Men’s Basketball

[Herdguy04]

That’s interesting an article I read today said her base salary was 400K. But I would definitely think the lex herald would know what they are talking about. Thanks for sharing!


But even with that I still think it’s not earth shattering money to go into a program where you will be very low on the pile vs men’s basketball and you can easily get fired. The current coach signed an extension in 2022. They owe her well over 2 million dollars.

I just think if Kim continues to do what she’s doing and turns Marshall into a mid major power she will get a life changing contract from a school where she could win a national championship.

Your last sentence cancelled out your entire argument.

Bruh, you really acting like $800K just grows on your backyard tree?
Ask anyone here if they'd like $800K a year...highly doubt they'd reject it.

It's Lexington, KY, not Beverly Hills, CA.

I can't speak for the history of UK women's basketball. It certainly isn't in the same universe as UConn or the Lady Vols but you did answer your own question.
They fired and paid out, their former HC for $2 million.
They have tons of money to just toss around, which means they can give Kim pretty much anything she'd need. Seeing how she won here, where nobody knew she was even doing well until late in the season, you think they'd deny her requests? Her resume is well worth the risk to them...again, where $800K actually does grow on backyard trees.
You're also talking UK, who would be very, very supportive of her if it meant bragging rights to the mens and women's sport that identifies their school.

Finally, how long do you have to coach at the mid major level to be considered a "power"?? Gonzaga had to go several years to gain that label. Same with others. MU and Boise State football went a decade. It's doubtful Kim stays long enough for MU to be considered one.

 

[Herdguy04]

HUGGINS hates Marshall with a passion!! He's such slime that one could easily see where he would deliberately "tank" if he was given the Head Job in HERD Men's basketball!

You do realize he interviewed for the Marshall job once before, right?
He wanted to be here at one point but wvu hired him.

Why would any coach potentially ruin their reputation further by intentionally tanking a school, regardless if it's a rival or not?

If anything, he'd want to make MU a winner to show he could do it once more.

For you to have said such blatant foolisness like you actually believe it, should disqualify you from participating in this thread any further.

 

[Herdguy04]

I honestly don’t care if Dan stays or not. The reason has nothing to do with whether he should come back or not. He shouldn’t, (should have been fired years ago) but it’s just the fact that we don’t put an effort into men’s basketball. If Dan doesn’t come back we won’t try to hire Greg Marshall or John Brannen or The guy from Morehead State or even Huggins.

We will hire some non excitable hire that nobody will give a crap about and we will be ready to fire after 3 to 4 mediocre seasons. So honestly who cares if Dan comes back or not. It’s not like anything will change.

It's not that MU doesn't put an effort into mens basketball.

It's that MU doesn't have enough financial resources to make changes when everyone thinks they should.

Is your paycheck going to cover Dan's buyout? Didn't think so.
Was anyone actively raising money to buy out Dan's contract? No.

Oh. Right, you expect the "stepping stone" school to do it for you.

You know, the one who DOESN'T have the finances to be a Power program, who's fans post another boring article about what the billionaires are doing and sigh saying, "woe is me."

With the enthusiasm of a blonde on a leather sofa, MU embraced their role of being used by someone to further their own careers rather than being able to actively pluck someone they'd want.
Yeah, that school.

It's a financial game of musical chairs, where one program (or a few), get the money and spotlight, others don't.
MU can't control who that is, and sometimes it appears very lopsided.

The very thing you claim would show you MU cared (fire Dan now, buyout the contract, toss the bank at someone high profile), is the very thing you're accepting that MU cannot do with "stepping stone" status.

It actually wouldn't shock me if Dan wasn't fired now, for sure, because any money saved from not firing him, would go towards Kim's possible contract raise.

 

[TwolfHerdfan]

It's not that MU doesn't put an effort into mens basketball.

It's that MU doesn't have enough financial resources to make changes when everyone thinks they should.

Is your paycheck going to cover Dan's buyout? Didn't think so.
Was anyone actively raising money to buy out Dan's contract? No.

Oh. Right, you expect the "stepping stone" school to do it for you.

You know, the one who DOESN'T have the finances to be a Power program, who's fans post another boring article about what the billionaires are doing and sigh saying, "woe is me."

With the enthusiasm of a blonde on a leather sofa, MU embraced their role of being used by someone to further their own careers rather than being able to actively pluck someone they'd want.
Yeah, that school.

It's a financial game of musical chairs, where one program (or a few), get the money and spotlight, others don't.
MU can't control who that is, and sometimes it appears very lopsided.

The very thing you claim would show you MU cared (fire Dan now, buyout the contract, toss the bank at someone high profile), is the very thing you're accepting that MU cannot do with "stepping stone" status.

