Lets see: Israel gets attacked. People have pro Palestinian rallies.

[riflearm2]

Proof? What's your evidence?

Mellman: Do Palestinians support Hamas? Polls paint a murky picture

It’s frankly not the central issue, but debate has swirled around whether Gazans, and Palestinians more broadly, support Hamas. Some American officials have clearly concluded that “Hamas doe…

thehill.com

Palestinian disillusionment with their choices is evident in a question asking which party, Fatah or Hamas, “is most deserving of representing the Palestinian people.” Forty three percent said neither, with 31 percent putting Hamas forward and 21 percent preferring Fatah.
And to further my point to both Herdman and you about this being far deeper than one attack and how every bombing of civilians from Israel breeds more contempt:

Many saw the attack, in which over 100 Israelis were abducted and taken as hostages into Gaza, as retribution for the deaths of Palestinian civilians in earlier rounds of conflict and in daily life. “The world keeps saying this attack is unprovoked, but in fact the world is ignoring how violent the daily occupation is,” says Diana Buttu, a former adviser to the Palestinian delegation to peace talks with Israel, now in abeyance.
It's important that you understand what the below shows:

As for legislative elections . . . Support for Fatah and Hamas was equal at 34%, while 10% would vote for other parties, and 21% said they are undecided.

Support for Hamas in the West Bank was found to have risen from 21% three months ago to 26%, while backing for Fatah remained at 38%.
What's the different between the two?

Hamas vs Fatah: Same goal, different approaches

Despite the differences between the two Palestinian parties, they have managed to reach a deal to end their divide.

www.aljazeera.com

HAMAS VS FATAH​

• Ideology:
  Hamas – Islamist
  Fatah – Secular
• Strategy towards Israel:
  Hamas – Armed resistance
  Fatah – Negotiations
• Objectives:
  Hamas – Does not recognise Israel, but accepts a Palestinian state on 1967 borders
  Fatah – Recognises Israel, wants to build a state on 1967 borders

 

[riflearm2]

The people of Gaza are poor because of their blind hatred of Jews. They cannot move themselves forward in society to have a working relationship let alone an economic one.

No. Stop. You're completely uneducated on this. Stop embarrassing yourself with these comments you have no clue about.

 

[riflearm2]

There are many more examples of this. One only has to open one's eyes, and mind, to understand this. You might try that sometime.

Who is denying that, moron? Sure, that stuff is taught at a high level. It doesn't mean that all or a huge majority, as is being claimed in this thread, want that. Hell, I just showed the results of multiple polls of Palestinians.

 

[KyMUfan]

Who is denying that, moron? Sure, that stuff is taught at a high level. It doesn't mean that all or a huge majority, as is being claimed in this thread, want that. Hell, I just showed the results of multiple polls of Palestinians.

Yeah and we all know how accurate polls are...

Follow the money fool. The US and others have labeled Hamas as a terrorist organization and have withheld funds. Meanwhile the US and others give millions per year to Fatah, including $ for elections. That money buys a lot of support.

The results of your multiple polls only show pluralities and not majorities. Here is a poll reflecting a majority:

Poll: 57.5% of Muslim Americans say Hamas at least ‘somewhat justified’ – JNS.org

The survey also found that 38.6% of Muslim Americans approve of Hamas leader Ismail Haniyeh.

www.jns.org

Think of that - almost 60% of Muslims in the US that were polled approved of a terrorist attack in which civilians (including children and babies) were murdered.

I'm sorry. I shouldn't have told you to think of that. That was unfair to you since you've proven time and time again that you can't...

Now answer my question that you seem to conveniently avoid. Why can't the Muslim countries in the Middle East resettle or accept refugees from Gaza?

Explained: Why Arab nations don't want to take in Palestinian refugees from Gaza

The US presidential hopeful Nikki Haley made a strong point when she asked the Islamic countries why they are not opening up their gates for Palestinian civilians from Gaza who want to flee their homes amid the ongoing war between Israel and Hamas.

www.wionews.com

"But the neighbours are not ready. Egyptian President Abdel Fattah el-Sissi recently said that the current war is also an "attempt to push the civilian inhabitants to... migrate to Egypt".

Jordan's King Abdullah II gave a similar message, as he said, "No refugees in Jordan, no refugees in Egypt.""

 

[i am herdman]

No. Stop. You're completely uneducated on this. Stop embarrassing yourself with these comments you have no clue about.

