Charlotte has 1 win away from home....

[The Real SamC]

You would have to be blind as a bat to be upset with the state of Marshall Basketball

Well we know know you fall into the 3rd category, the Delusionals.

26 point beat down assream by 9-8, 8-8 in D I, Toledo at home.
Solid 10 point win by 11-7, 10-7 in D I, 9-7 vs non HBCUs, C of Charleston at home.
Solid 12 point win by Akron, at home.
Second loss to Toledo, this time by “only” 8.
Loss to 7-8, 6-8 vs D I, 4-8 vs non HBCUs, North Texas at home.

Two wins over teams with winning records, 8-7 Rice and a solid upset over 15-2 Duquesne, which probably eliminated them from NCAA at-large consideration

Accepting not mediocrity, but something well less than that.

 

[Herdmeister]

Well we know know you fall into the 3rd category, the Delusionals.

26 point beat down assream by 9-8, 8-8 in D I, Toledo at home.
Solid 10 point win by 11-7, 10-7 in D I, 9-7 vs non HBCUs, C of Charleston at home.
Solid 12 point win by Akron, at home.
Second loss to Toledo, this time by “only” 8.
Loss to 7-8, 6-8 vs D I, 4-8 vs non HBCUs, North Texas at home.

Two wins over teams with winning records, 8-7 Rice and a solid upset over 15-2 Duquesne, which probably eliminated them from NCAA at-large consideration

Accepting not mediocrity, but something well less than that.

as is my custom, I always wait until the season is over before declaring the type of year we have had.

 

[GoHerdMarshallYes]

We should have equal expectations for both.

"Fire Doc! He lost to a terrible MTSU team! Oh god the season is finished!!! I don't care that we have an entire conference season left to play! Or if we still have a shot at winning! I wanna cancel my tickets! Green is awful and needs to be replaced and is the worst, no, the worstest player at Marshall ever!!!! Waaaah!!!! Waaaaah!!!"

"Who cares if we beat LT? They were missing like 3 of their best players. They soooooooooo woulda beat us had their starters played. We need to fire Doc, Green, and Hamrick for good measure. I still won't show up to games."



"Stay the course guys. Lets not give up yet. This team is young. We need to remember and trust in Dan that he knows what he is doing. Remember, we won an NCAA tournament game like 2 years ago. The team was fun to watch even if they got demolished by a MAC school. No single player is to blame because its a team effort. Hey, the season is early!"

"Did you see us beat that 10 win team?!?! We smoked 'em! Dan's got us in the right direction!!! I can't wait till we enter conference play and turn some heads!!"

 

[TwolfHerdfan]

"Fire Doc! He lost to a terrible MTSU team! Oh god the season is finished!!! I don't care that we have an entire conference season left to play! Or if we still have a shot at winning! I wanna cancel my tickets! Green is awful and needs to be replaced and is the worst, no, the worstest player at Marshall ever!!!! Waaaah!!!! Waaaaah!!!"

"Who cares if we beat LT? They were missing like 3 of their best players. They soooooooooo woulda beat us had their starters played. We need to fire Doc, Green, and Hamrick for good measure. I still won't show up to games."



"Stay the course guys. Lets not give up yet. This team is young. We need to remember and trust in Dan that he knows what he is doing. Remember, we won an NCAA tournament game like 2 years ago. The team was fun to watch even if they got demolished by a MAC school. No single player is to blame because its a team effort. Hey, the season is early!"

"Did you see us beat that 10 win team?!?! We smoked 'em! Dan's got us in the right direction!!! I can't wait till we enter conference play and turn some heads!!"

Why the rant? I clearly said we should have equal expectations for both. What’s not to understand about that?

 

[muthed]

Well we know know you fall into the 3rd category, the Delusionals.

26 point beat down assream by 9-8, 8-8 in D I, Toledo at home.
Solid 10 point win by 11-7, 10-7 in D I, 9-7 vs non HBCUs, C of Charleston at home.
Solid 12 point win by Akron, at home.
Second loss to Toledo, this time by “only” 8.
Loss to 7-8, 6-8 vs D I, 4-8 vs non HBCUs, North Texas at home.

