All quiet in Huntington

[ohio herd]

Well since Huff continues this ridiculous blackout of spring practice I will offer this as a point of discussion .This year we have a more challenging schedule it would appear at least on paper. So with that in mind, I would love to hear your thoughts on how well we should do. What makes you think we can win a Sun Belt title this year? IMO we are toast if Fancher doesn't improve or if Pennington or Harrison cant push him for playing time. Ali is a tremendous RB and Payne and Turner will give us 2 quality backups to give him a break. Last year our OL started well then struggled in the middle but seemed to slowly get better as the season played out. Not sure what to expect this year. How are the #2's looking?I mean we are one injury away from "next man up." I really have no idea about the talent of the #2's. With the departure of Gammage how are we looking in the WR corp? Will the defense continue to be a strength again? Huffs second recruiting class didn't even rank in the Top 100 on Rivals. Do we have quality kids in the class. Who is a newbie who can come in and play immediately?

 

[BleedsGreen33]

I can see the floor being 4-8 and the ceiling being 9-3.

As you pointed out we have a tougher schedule. On the road at ECU will be no cake walk, VT will be tough even though I think we win (I think it will play out like Purdue 2015), at NCST is going to be tough, and we have to play at Coastal, Appy, and S. Alabama.

Then you have to take into account all the question marks we have going into this off season.

1. We have a new DC. I know he said he wants to continue what Guidry was doing, but he's still a different coach who is going to see and call the game differently. How well can he do that.

2. The QB situation is anything but solid right now. Fancher did not look like a championship level QB at any point last season. Has he improved and by just how much. Can one of the freshman push him for the spot and is Coach Huff willing to turn the reigns over to a freshman if they look better than Cam?

3. The OL was suspect in just about every game following ND last year. Can they improve? Especially in pass protection.

4. We lost our only true #1 WR to the portal. Sure we have some talented players, but none have shown they can be the guy that takes the focus of the opposing DC.

5. Can the TEs finally start getting involved in the passing game. If they continue to only account for 10% of the total receptions we will continue struggle to move the ball and score efficiently.

6. Is Ali 100% and if he is who is going to step up to help shoulder the load so we don't run him into the ground like we did Devon Johnson back in 2015.

7. We lost some really good players off of the defense. We also returned and added a few. Can this unit come close to continuing the dominance from last year.

8. Do we have a kicker? 65% on field goals isn't going to get the job done.

 

[ohio herd]

I can see the floor being 4-8 and the ceiling being 9-3.

As you pointed out we have a tougher schedule. On the road at ECU will be no cake walk, VT will be tough even though I think we win (I think it will play out like Purdue 2015), at NCST is going to be tough, and we have to play at Coastal, Appy, and S. Alabama.

Then you have to take into account all the question marks we have going into this off season.

1. We have a new DC. I know he said he wants to continue what Guidry was doing, but he's still a different coach who is going to see and call the game differently. How well can he do that.

2. The QB situation is anything but solid right now. Fancher did not look like a championship level QB at any point last season. Has he improved and by just how much. Can one of the freshman push him for the spot and is Coach Huff willing to turn the reigns over to a freshman if they look better than Cam?

3. The OL was suspect in just about every game following ND last year. Can they improve? Especially in pass protection.

4. We lost our only true #1 WR to the portal. Sure we have some talented players, but none have shown they can be the guy that takes the focus of the opposing DC.

5. Can the TEs finally start getting involved in the passing game. If they continue only account for 10% of the total receptions we will continue struggle to move the ball and score efficiently.

6. Is Ali 100% and if he is who is going to step up to shoulder the load so we don't run him into the ground like we did Devon Johnson back in 2015.

7. We lost some really good players off of the defense. We also returned and added a few. Can this unit come close to continuing the dominance from last year.

8. Do we have a kicker? 65% on field goals isn't going to get the job done.

I forgot about the new DC. Hopefully we don't miss a beat..... has he ever been a DC before?

 

[BleedsGreen33]

I forgot about the new DC. Hopefully we don't miss a beat..... has he ever been a DC before?

