Where Is Men's Basketball Non-conference Schedule?

[oldeherd]

What is it going to take to get the series with WV Who going again? Would they consider 2 for 1 in basketball?

Not for sure, but believe their stance, for both football and BB, is "play in Morgantown or not at all".

Believe Mike Hamrick's response to their stance is "stick it where the sun don't shine"!!

 

[oldeherd]

Charleston simply does not support Marshall - period! No need to play ANY games there in my opinion. The only people who would come to watch a game (WVU the exception) would be some MU alums in Charleston. Historically, we have never drawn well in Charleston. You youngins need to check back and see attendance at Herd games in Charleston. Hammy's annual "Paint Charleston Green" does not draw throngs of people!

Um, bb, believe if you check back when we played Cincy in Herrion's tenure at the CCC the game drew in the 4,000 range, maybe a little under. But check what we were drawing at HOME, "youngin"! A little over 4000, maybe even under. One big reason why he was CANNED, if you recall correctly. When team's performance and record went SOUTH, our attendance went with it. It didn't matter whether the games were in Huntington, Charleston, or Timbuktu - - -bad product repels, not attracts; its a basic FACT in entertainment, and college sports. Same could be said when we played Oregon in Charleston during Jirsa's abortive tenure; team was crap and so was our attendance. By all accounts, Ron was a nice guy but just not cut out to be a successful head coach. Attendance factors needed to looked at with many variables considered.

If Herd has another improving season and better record in basketball in 2017-18, and our average attendance is still at 6,000 or below, LESS THAN WHAT IT WAS IN DANNY'S LAST COUPLE OF PLAYING YEARS, hope you and others on here will properly assess the blame: NOT on people in Charleston, Putnam, and elsewhere in WV. It rests SOLELY on the shoulders of those folks in Huntington and a stone's throw away, cause according to most of you they are the ONLY TRUE HERD FANS!!!

 

[19MU88]

excellent post Olde. I know myself and numerous others that drive from the Kanawha Valley for home basketball games and hold season tickets....those great hometown fans wouldn't even drive 45 minutes one time a year to see Herd play wvu. easier to just watch on tv and they didn't have to see those scary wvu fans.

 

[Herdmeister]

Sorry, HM, but that is the narrow minded kind of thinking that characterizes too many in H-town. Attendance wasn't helped because too many in the Huntington area got their noses bent out of shape and were offended that MU dared to play a game in Charleston. Never mind that neither Oregon or Cincy were NOT going to play us in the Henderson Center. Hell, people even got on this site and others and spouted off why they would NEVER go to Charleston to watch the Herd play there!

And, again, MU needs to bolster its image and market and promote itself as a regional state U, and not just the "Huntington" school. MU is not in a large urban area like schools such as Cincinnati or Temple. It is in a small "city", in a depressed economic area and a city that continues a half century decline. It needs to promote and think of itself like Eastern Kentucky U does. Despite being just a stone's throw from Lexington and UK, EKU promotes itself as a regional state U throughout a 16 county area. And they, unlike MU, are growing, with an enrollment of over 16,000 and a budget of about 3 times that of MU.

And, HM, I'm sorry that it is so inconvenient and so "tough" on all you majority of Herd fans to ask you all to make a more than 5 or 10 minute across town trip to watch the Herd. Trying telling that to the thousands who journey to watch the Herd at the Joan from Charleston, Parkersburg, Putnam and Kanawha Counties, Beckley, Mercer County, Logan, Williamson, etc., etc. Isn't it just as "tough" on them? Or hundreds or more who do the same in the winter to come to the basketball games in the HC? But then again, yours is the same narrow, inbred, stuck in the past kind of thinking that permeates many in Huntington, plagues the city, and greatly contributes to Marshall's failure to fully realize its true potential.

I was once again thing about this. Believe me, I don't mind the trip to Charleston., Remember, I'm one who goes to many away games and the tournament every year. Back in the days of Huck's Herd, I lived in New Martinsville. That's 150 miles from Huntington. I had season tickets and didn't miss a game in 4 years. So please don't lecture me about travel to games. All I'm saying is that when we have played Oregon and Cincinnati in Charleston, we had terrible crowds. In fact when we have played wvu our attendance has been poor.