Two wins over teams with winning records, 8-7 Rice and a solid upset over 15-2 Duquesne, which probably eliminated them from NCAA at-large consideration

Accepting not mediocrity, but something well less than that.

Don't forget, lost by 11 to UNCC. Lost by 11 to MTSU. 2 SOLID teams.

 

[W-S HerdFan]

Sam typed:
Well "we" know you fall into the 3rd category, the Delusionals. (I added the quotes)

Hey Old timer - what do you mean, "we"? You certainly don't speak for me, and I would wager 90% of this board would say the same.
From now on, use "I", since your opinions/definitions/delusions are yours and your alone.

Go HERD !!!!

 

[Tim_N_Montana]

19-17 when West takes a rest. 19-29 when he returns. He is so important to this team right now.

 

[ilmherdfan]

30% FG
3-8 FT
4-15 from 3 (27%)

UNCC shot 54%

can’t win like that

 

[ilmherdfan]

We look awful tonight. Doesn’t look line they are playing with intensity or focus. Energy come in small bursts.

Just a poor outing all around including coaching.

 

[W-S HerdFan]

Charlotte is very sound on both ends. We couldn’t get stops when we needed to. Their big was too tough for our bigs. Can’t miss 10 free throws! Go Herd

 

[whf2]

Make that two wins away from home...

 

[beefcake0520]

I hate the double standards on this board for our fb and bb coaches. Some call it like it is and some flat out hate holiday and love Dan, even though performance is relative to date...lol kills me

 

[19MU88]

I hate the double standards on this board for our fb and bb coaches. Some call it like it is and some flat out hate holiday and love Dan, even though performance is relative to date...lol kills me

well maybe if you studied up on the status of the two programs over the last 30-40 years you might better understand.

 

[Sean Hammond]

Charlotte is very sound on both ends. We couldn’t get stops when we needed to. Their big was too tough for our bigs. Can’t miss 10 free throws! Go Herd

In other words, we suck right now.

 

[The Real SamC]

Only real surprise was the final score. The game was not really that close at all. Totally outmatched and totally out coached. UNCC showed no killer instinct when it had us by the throat.

Next up is a truly bad ODU team. Has not beaten anyone with a pulse. Might be close.

 

[beefcake0520]

well maybe if you studied up on the status of the two programs over the last 30-40 years you might better understand.

I am well aware of the history of both, old enough to have watched both from 97 on. What I said doesn't point at 30-40 years, it points to each coach's accomplishments during their career at Marshall. We blast Holiday for not winning championships every year, or not winning enough, but Dan has a similar resume to date, and only a few point that out, this is where I scratch my head. You can't be disgusted with one, without being disgusted with the other, in an apples to apples comparison. Feel free to disagree but this is how I view it.

 

[GoHerdMarshallYes]

Why the rant? I clearly said we should have equal expectations for both. What’s not to understand about that?

Because when one loses, its half a dozen posts/threads about how he needs fired.

When the other loses, it's all about how young we are and how it doesn't matter till the conference tournament.

 

[GoHerdMarshallYes]

Don't forget, lost by 11 to UNCC. Lost by 11 to MTSU. 2 SOLID teams.

And that was it.

Dan's gonna lose quite a few conference games unless he gets his head out of his ass and coaches better.

 

[TwolfHerdfan]

Because when one loses, its half a dozen posts/threads about how he needs fired.

When the other loses, it's all about how young we are and how it doesn't matter till the conference tournament.

Direct it toward someone else. I'm not Dan or Docs fluffer like some.

 

[lexkyherdfan]

well maybe if you studied up on the status of the two programs over the last 30-40 years you might better understand.