I think he has at the lower levels and was pretty successful. I don't think he has ever been a DC at the D-I level though.

 

[RhinoD]

Just giving the schedule a look and seeing what the teams on our slate did last year and what they have coming back... I could see the Herd finishing anywhere from 4-8 to 10-2. Too many variables with the portal, you never know who is going to step in at another program and light it up right away.

Here is the best case scenario IMO...

Albany -- FCS team at home (W)
ECU -- Pirates had a good year last year, but lost a ton on offense including a 3-year starter at QB. (W)
Virginia Tech -- Coming off a terrible year by their standards and likely still starting Wells at QB. (W)
Old Dominion -- Lost their best offensive weapon, we struggle with them every year, but pull it out. (W)
NC State -- Too much of a talent gap, on the road. (L)
Georgia State -- Always have athletes, never seem to put it together. (W)
James Madison -- Don't love the matchup but its in Huntington. (W)
Coastal Carolina -- Probably the best roster in the East, on the road. (L)
App State -- Coming off a terrible year by their standards, could bounce back, could not. (W)
Georgia Southern -- Can score 50 any game, can give up 51 any game, in Huntington (W)
South Alabama -- Another team that lost their entire offense from last year, like 8 guys. (W)
Arkansas State -- Worst team in SBC, at home. (W)

 

[ohio herd]

Just giving the schedule a look and seeing what the teams on our slate did last year and what they have coming back... I could see the Herd finishing anywhere from 4-8 to 10-2. Too many variables with the portal, you never know who is going to step in at another program and light it up right away.

Here is the best case scenario IMO...

Albany -- FCS team at home (W)
ECU -- Pirates had a good year last year, but lost a ton on offense including a 3-year starter at QB. (W)
Virginia Tech -- Coming off a terrible year by their standards and likely still starting Wells at QB. (W)
Old Dominion -- Lost their best offensive weapon, we struggle with them every year, but pull it out. (W)
NC State -- Too much of a talent gap, on the road. (L)
Georgia State -- Always have athletes, never seem to put it together. (W)
James Madison -- Don't love the matchup but its in Huntington. (W)
Coastal Carolina -- Probably the best roster in the East, on the road. (L)
App State -- Coming off a terrible year by their standards, could bounce back, could not. (W)
Georgia Southern -- Can score 50 any game, can give up 51 any game, in Huntington (W)
South Alabama -- Another team that lost their entire offense from last year, like 8 guys. (W)
Arkansas State -- Worst team in SBC, at home. (W)

Rhino I hope you are right on this one, I'm not that optimistic yet

 

[RhinoD]

Rhino I hope you are right on this one, I'm not that optimistic yet

Haha... I won't say I am either, but that's the best case scenario... Personally, I think 7-5 or 8-4 is much more likely.

 

[BleedsGreen33]

Virginia Tech -- Coming off a terrible year by their standards and likely still starting Wells at QB. (W)

Yea. I too see this as a W. As I posted above I see this being exactly like VT. Grant is going to be trying way too hard in this game just because he's coming back to Huntington.

VT's roster is a shell of what it was during the Beamer era. I see this game being uncomfortably close for VT and Grant will start forcing things late in the game and turns the ball over once or twice. One of which will results in points. We win by a 3-9 point margin.

 

[MichiganHerd]

Albany -- FCS team at home (W)
ECU -- Pirates had a good year last year, but lost a ton on offense including a 3-year starter at QB. (W)
Virginia Tech -- Coming off a terrible year by their standards and likely still starting Wells at QB. (W)
Old Dominion -- Lost their best offensive weapon, we struggle with them every year, but pull it out. (W)
NC State -- Too much of a talent gap, on the road. (L)
Georgia State -- Always have athletes, never seem to put it together. (W)
James Madison -- Don't love the matchup but its in Huntington. (W)
Coastal Carolina -- Probably the best roster in the East, on the road. (L)
App State -- Coming off a terrible year by their standards, could bounce back, could not. (W)
Georgia Southern -- Can score 50 any game, can give up 51 any game, in Huntington (W)
South Alabama -- Another team that lost their entire offense from last year, like 8 guys. (W)
Arkansas State -- Worst team in SBC, at home. (W)

Geezus . . .

did Perkins hack your account, or what?