It actually wouldn't shock me if Dan wasn't fired now, for sure, because any money saved from not firing him, would go towards Kim's possible contract raise.

What would you do to improve the mens program? What steps would you take?

 

[KyMUfan]

Swish Decision: The Case for Bob Huggins as the Next Louisville Cardinals Coach

The University of Louisville Cardinals are on the lookout for their next head basketball coach, and amidst the speculation and discussions, one name stands out prominently: Bob Huggins. With an illustrious coaching career spanning over four decades, Huggins brings a wealth of experience...

www.chillsports.net

 

[TwolfHerdfan]

Swish Decision: The Case for Bob Huggins as the Next Louisville Cardinals Coach

The University of Louisville Cardinals are on the lookout for their next head basketball coach, and amidst the speculation and discussions, one name stands out prominently: Bob Huggins. With an illustrious coaching career spanning over four decades, Huggins brings a wealth of experience...

www.chillsports.net

UL and Higgs are a match made in heaven.

 

[RhinoD]

It's not that MU doesn't put an effort into mens basketball.

It's that MU doesn't have enough financial resources to make changes when everyone thinks they should.

Is your paycheck going to cover Dan's buyout? Didn't think so.
Was anyone actively raising money to buy out Dan's contract? No.

Oh. Right, you expect the "stepping stone" school to do it for you.

You know, the one who DOESN'T have the finances to be a Power program, who's fans post another boring article about what the billionaires are doing and sigh saying, "woe is me."

With the enthusiasm of a blonde on a leather sofa, MU embraced their role of being used by someone to further their own careers rather than being able to actively pluck someone they'd want.
Yeah, that school.

It's a financial game of musical chairs, where one program (or a few), get the money and spotlight, others don't.
MU can't control who that is, and sometimes it appears very lopsided.

The very thing you claim would show you MU cared (fire Dan now, buyout the contract, toss the bank at someone high profile), is the very thing you're accepting that MU cannot do with "stepping stone" status.

It actually wouldn't shock me if Dan wasn't fired now, for sure, because any money saved from not firing him, would go towards Kim's possible contract raise.

Marshall basketball is a product... Right now that product is Dollar Tree level quality and thus brings in revenue equivalent to its product quality.

In business, when you have a product that is struggling, you either -- A. Eliminate the product and cut your losses (we can't do that). -- B. Invest in the product, improve it, and hope to thus improve your bottom line.

In college basketball, the number one way to hopefully improve your product is to make a coaching change. That's why dozens of teams do it every year. Does it always lead to a better product and thus better results and more revenue? - No... Is it the best option available - Absolutely.

The difference in MU's current situation, is our CEO and board of directors appear to be just fine with Dollar Tree level quality and are thus unmotivated to make a change. Even though the production manager is 77 years old, he's unwilling to retire, and is also perfectly happy churning out Dollar Tree level products and collecting a paycheck.

We as consumers, need to stop spending our money on said Dollar Tree level basketball until product quality improves.

 

[TwolfHerdfan]

It's not that MU doesn't put an effort into mens basketball.

It's that MU doesn't have enough financial resources to make changes when everyone thinks they should.

Is your paycheck going to cover Dan's buyout? Didn't think so.
Was anyone actively raising money to buy out Dan's contract? No.

Oh. Right, you expect the "stepping stone" school to do it for you.

You know, the one who DOESN'T have the finances to be a Power program, who's fans post another boring article about what the billionaires are doing and sigh saying, "woe is me."

With the enthusiasm of a blonde on a leather sofa, MU embraced their role of being used by someone to further their own careers rather than being able to actively pluck someone they'd want.
Yeah, that school.

It's a financial game of musical chairs, where one program (or a few), get the money and spotlight, others don't.
MU can't control who that is, and sometimes it appears very lopsided.

The very thing you claim would show you MU cared (fire Dan now, buyout the contract, toss the bank at someone high profile), is the very thing you're accepting that MU cannot do with "stepping stone" status.

It actually wouldn't shock me if Dan wasn't fired now, for sure, because any money saved from not firing him, would go towards Kim's possible contract raise.

MU puts effort into the program, arena upgrades, new scoreboard, etc. New practice facility, all are well above our conference mates except JMU, ODU. The HC doesn't put effort in, that's the issue and everyone sees it.
As to financial, it happens that one of the two largest donors to the program happens to be the HC's brother. A millionaire career b'ball coach whose donated millions to the program. Finances are not an issue.

 

[The Real SamC]

The woe is us, we are just little ole Marshall and shouldn't expect to actually win crap again.