 

[PullmanFinger]

Primarily because ticket prices were BullSh*t

 

[Herdmeister]

I was once again thing about this. Believe me, I don't mind the trip to Charleston., Remember, I'm one who goes to many away games and the tournament every year. Back in the days of Huck's Herd, I lived in New Martinsville. That's 150 miles from Huntington. I had season tickets and didn't miss a game in 4 years. So please don't lecture me about travel to games. All I'm saying is that when we have played Oregon and Cincinnati in Charleston, we had terrible crowds. In fact when we have played wvu our attendance has been poor.

wvu people paid the price. They outnumbered us by 2-1 or more

 

[PullmanFinger]

wvu people paid the price. They outnumbered us by 2-1 or more

I will never understand why that game had empty seats. All used to do is complain that WVU wouldnt play us in football, then it was like that in basketball, yet how many of our fans went to the game? MAYBE 3K? No excuses. I don't get it.

 

[oldeherd]

I was once again thing about this. Believe me, I don't mind the trip to Charleston., Remember, I'm one who goes to many away games and the tournament every year. Back in the days of Huck's Herd, I lived in New Martinsville. That's 150 miles from Huntington. I had season tickets and didn't miss a game in 4 years. So please don't lecture me about travel to games. All I'm saying is that when we have played Oregon and Cincinnati in Charleston, we had terrible crowds. In fact when we have played wvu our attendance has been poor.

Sorry, HM. Really meant to direct my "criticism" to those local Huntington Fans. Assumed that you were in Huntington. Applaud your support while living in NM. That's close to the trip I make from deep in Southern WV and have been a season ticket holder for past 4 or 5 seasons or so since returning to WV.

Can't agree with the statement about the attendance against WVU in Charleston CC. It holds about 12,000 or so and don't believe our game against the EERS in Charleston has drawn under 10,000 in the last several meetings. Usually 11,000 to 12,000, close to packed house. True that EER Fans heavily outnumbered Herd counterparts. A fact I again attribute to too many nose bent out of shape Huntingtonians refusing to go to Charleston to see Herd play, just to prove "a point". Typical backward Huntington thinking in my book.

In fact, that disparity among teams' fans is probably one reason the game ended. Believe each school got about similar number of tickets. But since their fans bought many more, WVU probably not too happy that the Herd got a pretty even split of the gate. Payout was pretty damn good, for both schools. Don't think any of the attendance numbers at the CCC would have been anything but a complete sellout at the Cam. How can you call that "poor", Herdmeister?

 

[PullmanFinger]

Sorry, HM. Really meant to direct my "criticism" to those local Huntington Fans. Assumed that you were in Huntington. Applaud your support while living in NM. That's close to the trip I make from deep in Southern WV and have been a season ticket holder for past 4 or 5 seasons or so since returning to WV.

Can't agree with the statement about the attendance against WVU in Charleston CC. It holds about 12,000 or so and don't believe our game against the EERS in Charleston has drawn under 10,000 in the last several meetings. Usually 11,000 to 12,000, close to packed house. True that EER Fans heavily outnumbered Herd counterparts. A fact I again attribute to too many nose bent out of shape Huntingtonians refusing to go to Charleston to see Herd play, just to prove "a point". Typical backward Huntington thinking in my book.

In fact, that disparity among teams' fans is probably one reason the game ended. Believe each school got about similar number of tickets. But since their fans bought many more, WVU probably not too happy that the Herd got a pretty even split of the gate. Payout was pretty damn good, for both schools. Don't think any of the attendance numbers at the CCC would have been anything but a complete sellout at the Cam. How can you call that "poor", Herdmeister?

I don't think money was ever an even moderate factor for WVU with that game. I would put several reasons it ended way before money.

 

[oldeherd]

I don't think money was ever an even moderate factor for WVU with that game. I would put several reasons it ended way before money.

Well, yea, D'Antoni popping off at the mouth didn't help matters any. Huggy essentially told DD and MU "F### You", took his ball and went back to Morgantown. They've been in NCAA ever since and we, uh, have . . . .

 

[Sean Hammond]

Well, yea, D'Antoni popping off at the mouth didn't help matters any. Huggy essentially told DD and MU "F### You", took his ball and went back to Morgantown. They've been in NCAA ever since and we, uh, have . . . .