 

[BleedsGreen33]

Geezus . . .

did Perkins hack your account, or what?

Nah. He'd have us 12-0 if that were the case.

 

[31Herd55]

I can see the floor being 4-8 and the ceiling being 9-3.

As you pointed out we have a tougher schedule. On the road at ECU will be no cake walk, VT will be tough even though I think we win (I think it will play out like Purdue 2015), at NCST is going to be tough, and we have to play at Coastal, Appy, and S. Alabama.

Then you have to take into account all the question marks we have going into this off season.

1. We have a new DC. I know he said he wants to continue what Guidry was doing, but he's still a different coach who is going to see and call the game differently. How well can he do that.

2. The QB situation is anything but solid right now. Fancher did not look like a championship level QB at any point last season. Has he improved and by just how much. Can one of the freshman push him for the spot and is Coach Huff willing to turn the reigns over to a freshman if they look better than Cam?

3. The OL was suspect in just about every game following ND last year. Can they improve? Especially in pass protection.

4. We lost our only true #1 WR to the portal. Sure we have some talented players, but none have shown they can be the guy that takes the focus of the opposing DC.

5. Can the TEs finally start getting involved in the passing game. If they continue to only account for 10% of the total receptions we will continue struggle to move the ball and score efficiently.

6. Is Ali 100% and if he is who is going to step up to help shoulder the load so we don't run him into the ground like we did Devon Johnson back in 2015.

7. We lost some really good players off of the defense. We also returned and added a few. Can this unit come close to continuing the dominance from last year.

8. Do we have a kicker? 65% on field goals isn't going to get the job done.

Great questions…but not to be answered by our clandestine coaches

 

[W-S HerdFan]

Just to note: We have never won at Dowdy Ficklin stadium…..

 

[GeauxHerd]

Listen to the sounds of heavy equipment that are building the baseball field. It’s not all quiet

 

[MUMAN3419]

I see an 7-5 or 8-4 type season. With poor QB play we are destined to be an average to above average team.

 

[TwolfHerdfan]

I've said 8-4. If we get improved QB and offensive play, maybe better. We can't expect the D to be as good as last year, lost too many experienced pieces.
Losses to ECU, NC St, Coastal and App. We bring an ND type effort against the Hokies.

 

[BleedsGreen33]

I've said 8-4. If we get improved QB and offensive play, maybe better. We can't expect the D to be as good as last year, lost too many experienced pieces.
Losses to ECU, NC St, Coastal and App. We bring an ND type effort against the Hokies.

Year 3 and 8-4 is what we hope for. Considering why we made the coaching move this venture cannot be considered a success if that's where we're at by season's end.

 

[RhinoD]

Year 3 and 8-4 is what we hope for. Considering why we made the coaching move this venture cannot be considered a success if that's where we're at by season's end.

We (fans, boosters, etc) want to win league titles... That's why the change was made and you're right, more years of 8-4 isn't the desired result.

Weird football purgatory is difficult to deal with... On one hand, there are a ton of programs that would absolutely love to consistently win 7 to 9 games. On the other, you want to break through and be conference champs at some point.

 

[TwolfHerdfan]

Year 3 and 8-4 is what we hope for. Considering why we made the coaching move this venture cannot be considered a success if that's where we're at by season's end.

I'm not gonna get too uptight right now. I'll wait and see how it goes. Got too much other shit going on to worry about MU football.

 

[ohio herd]

Listen to the sounds of heavy equipment that are building the baseball field. It’s not all quiet

Best news and best noise in a long time

 

[oldeherd]

Then too, Ohio herd, if it gets "too quiet" on here, you could always lead a spirited discussion about all those 4 and 5 star basketball recruits that Danny D. is reeling in almost weekly out of the portal in order to take HERD basketball to the "next level" in the next three seasons!!!

 

[Rock98Dog]

It’s disappointing that we haven’t had a really good QB in 10 years, but WKU can pluck one from the portal every year.