Reality?

- Are we going to beat UK or Duke or whatever and be in the Top 25? No, but no one is asking for that. People just want a competent basketball coach and thus a quality team.

- This is the SUN BELT!!! It is a garbage basketball conference. Many of these schools have no interest, no history, no effort in men's basketball.

- We have a solid basketball history. We have been competitive at the "mid-major" or "one big league" level. We draw fans. We have facilities. We just need a coach.

With the level of effort that many further south Sun Belt teams put out, a BAD YEAR for us should be 4th.

Louisville, and WVU, have openings, because they have leaders. Leaders who fired the loser coach the day after the conference tournament elimination. We have CS and DD is back. If CS were going to fire him, he would have already.

 

[19MU88]

You do realize he interviewed for the Marshall job once before, right?

He never interviewed here. Does everyone here just make things up?

Some of his Charleston attorney buddies tried to work behind the scenes to get him at MU when NO ONE would hire him (post UC and pre KState). We had Jirsa shit show at time. Kayo Marcum publicly stated "we have a coach" when those rumors and behind seems actions were out.

That was around the time those studs were coming out of Huntington (walker, Mayo, Patterson and early). I'm not sure how bad he wanted to be here but he wanted a job anywhere.

 

[Tonycried2]

Your last sentence cancelled out your entire argument.

Bruh, you really acting like $800K just grows on your backyard tree?
Ask anyone here if they'd like $800K a year...highly doubt they'd reject it.

It's Lexington, KY, not Beverly Hills, CA.

I can't speak for the history of UK women's basketball. It certainly isn't in the same universe as UConn or the Lady Vols but you did answer your own question.
They fired and paid out, their former HC for $2 million.
They have tons of money to just toss around, which means they can give Kim pretty much anything she'd need. Seeing how she won here, where nobody knew she was even doing well until late in the season, you think they'd deny her requests? Her resume is well worth the risk to them...again, where $800K actually does grow on backyard trees.
You're also talking UK, who would be very, very supportive of her if it meant bragging rights to the mens and women's sport that identifies their school.

Finally, how long do you have to coach at the mid major level to be considered a "power"?? Gonzaga had to go several years to gain that label. Same with others. MU and Boise State football went a decade. It's doubtful Kim stays long enough for MU to be considered one.

UK....where drunken sailors go to learn the art of just blowing money!

 

[Herdguy04]

He never interviewed here. Does everyone here just make things up?

Some of his Charleston attorney buddies tried to work behind the scenes to get him at MU when NO ONE would hire him (post UC and pre KState). We had Jirsa shit show at time. Kayo Marcum publicly stated "we have a coach" when those rumors and behind seems actions were out.

That was around the time those studs were coming out of Huntington (walker, Mayo, Patterson and early). I'm not sure how bad he wanted to be here but he wanted a job anywhere.

He was in Huntington for it. If it was his lawyer friends or not.

He would have used MU as a stepping stone and had been a little more respectful however.

 

[Herdguy04]

The woe is us, we are just little ole Marshall and shouldn't expect to actually win crap again.

Reality?

- Are we going to beat UK or Duke or whatever and be in the Top 25? No, but no one is asking for that. People just want a competent basketball coach and thus a quality team.

- This is the SUN BELT!!! It is a garbage basketball conference. Many of these schools have no interest, no history, no effort in men's basketball.

- We have a solid basketball history. We have been competitive at the "mid-major" or "one big league" level. We draw fans. We have facilities. We just need a coach.

With the level of effort that many further south Sun Belt teams put out, a BAD YEAR for us should be 4th.

Louisville, and WVU, have openings, because they have leaders. Leaders who fired the loser coach the day after the conference tournament elimination. We have CS and DD is back. If CS were going to fire him, he would have already.

Guess Sam isn't for MU sports.

Just said how good the wvu leadership is.

 

[Herdguy04]

What would you do to improve the mens program? What steps would you take?

What I have said forever and for any hiring process:
Find a HC, not an assistant from a Power program, most likely from a lower level, and have them move up.

Also, someone who actually understands the process of the transfer portal and NIL, they'd have to work with the MU AD to function the best.

The list goes on.

 

[herdtown]

Not to hijack this thread but I listened to UL press conference with AD Josh Heird. Kenny Payne buyout is 8 million. They want to have minimum of 4 million NIL and a coach with good portal experience. No old guys who cannot give max effort for 5 to 10 years. I know Marshall financially is on a smaller scale than Louisville but we should ssek a coach who has similar attributes. If we do not make a coaching change then we are not committed to building a championship competitive program.