Israel was not in Gaza. Israel has at least a working relationship with Jordan and Egypt. They were normalizing with Saudi Arabia.

Who controls Gaza?

 

[i am herdman]

Hey rifle you mentioned all those jews against taking action in Gaza. How many of thise Jews are actually in Israel living? More like spoiled pampered Jews living in America and hanging out on college campuses who are virtue signaling morons. Idiots who don't realize Hamas would cut their heads off and rape their mothers until their insides fell out.

Morons is what they are. It is almost comical.

 

[extragreen]

Hey rifle you mentioned all those jews against taking action in Gaza. How many of thise Jews are actually in Israel living? More like spoiled pampered Jews living in America and hanging out on college campuses who are virtue signaling morons. Idiots who don't realize Hamas would cut their heads off and rape their mothers until their insides fell out.

Morons is what they are. It is almost comical.

Says the same guy who seems to have forgiven putins russians doing the same thing in ukraine.

 

[ThunderCat98]

From your own article - "Some American officials have clearly concluded that 'Hamas does not represent the Palestinian people.' Are they correct or not? Hamas’s savage butchery and Israel’s attack on Hamas may have altered the answer. We can’t know that, as current circumstances clearly preclude polling." (emphasis added).

So, you cite a source that starts from the premise that we can't actually gauge current sentiment because of situational variables. In your words - brilliant!

But let's continue. The article then goes on to reference a series of polls that show a back-and-forth in popularity between Hamas and Fatah, both of which, "run dictatorships that arrest and torture political opponents, a problem more severe in Gaza than on the West Bank."

The article further concludes from these polls (which it notes are all terribly unreliable) that if a presidential election were held, Hamas would win in a landslide.

The article continues:

"By 70 percent to 28 percent, Palestinians oppose a two-state solution — 'the establishment of a Palestinian state alongside Israel.'

An even larger number — 76 percent to 21 percent — oppose a 'one state solution …in which the two sides enjoy equal rights.'"

Let's think about that. First, it's important to note that this doesn't appear to be limited to just Palestinians in Gaza, as the article doesn't really clarify, so I'm not sure how valid it is to the discussion we're having. Anyways, if it were accurate, these polls show 70% oppose a 2-state solution and 76% oppose a 1-state solution. What's the only other alternative to either of these proposals? The death of every jew, "from the river to the sea."

Let's go on. The article then states:

"Given a choice among three options for 'ending the occupation and building an independent state,' 21 percent prefer 'negotiations,' 22 percent 'peaceful popular resistance' and 52 percent select 'armed conflict.'"

It goes on to say that, "58 percent majority support a 'return to the armed intifada [terrorism] and confrontations.'"

This ^^^ is what you're citing in support of your position?!?! So, to conclude, we know from your source that (1) 3/4 of those surveyed do not want Israel to exist in any form, and (2) well over 1/2 of those surveyed support continued terrorism. Well done [insert sarcastic slow clap gif here]. The article you cited supports my original position that an overwhelming majority of Gazans want Israel wiped off the face of the Earth. Hell, it even concludes that, "Peace seems to require some fundamental changes in public attitudes." Thanks for the assist and for obliterating your own bullshit, leftist narrative.

 

[WVUSerg]

Says the same guy who seems to have forgiven putins russians doing the same thing in ukraine.

Dude you seriously are mentally challenged. No one on this board have taken Russia's side in the Ukraine War. What everyone has been complaining about is all the money sent over to Ukraine. Look how much of it has been stolen by corrupt officials over there.

 

[raleighherdfan]

But the neighbours are not ready. Egyptian President Abdel Fattah el-Sissi recently said that the current war is also an "attempt to push the civilian inhabitants to... migrate to Egypt".

Jordan's King Abdullah II gave a similar message, as he said, "No refugees in Jordan, no refugees in Egypt.""

Muslims dont care about other Muslims until it comes to hating Jews and wanting them dead. Jordan and Egypt couldn't care less about the suffering of "Palestinians" as long as they stay out of their countries.

"By 70 percent to 28 percent, Palestinians oppose a two-state solution — 'the establishment of a Palestinian state alongside Israel.'

Israel has offered to give the Palestinians land/territory at least 3 times since the 1960s, in an effort to end conflict and war. Every time, it's been turned down. Why?? Because the hatred and desire to kill all Jews is more important than anything else.