 

[riflearm2]

It’s disappointing that we haven’t had a really good QB in 10 years, but WKU can pluck one from the portal every year.

We’ve had really good QBs. We just haven’t had the equivalent in coaches.

 

[31Herd55]

It’s disappointing that we haven’t had a really good QB in 10 years, but WKU can pluck one from the portal every year.

Good passing QBs prefer schools that have a good reputation of passing the ball…we no longer have that reputation.

 

[BleedsGreen33]

It’s disappointing that we haven’t had a really good QB in 10 years, but WKU can pluck one from the portal every year.

We haven't had the best coaching either. Look at the offense that WKU runs and look at Doc after Cato and now what Huff is doing.

 

[sluggo72]

We’ve had really good QBs. We just haven’t had the equivalent in coaches.

I'd like a list of these really good QB's the last 10 yrs not named Cato. Chase Litton? Alex Thompson? Birdsong? just wondering

 

[riflearm2]

I'd like a list of these really good QB's the last 10 yrs not named Cato. Chase Litton? Alex Thompson? Birdsong? just wondering

Well, by you excluding Cato, you're taking away 20% of the years over the last 10 since he was QB in 2013 and 2014. So how many years did we have a really good QB over the last 10?

Cato's last two.

Chase Litton was a really good QB (and statistically for two of his three years). You don't make multiple NFL practice rosters and get pre-season reps without being good.

Grant Wells was a stud QB for us. Did he have turnover issues? Sure. But you don't put up those kind of numbers so early in your career if you aren't a good QB.

Isaiah Green could have been a really good QB with the right guidance.

So out of the last 10, we have had at least six years of good quarterbacks. The inability to get production out of them is on their development and coaching and not their ability.

 

[ohio herd]

Well, by you excluding Cato, you're taking away 20% of the years over the last 10 since he was QB in 2013 and 2014. So how many years did we have a really good QB over the last 10?

Cato's last two.

Chase Litton was a really good QB (and statistically for two of his three years). You don't make multiple NFL practice rosters and get pre-season reps without being good.

Grant Wells was a stud QB for us. Did he have turnover issues? Sure. But you don't put up those kind of numbers so early in your career if you aren't a good QB.

Isaiah Green could have been a really good QB with the right guidance.

So out of the last 10, we have had at least six years of good quarterbacks. The inability to get production out of them is on their development and coaching and not their ability.

What are your thoughts on Fancher? Has he peaked yet or do you think he can improve?

 

[TwolfHerdfan]

I'd like a list of these really good QB's the last 10 yrs not named Cato. Chase Litton? Alex Thompson? Birdsong? just wondering

None. We haven't developed a good, multi year starter at QB in forever.
Since Stan Hill, we've had Cato. That's it.

Litton sucked and was a cancer head case. The others were average at best.

 

[CamJoanBaller]

Georgia State -- Always have athletes, never seem to put it together. (W)

I think GS wins the conference next year. They have a bunch of boogers coming back that can play

 

[31Herd55]

What are your thoughts on Fancher? Has he peaked yet or do you think he can improve?

Throws a beautiful bounce pass and has an arm strong enough to overthrow Ronald McDonald from the 10-yard line on 4th & goal.

 

[MUMAN3419]

Fancher is not a good pocket qb. But he has the talent to win football games. I am more disappointed in the coaching than the play of Fancher. You need to use a players talents than try to make him something that he is not or will ever become. Just my thoughts on Fancher.

 

[TwolfHerdfan]

Fancher is not a good pocket qb. But he has the talent to win football games. I am more disappointed in the coaching than the play of Fancher. You need to use a players talents than try to make him something that he is not or will ever become. Just my thoughts on Fancher.

Agree, when rolling out, he is much more effective. It's really on Huff and Trickett to design the scheme to his strengths.