So it is ok for our basketball program to play like crap because our history just isn't that great? That is crazy. We have a coach that said he wanted to have Marshall playing for National Championships. I loved that attitude...the problem is we are not playing like conference champions and that is due to lack of personnel and where does that start? We can't shoot period. For some reason we weren't prepared for losing Burkes and Elmore. There is no reason we should be getting beat but Charlotte at home. We should be better than we are but there are misses in recruiting. I hate it. I really like DD but he deserves criticism just as much as football. The good thing is we can still get hot but right now we are digging our self in a hole in terms of the Pod seeding. We need to win all the games at home because the way this team goes up and down...we could lose a lot more road games coming up.

 

[BleedsGreen33]

I am well aware of the history of both, old enough to have watched both from 97 on. What I said doesn't point at 30-40 years, it points to each coach's accomplishments during their career at Marshall. We blast Holiday for not winning championships every year, or not winning enough, but Dan has a similar resume to date, and only a few point that out, this is where I scratch my head. You can't be disgusted with one, without being disgusted with the other, in an apples to apples comparison. Feel free to disagree but this is how I view it.

Dan can suck because Marshall basketball has sucked since 88.

Dan just won an NCAA Tournament game and conference title just 2 seasons ago. What transpired before his arrival should mean nothing. As of right now the basketball team appears to be nose diving the same way Doc's teams have since he won the conference in 2014. It would be different if Dan was struggling the whole time then you could just say, "well the program...." Not now. He's proven you can win at Marshall. He's the one that could have used the NCAA Tournament to boost his recruiting.

 

[BleedsGreen33]

A lot of people like to play the game of removing the 2014 season and asking what has Doc done as a HC. Do the same for Dan. What is his marquee OoC win? Duquesne has to be it right? There are no wins over power conference teams.

 

[raleighherdfan]

A reset is needed for both sports. Clean house. No excuse for either program to be this mediocre.

 

[lexkyherdfan]

A lot of people like to play the game of removing the 2014 season and asking what has Doc done as a HC. Do the same for Dan. What is his marquee OoC win? Duquesne has to be it right? There are no wins over power conference teams.

I have been asking the same questions about OOC wins. No marquee wins against power conference teams. I thought the goal was to be the best and win as many games as possible. Way too many people are ok for exciting play even if we lose. Quite frankly I don’t like losing and I don’t care how we lose. I am sick of football not winning championships and basketball teams continuing to lose to MAC teams and others. We should not be in this position now. Just like in football. We shouldn’t be in the position we have been in.

 

[usaHERD]

Bottom line the Herd has no shooters! None

 

[herdfan429]

Well we know know you fall into the 3rd category, the Delusionals.

26 point beat down assream by 9-8, 8-8 in D I, Toledo at home.
Solid 10 point win by 11-7, 10-7 in D I, 9-7 vs non HBCUs, C of Charleston at home.
Solid 12 point win by Akron, at home.
Second loss to Toledo, this time by “only” 8.
Loss to 7-8, 6-8 vs D I, 4-8 vs non HBCUs, North Texas at home.

Two wins over teams with winning records, 8-7 Rice and a solid upset over 15-2 Duquesne, which probably eliminated them from NCAA at-large consideration

Accepting not mediocrity, but something well less than that.

You bitch about not beating. Teams with winning records have you looked at docs?

 

[Herdmeister]

A lot of people like to play the game of removing the 2014 season and asking what has Doc done as a HC. Do the same for Dan. What is his marquee OoC win? Duquesne has to be it right? There are no wins over power conference teams.

I think beating Wichita State was FAR bigger win than Duquesne. In fact a win 2 years ago to spoil MTSU senior day was bigger as well. Beating conference champ ODU last year in Norfolk was pretty good too

 

[muthed]

Bottom line the Herd has no shooters! None

Now, come on. We have plenty of shooters. Only have a couple of makets.

 

[19MU88]

I am well aware of the history of both, old enough to have watched both from 97 on. What I said doesn't point at 30-40 years, it points to each coach's accomplishments during their career at Marshall. We blast Holiday for not winning championships every year, or not winning enough, but Dan has a similar resume to date, and only a few point that out, this is where I scratch my head. You can't be disgusted with one, without being disgusted with the other, in an apples to apples comparison. Feel free to disagree but this is how I view it.

so if you were a UK fan you would measure success in football and basketball the same way, same expectations? you can't be that big of a simpleton, but maybe you are.