 

[-CarlHungus-]

Yeah. I've watched video upon video of the attacks and kidnappings. Every single one of them show the same thing - the people in Gaza celebrating the rape, murder, and kidnapping of Israeli citizens - not soldiers or politicians - ordinary citizens. I'm certain there's a small percentage that hate Hamas, but the polls showing 50/50 splits are bullshit, or you'd see people starting to speak up and out. Again, they will have no better opportunity to rid themselves of Hamas. They won't though. Why? Because they are all Muslims living in the Middle East and nearly every single one believes all jews should be entirely wiped off the face of the Earth. That's a fact. I've heard it said before, but it bears repeating - if the Palastinians laid down their weapons, there could be a peaceful resolution, but if Israel were to lay down theirs, there would be no more living jews in the Middle East.

It's very hard to know how much support they have. Is it a lot? Yes, undoubtedly.

But you can't "speak up" or you'll be killed. You can't flee because of what has been said here before - no one wants them. Not Egypt, Not Jordan...no one. Where can they flee in war? No where.

It's a small sliver, but there are Christians in Palestine - Justin Amash's family was killed in an orthodox church in the current bombings.

We probably agree on 99% of this conflict...but second and third order effects of Dresden-style bombings of Gaza is going to cause bigger issues at this point. There are two billion muslims around the world. They may very well have major power in a country like France in one more generation (demography is destiny)...they're not going away. It did seem like under Trump we had some calm over there, especially with increasingly good relations between Saudi's/UAE and Israel.

Israel was not in Gaza. They had pulled out of Gaza. Gaza was controlled by the people there. The people have a blind hatred of Jews and Israel. The US and others send aid to Gaza and much of it ends up in the hands of terrorist(Hamas). The people of Gaza are poor because of their blind hatred of Jews. They cannot move themselves forward in society to have a working relationship let alone an economic one. Israel built a wall to protect its border and people which obviosly failed and was breeched.

Gaza is not really controlled by "the people there." Israel has military control of their borders, limits what comes and goes in there, etc. Of course it's to protect Israel, but it's not like Gaza is some sovereign entity. It's a unique situation - I"m not a world history expert but off top of my head I can't think of any current other situation where 2 million people are living under military border control from an adjacent entity.

===

Unfortunately I don't see much hope or any solution. Nothing meaningful can come about as long as Hamas has the power - of course they won't agree to a two state solution because they don't believe Israel should exist. But to destroy Hamas you're basically wiping Gaza off the map and killing tens of thousands of innocents..."cost of war, right?" Well look at marches in the streets across the globe...that cost IMO is a different calculus than you had with dropping a nuke in Japan or decimating Dresden. Not to mention the thousands of innocent lives lost (even if the vast majority of population supports Hamas, there are children (lots of them) there).

I don't know a solution (I really haven't seen anyone out there with a good one)...and maybe I'm weak-kneed, but the ongoing bombings I don't think are looking like they're going to help anything. As I understand it, in years past we were seemingly very close to a two state solution. Doesn't seem that way now.

 

[raleighherdfan]

As I understand it, in years past we were seemingly very close to a two state solution.

Only from the Jewish side. The effort was rejected every time by Palestinian leaders.

Not to mention the thousands of innocent lives lost

When you speak of "innocents" are you referring to the children who are taught to hate and kill Jews from birth??

 

[-CarlHungus-]

Only from the Jewish side. The effort was rejected every time by Palestinian leaders.

When you speak of "innocents" are you referring to the children who are taught to hate and kill Jews from birth??

Yes - they're still children.

 

[-CarlHungus-]

As I understand it, in years past we were seemingly very close to a two state solution.

Only from the Jewish side. The effort was rejected every time by Palestinian leaders.
===


that's my understanding as well.

 

[-CarlHungus-]

If anyone is inclined there is multi part long form podcast on the history of hte conflict. I think released around 2017. It's like 6-8 hours though but I think it's very good. I had listened to its release a few years ago but still stands up.

Fear & Loathing in the New Jerusalem, pt. 1 — Martyr Made Podcast

The conflict between Israel and Palestine can often seem like a permanent feature of the global order.

martyrmade.com

"
The conflict between Israel and Palestine can often seem like a permanent feature of the global order. The wars, intifadas, refugees camps, suicide vests, UN resolutions, and peace talks have been painfully burned into our collective consciousness. But how could this have happened? Was it always this way? That’s what we’ll seek to find out in this three-part series on the history of the Israeli-Palestinian conflict.