 

[RhinoD]

Things I like about Fancher --

• He got better as last season went on (until the bowl game)
• He is willing to keep the ball on the read option and can be effective doing so
• He appears to be a "gamer" he got drilled a couple times last year, caught his wind and went right back in

Things Fancher definitely needs to work on --

• His throwing accuracy, especially past 10-12 yards, has been awful
• His grasp of the situation has been lacking at times (throwing to the check down on 3rd/11, 4th down, etc)
• He hasn't shown the ability to make a game-changing play (either throwing or running), relies on long drives

 

[sluggo72]

None. We haven't developed a good, multi year starter at QB in forever.
Since Stan Hill, we've had Cato. That's it.

Litton sucked and was a cancer head case. The others were average at best.

well not according to Rifle

 

[riflearm2]

Litton sucked

Litton sucked

2015: 6th most passing yards for all freshman; set Marshall freshman record for TDs and passing yards;
2016: 27th out of 130 QBs for passing yards per game
2017: 31st out of 130 for passing yards

I could go on with more stats, but finishing in the top 25% of the country in most major categories is far from "sucking." And then there's that whole thing about making NFL practice squads, etc.

Did Litton live up to what he could have been? No. Was he a good college QB? Absolutely.

 

[TwolfHerdfan]

2015: 6th most passing yards for all freshman; set Marshall freshman record for TDs and passing yards;
2016: 27th out of 130 QBs for passing yards per game
2017: 31st out of 130 for passing yards

I could go on with more stats, but finishing in the top 25% of the country in most major categories is far from "sucking." And then there's that whole thing about making NFL practice squads, etc.

Did Litton live up to what he could have been? No. Was he a good college QB? Absolutely.

He was average when you consider no league titles, title games. Did he even make all conference at any point? You know as well as I do, the NFL goes through QB's like water through a sieve. He couldn't even make it in Canada with the CFL. He wasn't bad on the stat side as you pointed out; but his total body of work wouldn't jump out to anyone. jmho.

 

[19MU88]

but his total body of work wouldn't jump out to anyone. jmho.

except NFL scouts

 

[BleedsGreen33]

He was average when you consider no league titles, title games. Did he even make all conference at any point? You know as well as I do, the NFL goes through QB's like water through a sieve. He couldn't even make it in Canada with the CFL. He wasn't bad on the stat side as you pointed out; but his total body of work wouldn't jump out to anyone. jmho.

It takes a team to do that. As @riflearm2 keeps pointing out coaching is a big part of it. The Litton years were some of the most uneven rosters that Doc had during his time here. As I've pointed out several times over, Doc went into cruise control after winning the conference in 2014.

I would also just point out another thing. Since Cato our QBs all suffered from the same issue. Throwing off of their back foot and usually that gets remedied with experience, but it was something the QBs either regressed on or never shook.

I just don't understand why we have dedicated coaches for every position other than QB.

I don't know about Green, but I do believe that both Litton and Wells were extremely talented QBs that never got the right coaching and were damaged goods. I still believe had Litton came back he and Brady were poised to have huge senior seasons and I also believe that Doc and Cramsey ruined Grant when they left him out there flapping in the wind against Rice. We were down two of our starting OL and Adams couldn't move which was getting Grant beat to death and all Cramsey kept doing is dialing up bombs and multiple step drops. He completely forgot that Knox existed.

I don't think Green could digest the playbook well enough to command the offense as he looked completely lost at time and from the moment we recruited him I thought Thomson was a waste of a scholarship.

 

[31Herd55]

Fancher is not a good pocket qb. But he has the talent to win football games. I am more disappointed in the coaching than the play of Fancher. You need to use a players talents than try to make him something that he is not or will ever become. Just my thoughts on Fanch

2015: 6th most passing yards for all freshman; set Marshall freshman record for TDs and passing yards;
2016: 27th out of 130 QBs for passing yards per game
2017: 31st out of 130 for passing yards

I could go on with more stats, but finishing in the top 25% of the country in most major categories is far from "sucking." And then there's that whole thing about making NFL practice squads, etc.

Did Litton live up to what he could have been? No. Was he a good college QB? Absolutely.

Litton…Mama’s little malcontent…just happy to get another participation trophy.

 

[BleedsGreen33]

Litton…Mama’s little malcontent…just happy to get another participation trophy.

It's odd to me that everyone hated on him and questioned his character and yet Foster was right there with him and no one ever criticized him.