 

[Herdguy04]

Marshall basketball is a product... Right now that product is Dollar Tree level quality and thus brings in revenue equivalent to its product quality.

In business, when you have a product that is struggling, you either -- A. Eliminate the product and cut your losses (we can't do that). -- B. Invest in the product, improve it, and hope to thus improve your bottom line.

In college basketball, the number one way to hopefully improve your product is to make a coaching change. That's why dozens of teams do it every year. Does it always lead to a better product and thus better results and more revenue? - No... Is it the best option available - Absolutely.

The difference in MU's current situation, is our CEO and board of directors appear to be just fine with Dollar Tree level quality and are thus unmotivated to make a change. Even though the production manager is 77 years old, he's unwilling to retire, and is also perfectly happy churning out Dollar Tree level products and collecting a paycheck.

We as consumers, need to stop spending our money on said Dollar Tree level basketball until product quality improves.

So, how is one to improve their investment in something if they have no money to do so, since the people stopped giving money to it?

 

[RhinoD]

So, how is one to improve their investment in something if they have no money to do so, since the people stopped giving money to it?

People haven't stopped giving money to it... Not yet anyway... Which is exactly why right now is the time to make a change. While we still have decent attendance and people who are willing to put up with our shitty product.

No matter who the coach is next year, we are going to suck (look at our roster, good lord we have nothing on paper). So fire DD and sell the consumers on the fact that our product is going to improve over time.

I don't wait until my company goes in the red to make changes. I make them proactively, to ensure we dont go in the red, and hopefully do a little better this year than years prior.

The MU administration, and BOG, is going to force our hands as consumers. Stop buying tickets, stop buying concessions, stop watching on TV. If we want a better product, we are going to have to demand it.

 

[Chris McLaughlin]

 

[Tonycried2]

View embedded media

I fear that Sam is correct...doesn't matter what us piss ants think!

 

[Herdguy04]

I fear that Sam is correct...doesn't matter what us piss ants think!

Unless you're a mega donor, it won't.

 

[W-S HerdFan]

Unless you're a mega donor, it won't.

So, please inform us as to how the mega donors will react?

 

[Herdguy04]

People haven't stopped giving money to it... Not yet anyway... Which is exactly why right now is the time to make a change. While we still have decent attendance and people who are willing to put up with our shitty product.

No matter who the coach is next year, we are going to suck (look at our roster, good lord we have nothing on paper). So fire DD and sell the consumers on the fact that our product is going to improve over time.

I don't wait until my company goes in the red to make changes. I make them proactively, to ensure we dont go in the red, and hopefully do a little better this year than years prior.

The MU administration, and BOG, is going to force our hands as consumers. Stop buying tickets, stop buying concessions, stop watching on TV. If we want a better product, we are going to have to demand it.

The fans aren't coordinated enough to do that. They could instead, pool their money and pay for a coach buyout. Then assist in raising money for a new coach if they really want the change.

Problem is, no matter who Spears hires, the fans won't get over that he kept DD on as long as he did, and will lose confidence in whatever decision is made.
Literally said in this thread or another involving basketball, that no matter what the AD does, the hire isn't going to excite anyone.

Then again, anyone wanna guess who hired Kim Caldwell?

 

[Herdguy04]

So, please inform us as to how the mega donors will react?

Probably like they do for anything else...toss money at it till it works.

 

[19MU88]

He was in Huntington for it. If it was his lawyer friends or not.

He would have used MU as a stepping stone and had been a little more respectful however.

HE DID NOT INTERVIEW AND WE DID NOT HAVE JOB OPENING.

Read it slowly.

 

[RhinoD]

The fans aren't coordinated enough to do that. They could instead, pool their money and pay for a coach buyout. Then assist in raising money for a new coach if they really want the change.

Problem is, no matter who Spears hires, the fans won't get over that he kept DD on as long as he did, and will lose confidence in whatever decision is made.
Literally said in this thread or another involving basketball, that no matter what the AD does, the hire isn't going to excite anyone.

Then again, anyone wanna guess who hired Kim Caldwell?

You must be young... The fans did this very thing to get rid of Mark Snyder.

People stopped going to football games, stopped donating, stopped watching on TV, etc... It forced the administration to make a change (despite that we actually went 6-6 his last season)... It's easy, and it works. Put your wallet away and demand a better product.

 

[W-S HerdFan]

Yeah. The 04 refers to birth year..

 

[usaHERD]

I remember when Herd basketball was big time. Now we are bottom feeders due to a coach that has let the game pass him by. Lazy recruiter and will always fall back on losing players and NIL. Do what Kentucky does recruit players and become a feeder system to the NIL and major programs.

