she was at Marshall.
A direct slap at Marshall
And a direct slap at the players that did answer the phone when she called.
A direct slap at Marshall
And a direct slap at the players that did answer the phone when she called.
That’s bullshit Aaron, and you know it. One of the Vol reporters stated to their AD afterwards that her speech was the best he’d ever heard for any coach being introduced.
Face it: Any of you/me/he/she/it that was offered a life & career changing opportunity wouldn’t hesitate a second to jump at it. If you say you wouldn’t, because you didn’t want to disappoint the current school’s fan base, you are lying through your teeth.
Generational talent rises fast. Just a fact.
And, when you say “she implied”, you’re putting your own obsessed spin on her words.
People bitching about her leaving are selfish, delusional twats.
She implied that more recruits will answer the phone...which is true.
It's also true that Kim C was compelled to jump on such an opportunity now. A UT-like chance for her might not be there in a few years.
It's not great for Marshall. In fact it's bad, but that's life. It's not 'selfish' acknowledging this.
Sometimes a door opening for one party is slamming the door for another party.
That isn't a slap at Marshall, it is just the truth. She now has to recruit much better players than at Marshall to win. If she was trying to recruit high profile players at MU, I am sure a lot them didn't give her the time of day since they were probably not familiar with her or Marshall. Some of these top players receive so many offers, they could never respond to all the phone calls. It also happens with Marshall football and basketball. Coaches recruit to the level of play of their conferences. Just look at the offers from the other schools for the players MU recruits.
It will be interesting to see if she can make the jump and be successful like Billy Donovan was at Florida. I realize that is a very high bar for her.
Her biggest challenge will be recruiting enough high talent kids to run her system and convince them that diminished minutes for them equals succes for all.
Most higher profile kids want all the minutes and limelight they can get.
Can she win with lesser talent at that level? Not sure.
Most higher profile kids want all the minutes and limelight they can get.
Can she win with lesser talent at that level? Not sure.
Fact is, and anyone who has watched women's basketball knows this, there are enough women of college age to staff about 40 teams. Title IX makes every single college in the country, down past Marshall, down to Glenville State, and yet further down than that, have a team. Below the top 40 level you see fundamental mistakes and lack of skill that was weeded out among males in middle school. It is bad basketball. Bad. This lack of talent depth is why you see, in conference where the level of play should be similar, 50 and 60 point blowouts, REGULARLY. It is why there have been 10 undefeated teams in women's play since Indiana did it 50 years ago among men.
KC got the opportunity to make life changing $$ doing something she likes and is good at. And gets to be at one of the 40 or so places where the games are actually watchable, in fact at one of the 10 or so places where the games actually matter to more than a certain subset of society and thus actually draw some fans and are even covered by the media on a want too, not have to, basis, where the women's coach is more than somebody that gets introduced for 10 seconds at the summer booster club tour and then we listen to the two main sports coaches talk for an hour each. And she gets to work with players that actually have skills.
I wish her well.
KC got the opportunity to make life changing $$ doing something she likes and is good at. And gets to be at one of the 40 or so places where the games are actually watchable, in fact at one of the 10 or so places where the games actually matter to more than a certain subset of society and thus actually draw some fans and are even covered by the media on a want too, not have to, basis, where the women's coach is more than somebody that gets introduced for 10 seconds at the summer booster club tour and then we listen to the two main sports coaches talk for an hour each. And she gets to work with players that actually have skills.
I wish her well.
I am also surprised by all the "love" for Kim on social media. I was very surprised to the comments supporting her move. I don't blame her for taking the money and moving on. I have only seen a couple of posts on the Herd message boards being upset about her leaving.
I am older Herd supporter and I remember when a lot of coaches moved on Marshall, fans for the most part were not pleased with losing the coaches. But that was the before social media. I was around when Wake Forest hired Carl Tacy; Florida hired Billy Donovan; Kansas State Hire Altman and UCF hired Jones. I remember when Chaump left for Navy; Parrish left for Kansas State and Donnan left for UGA. We even lost two ADs to Oregon or Oregon State and VA Tech.
You can see a trend from the above moves. A successful coach will move on to a better program. Most of the fans were upset about having the them hired away. But most of the moves were before social media became so popular.
I am not going to worry about it. One of the best things about the situation that it proved to the fans and Marshall that WB can be successful and generate support. Time to move on and to make a good hire.