In Episode #1, nations are rallying to throw off the yoke of the Great Powers, and demanding the sovereign right to rule their homelands. A group calling themselves Zionists puts out a call to awaken the oppressed Jews of Europe from their thousand-year slumber. The time had come, after two thousand years of homeless wandering, to return to Palestine, the land longed for in so many psalms and lamentations. But there was a problem. While the Jews were in exile, another people had moved into the land, and they had been living there for 1300 years.

Click here to listen on iTunes"

 

[ThunderCat98]

But you can't "speak up" or you'll be killed.

This seems to be the proverbial "Catch 22." It's also the ultimate cop-out. The problem is if the people of Gaza actually want change they are going to have to demand it for themselves and be willing to sacrifice their lives to achieve it (see the American revolution). If they aren't willing to fight for their freedom, they are doomed to live under tyrannical rule. I don't think it's wrong in this case to question how much they really want change. Like I said, there will never be another opportunity like this. If they are too afraid to see the opening they have, then I don't think there's anything we can do to help them. As America has proved time and time again in foreign conflicts, you can't force freedom and democracy on a people. They have to want change. I'm not at all convinced they do.

 

[-CarlHungus-]

This seems to be the proverbial "Catch 22." It's also the ultimate cop-out. The problem is if the people of Gaza actually want change they are going to have to demand it for themselves and be willing to sacrifice their lives to achieve it (see the American revolution). If they aren't willing to fight for their freedom, they are doomed to live under tyrannical rule. I don't think it's wrong in this case to question how much they really want change. Like I said, there will never be another opportunity like this. If they are too afraid to see the opening they have, then I don't think there's anything we can do to help them. As America has proved time and time again in foreign conflicts, you can't force freedom and democracy on a people. They have to want change. I'm not at all convinced they do.

Yes, peace will happen from bottom up (not top down). Completely agree there.

Somehow have to find a way for economic prosperity and hope in that area.

I have no clue how.

 

[KyMUfan]

Israel has military control of their borders, limits what comes and goes in there, etc.

I agree with virtually everything you posted. The demographics of Gaza are 65% of the population is under 25. Of those that survive their memories, hate and anger will likely carry with them the remainder of their lives. An Islam is growing both organically and by converts (forced or voluntary).

However Gaza does share a border with Egypt. Egypt controls access from that point so that part isn't all on Israel. I think that is important to note and just confirms that neither side really wants them.

 

[raleighherdfan]

Somehow have to find a way for economic prosperity and hope in that area.

I have no clue how

1st the Palestinian people need to turn on Hamas and remove them from power (highly unlikely because they want the same thing...Dead Jews)

2nd, actually decide to work towards a prosperous existence. Also highly unlikely because their number 1 goal is wipe a group of people off the face of the earth. As long as that remains, you're dealing with a group of "animals" with a tribalistic mentality.

 

[extragreen]

Dude you seriously are mentally challenged. No one on this board have taken Russia's side in the Ukraine War. What everyone has been complaining about is all the money sent over to Ukraine. Look how much of it has been stolen by corrupt officials over there.

You're a lying God hating trumptard and oath breaker. You definitely have sided with putin because you and your fellow contards have suggested ukraine give up part of their country to russia in order to sign a treaty. In the meantime, I don't recall any of you suggesting we NOT send aid to israel while expecting us to believe that israel has no corruption in their government.

 

[extragreen]

As America has proved time and time again in foreign conflicts, you can't force freedom and democracy on a people. They have to want change. I'm not at all convinced they do.

That argument seems somewhat familiar regarding Afghanistan and conservatives altogether oblivious to it.

 

[-CarlHungus-]

1st the Palestinian people need to turn on Hamas and remove them from power (highly unlikely because they want the same thing...Dead Jews)

2nd, actually decide to work towards a prosperous existence. Also highly unlikely because their number 1 goal is wipe a group of people off the face of the earth. As long as that remains, you're dealing with a group of "animals" with a tribalistic mentality.

I don't know if more ?pressure? on Qatar or other more US-friendly countries to hand over Hamas leaders and/or call for them giving up their hostages would help?

I don't know. I'm out of my element here.

Just wiping out all of Gaza just doesn't seem like a great plan.

 

[extragreen]

Just wiping out all of Gaza just doesn't seem like a great plan.

You're dealing with people who have swallowed the false Biblical doctrine that somehow the middle east nation of Israel is more important to God than other nations.