The writing was on the wall. wvu and Huggins weren't going to renew any kind of deal. That was the last game. D'antoni just said that Marshall is coming back and they're scared to play the game, which is true.

Since Dan's comments (and once a healthy Jon Elmore stepped onto the floor) we've stayed slightly above/below top 100 RPI (top 30% of college bball), had a 20 win season, have played in the CUSA title game, and the only team to end our season the past two years was a team who's advanced to the second round of the NCAA tournament in those back-to-back seasons...something Huggins and wvu hasn't done.

We still have a ways to go, but I don't think D'antoni's mouth wrote any checks that his ass hasn't cashed.

 

[PullmanFinger]

The writing was on the wall. wvu and Huggins weren't going to renew any kind of deal. That was the last game. D'antoni just said that Marshall is coming back and they're scared to play the game, which is true.

Since Dan's comments (and once a healthy Jon Elmore stepped onto the floor) we've stayed slightly above/below top 100 RPI (top 30% of college bball), had a 20 win season, have played in the CUSA title game, and the only team to end our season the past two years was a team who's advanced to the second round of the NCAA tournament in those back-to-back seasons...something Huggins and wvu hasn't done.

We still have a ways to go, but I don't think D'antoni's mouth wrote any checks that his ass hasn't cashed.

Listen I'm all about kicking WVUs ass and would definitely like to have the series back in basketball because that was always a fun game. But get real. 1- I agree that the series was going to be over anyway but 2- I love how you spin any possible statistic to make it sound like we are the worthiest opponent to a slumping team. WVU ALSO played in their conference finals, and like Olde said above, hasn't missed the NCAA since we stopped playing them. Your spin on this is why the series ended. It wasn't DD's comments, and frankly I don't even think he was serious anyway, but it represented sentiments like yours. Instead of trying to make this about the good of the series for both teams and fan bases, you genuinely try to spin it to where we are somehow well above where we really are as a program. Let's be realists

 

[Sean Hammond]

Your spin on this is why the series ended.

I'll try to improve my "spin" so the series will continue

 

[PullmanFinger]

I'll try to improve my "spin" so the series will continue

Your spin on where we are as a program is a contributing factor to DD's comments, which were a fan base representation of ONE of the reasons the series ended. Roll your eyes all you want.. it's factual

 

[Sean Hammond]

Your spin on where we are as a program is a contributing factor to DD's comments, which were a fan base representation of ONE of the reasons the series ended. Roll your eyes all you want.. it's factual

I'm lost on how my spin is a contributing factor to Dan's comments haha, but whatever.

But getting to my "spin"--exactly what am I spinning? Have we not been hovering around 100 RPI the past two seasons? Out of 352 D1 basketball programs, that is in the top 30% of college basketball. Dan started out 14-28. Then since the last time we played wvu he's 34-23 while playing a decent schedule. I use that as a marker because that's about the time we got Elmore eligible and we finally got a PG to run his system. We've played for a CUSA championship and if not for us having to go through MTSU each year (a team who has made it to the second round of the NCAA tournament the last two seasons), we might have an NCAA tournament appearance. If you think I'm trying to spin that as "we have arrived," you're crazy. We still have a way to go. I'm just acknowledging the vast improvement we've made over the last 3 years. Every wvu fan who's bball opinion I respect thought Dan was a joke of a hire and laughed at the comments he made after that game. However, when I talk to them now, they're shocked at what he's done in such a short amount of time, with the players he's done it with, and some even envy our style because they loved the way they played under Beilein.

 

[19MU88]

it's good to hear the wvu view point.

 

[Always The Herd]

I am ALL MU and "so to speak" "0" WVU............but no one true MU fan in their "right mind" can say that we are anywhere near them (especially men's basketball & football). They play a "much tougher" schedule in each of those sports and have had much more success than we have ever had (if you don't agree, that's ok....BUT look at "all" of the bowls they have played, the dollar amounts they have brought in to their university, the facilities, tv/radio package, advertising, newspaper articles (nationally & locally), references on national sports talk shows, etc. They are way ahead of OUR MU ( at this time).

 

[oldeherd]

I'm lost on how my spin is a contributing factor to Dan's comments haha, but whatever.