I am older Herd supporter and I remember when a lot of coaches moved on Marshall, fans for the most part were not pleased with losing the coaches. But that was the before social media. I was around when Wake Forest hired Carl Tacy; Florida hired Billy Donovan; Kansas State Hire Altman and UCF hired Jones. I remember when Chaump left for Navy; Parrish left for Kansas State and Donnan left for UGA. We even lost two ADs to Oregon or Oregon State and VA Tech.
You can see a trend from the above moves. A successful coach will move on to a better program. Most of the fans were upset about having the them hired away. But most of the moves were before social media became so popular.
I am not going to worry about it. One of the best things about the situation that it proved to the fans and Marshall that WB can be successful and generate support. Time to move on and to make a good hire.
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One final thought:
Do you realize how much of an outlier it is to have a coach of Marshall, a member of the 1-bid SunBelt, be hired away by a top shelf Power 5 blue blood?
Exceedingly rare imo. Donnan hired away by Georgia. Tacy by Wake, after similarly guiding his 1st & only team to the NCAA.
Donovan to Fla. On the women’s side?
Zero, zilch, nada.
And if you ask them, both Donovan & Caldwell will tell you they are forever grateful to MU for giving them their 1st Div 1 opportunity…..
Do you realize how much of an outlier it is to have a coach of Marshall, a member of the 1-bid SunBelt, be hired away by a top shelf Power 5 blue blood?
Exceedingly rare imo. Donnan hired away by Georgia. Tacy by Wake, after similarly guiding his 1st & only team to the NCAA.
Donovan to Fla. On the women’s side?
Zero, zilch, nada.
And if you ask them, both Donovan & Caldwell will tell you they are forever grateful to MU for giving them their 1st Div 1 opportunity…..
A big selling pitch that Coach Kim can use is, "Listen, right from the beginning, you're more likely to get on the court for meaningful minutes with us instead having to sit for a season behind the starters."
Agree. Many kids will take that offer. Just depends on if they are talented enough to compete with SC, LSU and satisfy the UT donors/fanbase
She is probably making enough money that allows them to not have to worry about his employment.
Idk, I'm torn right now. I get it, a school like TN comes calling and it would be super hard to turn down. It's more of the fact that she stated this was her dream job and bolted the second someone offered more money. I don't like the message that sends especially to players. Who care about dreams and commitments, money is what matters in this life. I also believe that if she is as good as we believe then she would have been offered a job elsewhere at the end of her run here. Someone would have made room for her.
Marshall fans need to accept….TN is THE dream job in any scenario when you’re coaching WBB at Marshall.
I mean I get it. I just got a weird way of viewing things. You can go to TN and be another name on a list of other names of people who are just as good at coaching as you or you can stick it out a few years, turn G5 team into a dominant program and create a legacy. Something people will talk about for decades after you've moved on. Again though my main issue is the message it sends to say something is your dream job and bolt the second you see more money. My view point just comes from my career in the military. At one point I had an opportunity to take on a new assignment that others would have loved to have and I passed on it. Where I was at currently allowed me to mentor new troops coming in and I don't regret a thing. The success that those troops had was evident I made the right call. Anyways thats just my 2 cents and this isn't me saying I hate her or anything like that. Just disappointed.
It is a business, nothing more or less.
It is a business decision, nothing more or less. You take the opportunities when they are offered. The players already have the same situation and they can take to the portal and transferring to a different school when ever they choose to make a move. Loyalty is a two street. Coaches are as loyal as the players. We are in a different era with college athletics.
We have several Marshall coaches leave for higher programs since the early 1970's when Carl Tacy left for Wake Forest. It has happened in the past and it will continue to happen in the future. Again, one thing that is different now is that the players now have the same option.
It will be interesting to see Kim will turn into a Billy Donovan or a Stan Parish. Time will tell. Time to let it go and hopefully Marshall will hire another good coach.
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It’s perfectly normal to be disappointed - we all should be if we have any attachment to MU.
But let’s play out YouHerdMe’s hypo:
Kim continues at Marshall and achieves unprecedented success over the next 6 years. During that time, she is contacted by several P5 schools offering 3x, 5x, 7x her salary. Each time, she rebuffs them, stating over & over that Marshall is her dream job.
Marshall fans are so happy!
Then she finishes her contract and starts looking around. She would love to coach the Lady Vols! Problem is, they just hired another hot shot young coach 2 seasons ago, and there’s still 4 years left on their contract.