 

[WVUSerg]

You're a lying God hating trumptard and oath breaker. You definitely have sided with putin because you and your fellow contards have suggested ukraine give up part of their country to russia in order to sign a treaty. In the meantime, I don't recall any of you suggesting we NOT send aid to israel while expecting us to believe that israel has no corruption in their government.

Glad you brought that up from the time Isreal was formed as a country until today the US has sent $130 billion in aid. Since the start of the war in Ukrain we have sent $75 billion.

We can actually see proof that the aid we send Israel is actually going somewhere to help, like the Iron Dome. In ukraine we don't know where the money is going and we know that corrupt politicians over there are stealing it.

I have said it before that until we get our house straight we should be sending money that we don't have to any country.

 

[WV-FAN]

You're dealing with people who have swallowed the false Biblical doctrine that somehow the middle east nation of Israel is more important to God than other nations.

do tell more about this false biblical doctrine and prove that the Jews are not His chosen people.

“You are a people holy to the Lord your God. The Lord your God has chosen you out of all the peoples on the face of the earth to be his people, his treasured possession”

 

[extragreen]

Glad you brought that up from the time Isreal was formed as a country until today the US has sent $130 billion in aid. Since the start of the war in Ukrain we have sent $75 billion.

Adjusted for inflation = $317.9 billion

We can actually see proof that the aid we send Israel is actually going somewhere to help, like the Iron Dome. In ukraine we don't know where the money is going and we know that corrupt politicians over there are stealing it.

I can't find where the U.S. gave financial aid to ukraine previous to 2014. Israel has had over 70 years to utilize their aid.

I have said it before that until we get our house straight we should be sending money that we don't have to any country.

And I said we could start with Israel. You didn't seem to like that idea. And how about we stop aid to Taiwan as the number 2 cancellation?

 

[raleighherdfan]

You're dealing with people who have swallowed the false Biblical doctrine that somehow the middle east nation of Israel is more important to God than other nations.

Ahh yes. More antisemitic rhetoric. Good job bigot.

I don't know if more ?pressure? on Qatar or other more US-friendly countries to hand over Hamas leaders and/or call for them giving up their hostages would help

I just dont think you're ever able to negotiate with those that believe the only acceptable outcome to an entire group of people (Jews), from a religious zealotry standpoint, is death/eradication. It's a pillar to the Muslim "faith".

 

[SamSwimmer]

I don't know if more ?pressure? on Qatar or other more US-friendly countries to hand over Hamas leaders and/or call for them giving up their hostages would help?

I don't know. I'm out of my element here.

Just wiping out all of Gaza just doesn't seem like a great plan.

Would Israel benefit if they stopped at this point? I'm not advocating either way but within the region, does restraint invite further attacks from Hamas &/or different entities?

 

[extragreen]

do tell more about this false biblical doctrine and prove that the Jews are not His chosen people.

“You are a people holy to the Lord your God. The Lord your God has chosen you out of all the peoples on the face of the earth to be his people, his treasured possession”

^^^See what I mean. A prime example of swallowing the false doctrine that the middle east nation of Israel is considered more loved or more important than other nations.

Romans 10: 12 For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him.

Galatians 3:28
There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.

Colossians 3:11
Where there is neither Greek nor Jew, circumcision nor uncircumcision, Barbarian, Scythian, bond nor free: but Christ is all, and in all.

 

[extragreen]

Ahh yes. More antisemitic rhetoric. Good job bigot.

Nope. Just your continued ignorance of the Bible.

 

[WV-FAN]

^^^See what I mean. A prime example of swallowing the false doctrine that the middle east nation of Israel is considered more loved or more important than other nations.

Romans 10: 12 For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him.

Galatians 3:28
There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.

Colossians 3:11
Where there is neither Greek nor Jew, circumcision nor uncircumcision, Barbarian, Scythian, bond nor free: but Christ is all, and in all.

so God lied and proclaimed false doctrine when he made the claim that the jews were his chosen people? those were His words, nobody else's.

it seems as if there's quite a bit of double speak in the bible.

 

[raleighherdfan]

Nope. Just your continued ignorance of the Bible.

Where does your support of the Koran come into the picture?

 

[i am herdman]

Muslims dont care about other Muslims until it comes to hating Jews and wanting them dead. Jordan and Egypt couldn't care less about the suffering of "Palestinians" as long as they stay out of their countries.