 

[MU PIKE]

If your wanting to bring in Huggins, hell, hire rich rod while your at it.

 

[RhinoD]

I remember when Herd basketball was big time. Now we are bottom feeders due to a coach that has let the game pass him by. Lazy recruiter and will always fall back on losing players and NIL. Do what Kentucky does recruit players and become a feeder system to the NIL and major programs.

"Winners make things happen, losers make excuses for why things didn't happen." - Lou Holtz

This is a great point and another huge problem with our current program (and most mid-majors)... There are now built in excuses for why you are losing, and DD uses them all... NIL, transfer portal, recruiting disadvantages, etc.

 

[raleighherdfan]

Why do some Marshall fans always want WVU retreads for coaches????

 

[W-S HerdFan]

….you could really see the difference when DD relieved Corny of running the practices!

 

[Herdguy04]

You must be young... The fans did this very thing to get rid of Mark Snyder.

People stopped going to football games, stopped donating, stopped watching on TV, etc... It forced the administration to make a change (despite that we actually went 6-6 his last season)... It's easy, and it works. Put your wallet away and demand a better product.

So they DIDN'T pay to get rid of Snyder, they did the opposite.
Could've been let go earlier.

 

[Herdguy04]

HE DID NOT INTERVIEW AND WE DID NOT HAVE JOB OPENING.

Read it slowly.

Yes we did.

 

[Herdguy04]

Yeah. The 04 refers to birth year..

If only your inaccuracy actually was worth something...

Anyone born in 2004 would not be on here.

 

[Herdguy04]

I remember when Herd basketball was big time. Now we are bottom feeders due to a coach that has let the game pass him by. Lazy recruiter and will always fall back on losing players and NIL. Do what Kentucky does recruit players and become a feeder system to the NIL and major programs.

UK is already a "major program" so I don't know how much more they could be.

Unless you're saying to be a feeder program to UK. In which case, I am all for it.

Let UK and MU work together to have MU serve as a farm system for UK to develop players and let them move up after a year or so.
UK helps MU recruit and say, "you're good, but spend 1 season at MU, transfer here, we'll still pay you in hookers and blow, and you'll be a star."

Oh, and Marshall basketball was never "big time."

It never made it past the first round of the NCAA tournament and made it, what, 6 times or something to the big dance ever?

The perception of the program of MU fans when compared to the national picture, are vastly different, obviously, but the contrast is staggeringly bad.

What DD did with Elmore et. al, should have been done 20 years ago and the benchmark for success.

 

[Herdguy04]

Why do some Marshall fans always want WVU retreads for coaches????

Because they mock wvu for taking in coaches with questionable pasts, talk about moral high ground (as though morality exists in college sports), see their successes, then say, "well, maybe we can look past their...past", then proclaim some useless BS about how winning is the key to everything.

It's a maelstrom of idiocy among a few on here.

 

[bbneutralfan]

….you could really see the difference when DD relieved Corny of running the practices!

?

 

[bbneutralfan]

My first experience watching Marshall basketball began in 1960. There have been many up and down seasons under many coaches. Marshall, while maybe never being “big time”, at least have had some really good teams and individual players. The program used to be built on solid high school players that would GIVE us four years. Then, at one point, we began to see an influx of JUCOs who only gave one or two years. Now we are relying on trying to lure transfers in who may stay for awhile. Since it is now obvious that DD will remain as our coach - and the diehards see no issue, I guess we need to either support whatever team takes the hardwood or stay home hoping that either the AD or President gets enough donor pressure put on them to make a change. JMO

 

[Herdguy04]

?

He's a fool, pay him no mind.

 

[Herdguy04]

My first experience watching Marshall basketball began in 1960. There have been many up and down seasons under many coaches. Marshall, while maybe never being “big time”, at least have had some really good teams and individual players. The program used to be built on solid high school players that would GIVE us four years. Then, at one point, we began to see an influx of JUCOs who only gave one or two years. Now we are relying on trying to lure transfers in who may stay for awhile. Since it is now obvious that DD will remain as our coach - and the diehards see no issue, I guess we need to either support whatever team takes the hardwood or stay home hoping that either the AD or President gets enough donor pressure put on them to make a change. JMO

It's woefully funny how people want Marshall to remain sort of traditional in how they run things, like MU could afford to do so, or had name brand value to do so. Neither is true.
But then they get antsy and are willing to let MU do what everyone else is doing, because they complain MU "is gonna be left behind."
When MU does, they get mad that MU is about money or doesn't care about their fans with what they are doing...forgetting that no school cares about it's fans or what they are doing since it has always been money driven.