No one, no one in their right mind turns down the opportunity Kim now has. And, the timing just happened. I’m certain this possibility was not in her head when she took the MU job.
But let’s play out YouHerdMe’s hypo:
Kim continues at Marshall and achieves unprecedented success over the next 6 years. During that time, she is contacted by several P5 schools offering 3x, 5x, 7x her salary. Each time, she rebuffs them, stating over & over that Marshall is her dream job.
Marshall fans are so happy!
Then she finishes her contract and starts looking around. She would love to coach the Lady Vols! Problem is, they just hired another hot shot young coach 2 seasons ago, and there’s still 4 years left on their contract.
No one, no one in their right mind turns down the opportunity Kim now has. And, the timing just happened. I’m certain this possibility was not in her head when she took the MU job.
That certainly is a possibility, the opposite is also possible. She could absolutely bomb over there (not saying I hope that happens). I'm not trying to kick the hornets nest with my comment but my frustration isn't really about coach Caldwell or even Marshall. I'm just tired of seeing money being the driving force for peoples decision making instead of taking a risk and bringing about something new. I may be way to idealistic for college sports but thats just my opinion, nothing more.
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For the 1 millionth time nobody cares she took the Tennessee job. What my issue is the hero worship that people have on here and other social media, The MU job was nothing more than what Huff thinks it is or any other young coach that we have had. She was looking to get out the minute she stepped on the Henderson center court.
Do you think UT recruited her? Of course not they looked at the big names first and when they couldn’t get them they looked at coaches who showed interest. She let it be known she was interested whether through her agent a search firm whoever and they interviewed her and the AD really liked her. There is a large part of there fan base who like her but don’t understand why they would hire somebody with 1 year of DI experience.
So basically she behaved exactly like Huff. Looking to get out as soon as she got here. Huff was vilified and KC is put on a pedestal. Before anybody says but it’s UT, all P5 head coaches in football make 7 figures. Dukes coach makes 3.5 million per year.
We have people gushing I’m going to follow Tenn now. Why? Because she was our head coach for less than a year. Do you think if she’s successful they will mention Marshall at all?
Let’s look at your hero.. She comes to Marshall and announces it’s her dream job she gets Marshall to hire her husband. She took our top assistant and we have already lost one of our top returning players to the portal. I’m not aware of anybody she signed for next season. So she basically leaves the WBB program in the dump. But that’s OK.
KC is an opportunist looking for the next big job to make her money and there is nothing wrong with that. Just stop acting like that if it wasn’t UT she wouldn’t have left. There is zero chance that if any P5 would have given her that contract that she wouldn’t have taken it.
she brought this on herself with the things she said when she came here. You don’t have to say it’s your dream job. You don’t have to say it’s great to be able to stay in WV. You don’t get a school to hire your husband. She chose to do all of this.
So good for her she’s just like everybody else, she doesn’t give a crap about Marshall and she used us to get a fat P5 job and make big bucks. Good for her but I hope all you hypocrites remember it the next time a player enters the portal strictly for money or another coach leaves after 1 year as our coach after 7 years in D2.
Do you think UT recruited her? Of course not they looked at the big names first and when they couldn’t get them they looked at coaches who showed interest. She let it be known she was interested whether through her agent a search firm whoever and they interviewed her and the AD really liked her. There is a large part of there fan base who like her but don’t understand why they would hire somebody with 1 year of DI experience.
So basically she behaved exactly like Huff. Looking to get out as soon as she got here. Huff was vilified and KC is put on a pedestal. Before anybody says but it’s UT, all P5 head coaches in football make 7 figures. Dukes coach makes 3.5 million per year.
We have people gushing I’m going to follow Tenn now. Why? Because she was our head coach for less than a year. Do you think if she’s successful they will mention Marshall at all?
Let’s look at your hero.. She comes to Marshall and announces it’s her dream job she gets Marshall to hire her husband. She took our top assistant and we have already lost one of our top returning players to the portal. I’m not aware of anybody she signed for next season. So she basically leaves the WBB program in the dump. But that’s OK.
KC is an opportunist looking for the next big job to make her money and there is nothing wrong with that. Just stop acting like that if it wasn’t UT she wouldn’t have left. There is zero chance that if any P5 would have given her that contract that she wouldn’t have taken it.
she brought this on herself with the things she said when she came here. You don’t have to say it’s your dream job. You don’t have to say it’s great to be able to stay in WV. You don’t get a school to hire your husband. She chose to do all of this.