Israel has offered to give the Palestinians land/territory at least 3 times since the 1960s, in an effort to end conflict and war. Every time, it's been turned down. Why?? Because the hatred and desire to kill all Jews is more important than anything else.

That is what I was telling rifle. Their blind hatred of Jews holds them back. Why wouldn't Israel want peace and trading parnters? They were working on deals with the Saudi's. They have cut deal with the Jordanians and Eypytians.

From the river to the sea means something. It means kill all Jews and destroy Israel. They would rather live like Cavemen with AK47's than accept Israel as a nation and move on to the modern world.

 

[i am herdman]

Says the same guy who seems to have forgiven putins russians doing the same thing in ukraine.

Liar. Simply a false statement. I have questioned us funneling money over there at will.

 

[i am herdman]

It's very hard to know how much support they have. Is it a lot? Yes, undoubtedly.

But you can't "speak up" or you'll be killed. You can't flee because of what has been said here before - no one wants them. Not Egypt, Not Jordan...no one. Where can they flee in war? No where.

It's a small sliver, but there are Christians in Palestine - Justin Amash's family was killed in an orthodox church in the current bombings.

We probably agree on 99% of this conflict...but second and third order effects of Dresden-style bombings of Gaza is going to cause bigger issues at this point. There are two billion muslims around the world. They may very well have major power in a country like France in one more generation (demography is destiny)...they're not going away. It did seem like under Trump we had some calm over there, especially with increasingly good relations between Saudi's/UAE and Israel.



Gaza is not really controlled by "the people there." Israel has military control of their borders, limits what comes and goes in there, etc. Of course it's to protect Israel, but it's not like Gaza is some sovereign entity. It's a unique situation - I"m not a world history expert but off top of my head I can't think of any current other situation where 2 million people are living under military border control from an adjacent entity.

===

Unfortunately I don't see much hope or any solution. Nothing meaningful can come about as long as Hamas has the power - of course they won't agree to a two state solution because they don't believe Israel should exist. But to destroy Hamas you're basically wiping Gaza off the map and killing tens of thousands of innocents..."cost of war, right?" Well look at marches in the streets across the globe...that cost IMO is a different calculus than you had with dropping a nuke in Japan or decimating Dresden. Not to mention the thousands of innocent lives lost (even if the vast majority of population supports Hamas, there are children (lots of them) there).

I don't know a solution (I really haven't seen anyone out there with a good one)...and maybe I'm weak-kneed, but the ongoing bombings I don't think are looking like they're going to help anything. As I understand it, in years past we were seemingly very close to a two state solution. Doesn't seem that way now.

There will be peace when one side wins. Frankly, that is it.

I don't know what people excpected Israel to do. The attack was their 9-11.

 

[i am herdman]

That argument seems somewhat familiar regarding Afghanistan and conservatives altogether oblivious to it.

Forgets than Democrats had a President reside over it for 8 years and Democrats controlled Congress how many of those years? So, it is not just a conservative issue, moron.

Guess what? Intel is showing that Afghanistan is back to Sept 10 levels or worse in some cases. Al Qeada is larger and more powerful that was in 2001. So, yehh DC we have a problem. Like a big problem brewing.

 

[raleighherdfan]

Why wouldn't Israel want peace and trading parnters? They were working on deals with the Saudi's. They have cut deal with the Jordanians and Eypytians.

Israel was allowing some Palestinians to come into Israel and work with the right documentation. Of course, they would rather get along with their neighbors. Unfortunately, their neighbors overwhelmingly prefer them to be dead. This isn't even debatable at this point.

 

[i am herdman]

Israel was allowing some Palestinians to come into Israel and work with the right documentation. Of course, they would rather get along with their neighbors. Unfortunately, their neighbors overwhelmingly prefer them to be dead. This isn't even debatable at this point.

Correct. That is why I understand what Israel has to do what they have to do. We had to do it in WW2 with Japan and Germany. War is terrible. But, there is a time for it. This is one of those times.

 

[extragreen]

so God lied and proclaimed false doctrine when he made the claim that the jews were his chosen people? those were His words, nobody else's.

That's under the old law. We are not under the old law now. The old testament and it's teachings and promises have been fulfilled in their entirety.

it seems as if there's quite a bit of double speak in the bible.

No, you're just ignorant of it's teachings.

 

[extragreen]

Liar. Simply a false statement. I have questioned us funneling money over there at will.

You're a liar. You have suggested ukraine give up some of their land in order to appease putin after putins military have "cut their heads off and rape their mothers".