 

[W-S HerdFan]

agree w/‘meister - & I think MTSU was ranked at that time.......

 

[herd2believe]

Yes and keep in mind also that DD has not had the luxury of playing WVU in Charleston. You obviously have a better chance of beating a team 5 on a neutral court. No Bahamas of Hawaii tourneys as well. Always on their home court. Some of his predecessors beat WVU in Charleston as their signature wins. Iirc ‘18 team was only team to defeat two ranked teams in a season and on road was one(MTSU).

 

[herd2believe]

Yes and keep in mind also that DD has not had the luxury of playing WVU in Charleston. You obviously have a better chance of beating a power 5 on a neutral court. No Bahamas of Hawaii tourneys as well. Always on their home court. Some of his predecessors beat WVU in Charleston as their signature wins. Iirc ‘18 team was only team to defeat two ranked teams in a season and on road was one(MTSU).

 

[beefcake0520]

so if you were a UK fan you would measure success in football and basketball the same way, same expectations? you can't be that big of a simpleton, but maybe you are.

Are you kidding, UK has pretty much always been a basketball school. I can tell you first hand that UK fans love both programs but they also understand that they aren't equal. What does that have to do with anything Marshall? It is fairly simple, call me a simpleton if you want, don't care what anyone one here thinks about my views. You have two programs that make money for the university. Those programs are guided by each coach of that time. MU basketball wasn't a dormant program before DD came on board, Jones, as much as he is hated, woke the program up and brought them to be competitive in a league that was much better than it is currently. Tom continued it in the same league setup and even made it to the champ game before his recruiting caught up to him. So let's not pretend the program has not seen an ounce of success since the 80s. Each coach marks the program despite what the previous coach did. What happened in the 80s, or early 2000s in footballs case, doesn't have a thing to do with the current coach's accomplishments and failures. Fan expectations is a completely different aspect. We had not been setting the world on fire in football since the MAC era. Despite that, Doc made the program competitive and even spoiled us again for a couple of years. Dan has a very similar result with his program. We can't blast doc for lack of decent QB play and give Dan a pass for not recruiting serviceable replacements for players that were known to graduate and leave at a set point in time. Where was the recruiting for the exposure that was received? Same can be said for Doc even though all of us fully believed Litton would get it done, before the infamous Akron game. At this point, there are way too many similarities between the two. I don't care if people agree or not.

 

[GoHerdMarshallYes]

I think beating Wichita State was FAR bigger win than Duquesne. In fact a win 2 years ago to spoil MTSU senior day was bigger as well. Beating conference champ ODU last year in Norfolk was pretty good too

Minus Wichita State, nobody cares about the rest.
Oh, hang on, ESPN may be running a special about how MU beat MTSU on senior day once.

Even the Wichita State win, a solidly good win, but once your program has done that, then what?

MU was a handful of schools who either hadn't been to the NCAA tournament or hadn't ever won a game, I can't remember. It was also a very small number of teams left who hadn't done that either.
So we celebrate something pretty much all of the D1 basketball schools have already done?

 

[GoHerdMarshallYes]

so if you were a UK fan you would measure success in football and basketball the same way, same expectations? you can't be that big of a simpleton, but maybe you are.

I can't speak for their fans in how they look at Calipari, but given what he has to work with and the amount of money invested into him, he has not delivered.
UK's culture is basketball. Its been built around that since the school existed.
I don't think you can compare MU to UK when UK clearly only cares about half the topics of the argument.

 

[HerdFan2014]

Minus Wichita State, nobody cares about the rest.
Oh, hang on, ESPN may be running a special about how MU beat MTSU on senior day once.

Even the Wichita State win, a solidly good win, but once your program has done that, then what?