So good for her she’s just like everybody else, she doesn’t give a crap about Marshall and she used us to get a fat P5 job and make big bucks. Good for her but I hope all you hypocrites remember it the next time a player enters the portal strictly for money or another coach leaves after 1 year as our coach after 7 years in D2.
I could be way off base, here, but isn’t it normal protocol for the AD of the interested school to contact our AD with a heads up? Not that they need permission, but more like a courtesy….?
Yes, and it happened in this instance as well.
Some on here act as if these top level ADs are clueless......that they need a PR firm or agency to promote their next head coach for them......nonsense!
Even Spears says he keeps index cards of potential coaches that he would contact if an opening occurred. He said it last spring on a local sports show. He stated he is constantly changing that list due to other openings and what-not. All ADs have to be prepared for when a head coach leaves. That is a huge part of that occupation. White at UT has a track record of hiring good coaches. He isn't a novice.
Caldwell didn't leave for Northwestern or Boston College or Georgia Tech. She left for one of the name programs in women's basketball with one of the more storied coaches. She also went to a school that will have resources. You don't wait around at Marshall for four or five years to see if that job opens back up. It is foolish to even entertain that type of thinking just because you have your green-and-white goggles strapped on your face.
And I have also seen where people compare this to Stan Parrish or George Chaump. NOPE! Parrish left Marshall for one of the worst programs in the country.....a team with no history of success. He jumped at the first opportunity to go to a Division 1A school. Bad mistake on his part! Chaump tried to install a pro-style offense at a military academy. It didn't work. Caldwell is going to a big-name program for women's basketball.
What is the problem in the hopes that she does well? It shows future potential candidates for a women's coaching job here that you can come to Marshall and have a gateway to possibly going to an elite program. Good. That paves the way for Marshall to get the best possible candidates to apply for coaching positions. Some of us are tired of some of these "lifetime coaches" that certainly start to get lazy with many functions of the head coaching position the longer they are here. Some of us are tired of the coaches that say in a round-about way "hey, mediocrity isn't so bad" or "hard to win at Marshall or Huntington".
Yes, it does look like she bled the program. But she let our admin know when she was interviewed that she primarily recruits JUCOs and transfers. That has always been her philosophy. I doubt seriously that she told 4 players to hit the transfer portal. The next coach will need some time. But had Caldwell remained here, our chances of getting some quality JUCOs and transfers would have been much better than the past few years.
I am glad for Kim and this opportunity. She came to Marshall in year one and showed the fanbase here that you don't have to accept all the excuse talk and lame excuses and lazy coaching that other coaches show. She won two championships in year one. She had a player of the year in year one. She had a tournament MVP in year one.
Here is my opinion on this. She came to Marshall and we had the greatest basketball success in decades. The success endeared her and the team to fans mostly because it came as a huge surprise. Whether Marshall was her dream job or not, any thinking person would have made the career move to Tennessee. What if this year was her best season and another big payday opportunity never came along. To be loyal is commendable, but so is supporting yourself and your family. Congratulations to her and it’s time to find another great hire.
When KC came here it may have been her dream job. Why? Because she had been successful at Glenville for many years and was waiting for an opportunity. Marshall was her opportunity. And she took advantage of it. Winning big in her one year here. Now, she's thinking maybe I can be good. And UT came calling. If a banker, salesman, engineer or some other person were making $100k per year at A company and B company comes along and offers $300k they would be foolish not to take it. And so it is with Kim. When one dream is met search for another. I can't begrudge her one bit.
the nonsensical bs that she only took the job because it was UT is ridiculous. She took it for the money. If Ga Tech or Wake Forest or any other lesser P5 program would have gave her tge same offer she would have taken it. Again there’s nothing wrong with it but at least be honest.
What some of you aren’t getting is I’m not begrudging her. I’m begrudging our fans who are gigantic hypocrites. KC is a hero and Coach Huff and our players who left for NIL money are scum bags.
What some of you aren’t getting is I’m not begrudging her. I’m begrudging our fans who are gigantic hypocrites. KC is a hero and Coach Huff and our players who left for NIL money are scum bags.
I think:
When Huff is offered a Tennessee-level HC position, let’s revisit the subject.
When Huff is offered a Tennessee-level HC position, let’s revisit the subject.
Who is saying she ONLY took the job because of UT? Money and prestige are a given when discussing TN and collegiate WBB
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