Crazy night at the Capitol
- Thread starter GK4Herd
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? I am talking about teachers internally competing for jobs. That way the 25 year old good teacher can bump out the 60 year old teacher during an interview process.
Nah. What will happen is the 25 year old will be chosen because he/she makes $17,000 less. That doesn't increase pay, it punishes experience.
When they want a new job, let's say at another school then they apply for it and they go interview with the principal of the school and that school might have a hiring committee made up of teachers.
So if they are at School A and want a job at school B(when there is an opening) they put their name in, go interview for the job. You don't just get the job because you have been there 15 years and the other candidates have been there for 10.
Not acceptable. If you can't prove you're a better teacher, or if some kind of record or stats don't prove it, an interview doesn't cut the mustard.
Well, you are agreeing me with in some way because what is going on now is that they get the job based on years not quality of performance or track record. Under the system in place they are not proving it with anything other than years.
Most schools are going to hire someone with experience for most jobs(just like any other job). They are going to get references. Interview you in front of a committee. You might have to do a presentation. Answer questions, etc. They are going to know your track record because they are going to call your old principals and other teachers you worked with and they are going to give you recommendations.
We are trying to improved education not make it a good old boy system based on who has been there the longest. You still keep tenure, but you just don't automatically get a job when you change. You are going to have to interview against 3 or 4 other candidates.
WV needs to end that archaic practice.
remember i am the hypothetical governor with all power.
Just wait, Until I say I am going to go recruit teachers from other sectors of the economy. That will make their head spin.
Those recruited teachers will think of themselves superior and figure on taking over a whole county within a year cause they are just so darn smart. Probably would find that hot shot teacher somewhere buried in a mine shaft.lolWell, you are agreeing me with in some way because what is going on now is that they get the job based on years not quality of performance or track record. Under the system in place they are not proving it with anything other than years.
Most schools are going to hire someone with experience for most jobs(just like any other job). They are going to get references. Interview you in front of a committee. You might have to do a presentation. Answer questions, etc. They are going to know your track record because they are going to call your old principals and other teachers you worked with and they are going to give you recommendations.
We are trying to improved education not make it a good old boy system based on who has been there the longest. You still keep tenure, but you just don't automatically get a job when you change. You are going to have to interview against 3 or 4 other candidates.
WV needs to end that archaic practice.
remember i am the hypothetical governor with all power.
Just wait, Until I say I am going to go recruit teachers from other sectors of the economy. That will make their head spin.
Well, you are agreeing me with in some way because what is going on now is that they get the job based on years not quality of performance or track record. Under the system in place they are not proving it with anything other than years.
Most schools are going to hire someone with experience for most jobs(just like any other job). They are going to get references. Interview you in front of a committee. You might have to do a presentation. Answer questions, etc. They are going to know your track record because they are going to call your old principals and other teachers you worked with and they are going to give you recommendations.
We are trying to improved education not make it a good old boy system based on who has been there the longest. You still keep tenure, but you just don't automatically get a job when you change. You are going to have to interview against 3 or 4 other candidates.
WV needs to end that archaic practice.
remember i am the hypothetical governor with all power.
Just wait, Until I say I am going to go recruit teachers from other sectors of the economy. That will make their head spin.
Under your proposed system, it just goes back to who you know. No, not acceptable.
No it doesn't. That is why you have the principal and hiring committee made up of teachers. Everyone at the school has ownership of who is hired.
If it doesn't include pertinent stats and records PROVING you're a better teacher, the decision hinges on who you know or working for less. Not acceptable.
It does include that. Right now, you are not getting that. My system is better.
Describe how this competition for the job will work. I'm really intrigued with this idea.
Then name the pertinent stats and records needed to make the decision that one teacher is better than another.
Pretty self explanatory. School systems do it now
So, let's say you are at School A and during a transfer period there is an opening at School B.
You want to go there and work. Here is the process:
1)You are going to submit your name.
2)Others interested are going to submit their name.
3)Those interested will be called in for an interview
4)You will interview with the principal and a interview team comprised of teachers.
5)The interview could be questions. You might have to teach a lesson. You might have to prepare a presentation.
6)You also provide references which are your old principals and peers. They call them for that reference.
7)You submit your resume
8)Interview team makes a recommendation to the principal
9)Principal makes hire. Most are probably going to go with recommendation
10)You are hired for that or not.