MU was a handful of schools who either hadn't been to the NCAA tournament or hadn't ever won a game, I can't remember. It was also a very small number of teams left who hadn't done that either.
So we celebrate something pretty much all of the D1 basketball schools have already done?

I’m not posting this as a Doc hater/Dan supporter. I’m posting this because this is a fact.

The 2018 MTSU victory was a road, conference game, on senior night (which featured 10th year senior, Giddy Potts and conference POY Nick King. Pointing this out to show the event’s significance) against a team that many looked at as a bubble tournament team and even in some cases an at-large bid regardless of the conference tournament results.

But maybe check to see if ESPN is airing something worth watching because you’d be better off to spend your time there, rather than embarrassing yourself here.

 

[lexkyherdfan]

I’m not posting this as a Doc hater/Dan supporter. I’m posting this because this is a fact.

The 2018 MTSU victory was a road, conference game, on senior night (which featured 10th year senior, Giddy Potts and conference POY Nick King. Pointing this out to show the event’s significance) against a team that many looked at as a bubble tournament team and even in some cases an at-large bid regardless of the conference tournament results.

But maybe check to see if ESPN is airing something worth watching because you’d be better off to spend your time there, rather than embarrassing yourself here.

But that was one win and it was a conference win. To get exposure you have to win those game and win OOC games. We can’t lose to teams like Morehead which we did the year we best MTSU. Why are we critical when we lay eggs or not win OOC games in football but it is ok to lose to MAC teams in football? And before you say well because CUSA sucks in football it isn’t much better in basketball. It is time all teams in CUSA play better in the OOC. We want a new conference in football but if we aren’t doing anything in basketball do you think soccer is going to get us there?

I will never understand why some demand excellence in one sport and look the other way in another. Both major sports should be doing better and we should demand them. We won a championship in football in 2014 and didn’t really capitalize on that as we haven’t appeared in a championship game since then. We went to the NCAA tournament d won a game and didn’t make it next year because we weren’t prepared with a backup to Penava ready to play. Then this year we were not ready for Burkes and Elmore to graduate.

We shouldn’t be in that situation. Maybe I just look at each sport and expect the best preparation in terms of recruiting and playing. I don’t see it. We have some talent in basketball but too many young players. I won’t even get into football as losses to Charlotte and MTSU is all that needs to be said there. I want all sports at Marshall be successful and do their best. Not one or another.

 

[HerdFan2014]

But that was one win and it was a conference win. To get exposure you have to win those game and win OOC games. We can’t lose to teams like Morehead which we did the year we best MTSU. Why are we critical when we lay eggs or not win OOC games in football but it is ok to lose to MAC teams in football? And before you say well because CUSA sucks in football it isn’t much better in basketball. It is time all teams in CUSA play better in the OOC. We want a new conference in football but if we aren’t doing anything in basketball do you think soccer is going to get us there?

I will never understand why some demand excellence in one sport and look the other way in another. Both major sports should be doing better and we should demand them. We won a championship in football in 2014 and didn’t really capitalize on that as we haven’t appeared in a championship game since then. We went to the NCAA tournament d won a game and didn’t make it next year because we weren’t prepared with a backup to Penava ready to play. Then this year we were not ready for Burkes and Elmore to graduate.

We shouldn’t be in that situation. Maybe I just look at each sport and expect the best preparation in terms of recruiting and playing. I don’t see it. We have some talent in basketball but too many young players. I won’t even get into football as losses to Charlotte and MTSU is all that needs to be said there. I want all sports at Marshall be successful and do their best. Not one or another.

I was just making a point that that specific win was probably bigger than the win over Duquesne. That’s all

 

[mu_herd]

I just think it's funny how a lot of people are over here shouting "Why isn't anyone criticizing Dan?!!!?" as they criticize Dan (loudly, and repeatedly). Misery does love company.

 

[RhinoD]

With last nights victory, MU basketball is now 1 win away from costing Sam $500... Right now thats the only stat that matters.

Once the 10th win is in hand we can all get back to pissing and moaning about which program is in worse shape.