All my questions
- Thread starter greengeezer
- Start date
Jesus Christ(sorry Lord), this gets worse and worse.
Sources previously told ABC News that the building had been swept, but investigators are trying to determine whether roof access had been properly locked down.
The gunman gained roof access without a ladder, according to a source briefed on the preliminary findings.
abcnews.go.com
Building where gunman was found was officer staging area
The building where gunman Thomas Crooks scrambled onto the roof and opened fire was the staging area for the local police tactical team doing overwatch of the crowd, two law enforcement officials told ABC News.Sources previously told ABC News that the building had been swept, but investigators are trying to determine whether roof access had been properly locked down.
The gunman gained roof access without a ladder, according to a source briefed on the preliminary findings.
Building where gunman was found was officer staging area
We need a complete independent review. Outside of govt. Something stinks here. This has to be one of the worst acts of incompetence ever.
Don’t believe I have ever responded to my own post, but I feel it needs a clarification. When I stated that I was having “fun,” I in no way meant that I was in any way enjoying the violence and death that occurred.
I am a detail person and I love history. All of the information around a historical event is of interest to me. I just finished a book about tunnel warfare during the Viet Nam war, and another about the tragedy of the Wilhelm Gustloff, the largest maritime disaster to ever happen. History fascinates me.
Jesus Christ(sorry Lord), this gets worse and worse.
Building where gunman was found was officer staging area
The building where gunman Thomas Crooks scrambled onto the roof and opened fire was the staging area for the local police tactical team doing overwatch of the crowd, two law enforcement officials told ABC News.
Sources previously told ABC News that the building had been swept, but investigators are trying to determine whether roof access had been properly locked down.
The gunman gained roof access without a ladder, according to a source briefed on the preliminary findings.
Building where gunman was found was officer staging area
interesting.
I swear I saw somewhere there was a ladder. ?maybe there was one but he didn't use it?
Same. I understand what you're saying.
I have this desire to know the how and why even for tragedies.
I got very interested in that plane that went down in the pacific years ago too.
I think it's just a man thing (kind of aspy, but whatever) - on average, men are interested in things, women are interested in people.
I saw some place there was a ladder. I think even one person reported they saw him with a ladder. But, other witnesses said he bear crawled up the building.
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We almost woke up in a different country this morning. I don't know what would have happened but, I can't imagine it would be good. It might have been ugly.
Yes.
I talked to a family member that's a big Trump hater. He would never vote for him and really hates him. But he said I'm glad he's not dead, this country would have spiraled into chaos. A high trust society is more fragile than people think.
I have seen a number of those metal style buildings with a metal rung ladder built into the side for roof access. I don’t know if this was the case with this building or not.
It just keeps getting worse.
. According to multiple law enforcement sources, Thomas Crooks was spotted by law enforcement on a roof nearly 30 minutes before shots were fired that injured Trump, killed a former fire chief, and injured two others in the crowd.
www.wpxi.com
. According to multiple law enforcement sources, Thomas Crooks was spotted by law enforcement on a roof nearly 30 minutes before shots were fired that injured Trump, killed a former fire chief, and injured two others in the crowd.
Alleged Trump shooter spotted by law enforcement nearly 30 minutes before shots fired, sources say
Channel 11 news uncovered dramatic new details Monday in the moments leading up to the assassination attempt on former president Donald Trump.
This reminds me of a roadrunner cartoon where the coyote is looking all around and can’t find the roadrunner because it is standing on his head
Civil War!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
There is a new video of Secret Service moving photographers away who were standing behind trump, directly in line of the shooting, about 5 - 10 seconds before the shooting started. I bet Obama was behind it! No, wait: the Clintons! No, wait: Hunter! No, wait: Bill Gates! No, wait: Oprah! No, wait: Katy Perry!
Do you need thunk things would be ugly if he would har been killed? Do you even care?
There are many variables to this. The main is what caliber the AR was chambered in. While the original and traditional round has been 5.56 millimeter. This is the diameter of the bullet which calculates out to .223" or a little less than a quarter of an inch.
There have several references to the bullet being a .22. I'd say more likely they are referring to the 5.56 (.223) round. A .22 long rifle typically range is 150 yards so that is not likely the round.
The 5.56 is a light, fast moving round that will cut right through a target that has little density or resistance such as paper or an ear. Its range is approximately 4 times that of a .22lr. The weight of most 5.56 rounds is 55 grains or .126 ounces.
Much of this 5.56 ammo is also solid point in that it will not deform or expand when it hits a target, especially something low density like an ear unlike a hollow point hitting muscle and bone.
Long answer short - basically a quarter of an inch hole or tear in someone's ear.