If you are hired you go to new school, if not you stay at your old school. Your experience is helpful, of course. But, it is not a guarantee or a bid on that job.
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Peer and supervisor recommendations. Your interview skills and presentation. Just like other people interview for jobs anywhere else. Build your resume and sell yourself. Tout your skills, awards, and how well you have done on testing, etc.
See my response to GK.
You are still touting who you know (Peer and supervisor recommendations), interview skills and presentation. Testing? No, no. Uh uh. No. Unless you want to pay big money to standardize all evaluation methods in all 50 states, and then figure out how to remove all bias of those evaluations by making sure all teachers in every school have the same demographics in their class rooms. Which is impossible. Once again, no, your process sucks.
I am not talking all 50 states. Each state can decide that themselves
By the way that is they way they do this where I live. It is really just a job interview process. What does it do? Makes teachers competitive knowing they need to be good. Eliminates dead weight from getting the job automatically. Gives the principal flexibility in who they are hire. Let's the existing teacher help decide. Promotes competition. You don't just get a job because you have been there 20 years. Now most people when hiring are certainly going to take experience and that is going to be a huge deciding factor. But, old Mildred who has been milking the system for 15 years is going to have to compete for a job change. And, the technology teacher better know how to do a power point presentation and turn a computer on. You keep your tenure, but if you want to change jobs you are going to interview for it just like everybody else in America does.
Example, we were thinking about moving to another state awhile back. My wife was looking at jobs and actually could have had an interview. She was given a handbook and was told to prepare a 30 minute lesson plan to present to the committee if she decided to interview. She is a tenured teacher with a masters and has 15 years teaching experience.
You have got to eliminate the old State Road mentality of hiring and promoting.
You still have nothing but the interview process to offer. It's working out so great for NC that in 4 counties only, you have 257 teacher job vacancies. NC is trying to attract retired teachers and substitutes while looking to lower licensure requirements to fill the positions. The teaching profession is like any other business, better pay is what provides competition for jobs.
That's like comparing two masonry crews each having the same amount of workers. One is laying bricks and the other is laying blocks. Which crew lays the highest number of units?
End of year test scores would be a fair evaluation of teachers if one of the teachers have a class of kids from affluent parents compared to the other teacher who has a class from poor working class parents, or worse, parents that don't care?
Not sure about this anymore but in the 70's and 80's there are no truer words as to the politics of the school boards. I saw the power and influence hungry people first hand as my mother was on the cabell county school board for 14 years - through my junior and senior high years and a few more past that. I remember her coming home from meetings and complaining to my step-father and her friends about how Frucked up things were.
Do you know how many students are in Wake County? 159,549 students in Wake alone. It is the 15th largest school system in the country. They can't keep up with demand for schools and teachers.Wake County is growing by an average of 64 people each day (including births, deaths, and people moving), and has added 100,000 people in the last four years.
So, yes they are looking for teachers.
For reference there are 22 high schools in Wake County alone that would be all large AAA high schools in WV.
Plus, the economy is booming.
Johnston borders Wake. They lose teacher to Wake themselves becuase Wake pays more money than Johnston. Plus, they are growing as well.
Durham, you don't want to teach in most schools in Durham
Cumberland is Fayetteville area. Kind of a strange area. Growth due to FT Bragg, but Fayetteville is rough.
There are 96 other counties in NC that I suspect are short staffed.
"They lose teacher to Wake themselves becuase Wake pays more money than Johnston."
I told you money creates competition, not interviews.
interviews are to get rid of the status quo Mildred hanging around and bidding on a job. That is only part of it.
More than you. At least I offered up ideas. One would have to admit education in this country needs changed. The same old same old isn't working.
You've offered whine. You want the best teachers? Pay them. It's that simple. Your interview process brings nothing to the table, nothing.
except it gets rid of the dinosaurs and hangers on that just get jobs based on seniority
Then stop whining. Your problem is you say teachers deserve more money, but still don't want them to have it.
Malarkey. Your problem is they make more money than the younger teachers. That's it in a nutshell for you and other conservatives.
Of course you don't. But as for the rest of the teachers, yep, paying them less would suit you fine.
Not true. One the state has to have it. Two, with more money comes more expectations and accountability. In West Virginia's case it is unreasonable not to think your healthcare is going up ever(when everybody with a health insurance plan took a hit). And, teachers up there said it was about their health care and not money anyway.
Yes, I have an issue with teachers walking off their job.
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