At an angle. If he would taken a direct hit. His head would have exploded. He was that close to death.
Reports are he purchased a five foot ladder the day prior.
Here is the side of the building: https://www.google.com/maps/@40.858...71uQQ!2e0!7i16384!8i8192?coh=205409&entry=ttu
Yes but the question was damage to an ear like how Trump was hit.
@i am herdman
Speaking of metal roofs….
I’m seeing two places now of reports that a local SWAT sniper team (not Secret service) was supposed to be on the roof as initial plan. However, due to heat they elected to get off roof and be on ground/in building.
So secret service sniper hesitated because he thought his team was up there, not a shooter. And secret service agent sniper may not have had communication /audio that there was a suspect on the roof.
Seems plausible but who knows.
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This is exactly the same scenario that has played out in most tragic, high profile shootings. Once they have a chance to go back and look at all the chain of events, they discover the weak or missing links. The one law enforcement person out of place, the one misunderstood communication, the blind luck of the shooter.
Then the “ifs” come out. If only we had stationed a man here. If only we would have arrived 20 seconds earlier. On and on. Of course, it is inevitable this will happen again.
Still a failure. Failure in planning and comms. That need to be communicated and approved. Secret Service is the lead agency and has ultimate authority over everyone else in terms of protection of Presidents, former Presidents, candidates for President, etc. They could have set up a temporary tower. Brought in a cherry picker. That angle, from the side, was a near perfect angle for a sniper to use. From the side and not a long range with a rifle. Luckily, he was a bad shot. Unfortunately, for the victim that perished.
Looks like there might be some finger pointing that happens. It ultimately, goes back to the Secret Service. If the local sniper team pulled off the roof. Trump should have been taken off the stage.
Like the airline industry (which has a very good record and has very well thought out safety culture), the security "industry" just can't make mistakes.
The one missing piece I can't wrap my head around is how no one on stage knew all this was going on....former POTUS should not have been on that stage. Seems like not only was it a positioning issue but a communication issue as well.
This is one of those situations where even a person w/o experience can see that a roof 150yds away had perfect access and line to the stage. How the SS didn't see (they did and said nothing) this prior to DJT taking the stage and say "wait-hold", get the area covered before we let people come out is totally incomprehensible. Incompetence on full display.
...and just to alarm you even more....I'd bet no one is fired over this either.
Saw a report that they had been spotting this shooter prior but, lost track of him. Not sure if that is validated.
A man says he saw a man with a rangefinder prior to the shooting.
I still think this goes back to poor planning, poor communication, and perhaps not enough resources. Also, there is a training element that needs to be discussed. The DEI bull shit needs to be discussed.
Yes, CBS is reporting that this morning (I think I saw it there). They saw him, saw a range finder, took pics of him, then lost track of him until he re-appeared on the roof.
Somewhere else (I can't recall where) said he may have gotten on roof via duct work.
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All the questions you guys are asking “how this, how that” are pretty easily answered. Just ask, what is more likely, an agency that has provided high level security, hundreds of times a year, totally forgot how to do it on July 13, 2024, or things were allowed to happen for a reason?
Also, keep in mind that the Trump detail, those people on the stage with him, are
Not the ones that do advanced scouting, logistical planning, determine staffing, set up plans with local law enforcement, etc. They are briefed and have input, but don’t run the show. Those shots are called higher up the chain.
Also, keep in mind that the Trump detail, those people on the stage with him, are
Not the ones that do advanced scouting, logistical planning, determine staffing, set up plans with local law enforcement, etc. They are briefed and have input, but don’t run the show. Those shots are called higher up the chain.
Correct. We will never likely know the answers, legitimately. Planning failure.
LOL. The @ pitch on that roof . Like a 10 foot putt you have to aim one hole left. Pretty dangerous up there .
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That is the kind of excuse making we read from some of our board lefties. Good stuff.
I believe I read somewhere that he used an AK-47. The typical AK-47 is not chambered in a 5.56 mm round. AK-47 use a larger caliber round something like a 7.62 mm round. I have fired both extensively. The AK-47 is not a good sniper rifle.
It's like the manifestation of someone boiled in a vat of safetyism then gets put in charge of things with real world consequences.
"The authors define safetyism as a culture or belief system in which safety (which includes "emotional safety") has become a sacred value, which means that people become unwilling to make trade-offs demanded by other practical and moral concerns. "
The Coddling of the American Mind - Wikipedia
I would agree with you. AK is 7.62 x 39mm not to be confused with 7.62 x 51mm(NATO or .308)
The AR15 platform is considered more accurate than the AK47.
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