But getting to my "spin"--exactly what am I spinning? Have we not been hovering around 100 RPI the past two seasons? Out of 352 D1 basketball programs, that is in the top 30% of college basketball. Dan started out 14-28. Then since the last time we played wvu he's 34-23 while playing a decent schedule. I use that as a marker because that's about the time we got Elmore eligible and we finally got a PG to run his system. We've played for a CUSA championship and if not for us having to go through MTSU each year (a team who has made it to the second round of the NCAA tournament the last two seasons), we might have an NCAA tournament appearance. If you think I'm trying to spin that as "we have arrived," you're crazy. We still have a way to go. I'm just acknowledging the vast improvement we've made over the last 3 years. Every wvu fan who's bball opinion I respect thought Dan was a joke of a hire and laughed at the comments he made after that game. However, when I talk to them now, they're shocked at what he's done in such a short amount of time, with the players he's done it with, and some even envy our style because they loved the way they played under Beilein.

How about this for "non spin". Let's see in Season 4 for DD, if he can finally beat Morehead State on the road. Same goes for Ohio U, too. In fact, any Road wins over a quality D1 opponent would be an improvement, especially in our non conference games. To get to any significant level above our current "top 30 per cent", D'Antoni's teams are going to drastically improve their road W-L record. Oh, and based on the numbers of D1 teams, it appears that only about the top 20 per cent are the ones going to the Big Dance every year, clearly the team and coaches have a lot more work to do!

 

[bbneutralfan]

Well oldeherd BIG problem for DD this season - no BIG'S that can really help. JMO

 

[PullmanFinger]

How about this for "non spin". Let's see in Season 4 for DD, if he can finally beat Morehead State on the road. Same goes for Ohio U, too. In fact, any Road wins over a quality D1 opponent would be an improvement, especially in our non conference games. To get to any significant level above our current "top 30 per cent", D'Antoni's teams are going to drastically improve their road W-L record. Oh, and based on the numbers of D1 teams, it appears that only about the top 20 per cent are the ones going to the Big Dance every year, clearly the team and coaches have a lot more work to do!

Exactly.. the 'spin' comes from looking for any numbers that favor the team and disregarding any numbers that don't. Losing to putrid teams is never a problem when RPI is 100. But if we were RPI 200 but beat some great teams, then the wins would be the argument. SPIN

 

[Sean Hammond]

Posting RPI #s is spin? You do realize that the putrid losses are baked into that RPi, right? If we didn't have those, the RPI would be much higher. Meaning: even with the putrid losses, we still have a decent resume.

And if your 200 RPI scenario was correct and we had great wins, do you realize how many putrid losses we'd have to have to have such a low RPI? We would only have like 8-10 wins. If someone tried to make that argument, I agree, that would be spin. If I tried to argue that we were really good by using our offensive stats, but failed to mention our bottom of the barrel defensive stats, THAT would be spin because they're exclusive items. But I just posted what our RPI has been in the past two years, which is a complete rating of our resume. Good and bad is baked into it. It's not spin.

 

[PullmanFinger]

Posting RPI #s is spin? You do realize that the putrid losses are baked into that RPi, right? If we didn't have those, the RPI would be much higher. Meaning: even with the putrid losses, we still have a decent resume.

And if your 200 RPI scenario was correct and we had great wins, do you realize how many putrid losses we'd have to have to have such a low RPI? We would only have like 8-10 wins. If someone tried to make that argument, I agree, that would be spin. If I tried to argue that we were really good by using our offensive stats, but failed to mention our bottom of the barrel defensive stats, THAT would be spin because they're exclusive items. But I just posted what our RPI has been in the past two years, which is a complete rating of our resume. Good and bad is baked into it. It's not spin.

The point is we play in a dismal conference which we've NEVER won, haven't been to the tournament in a couple generations, haven't beaten anyone worth a shit since I can remember, and can't even get half decent teams to play us, let alone beat them. And yet you are amazed by our RPI (which wouldn't even get us in the NIT). Please take the homer blinders off and be a realist. At least in football we have recent successes within the last 20'years

 

[PullmanFinger]

By the way I've seen 20-10 teams in the top 20 RPI and 25-5 teams not even in the top 100. SOS actually does matter

 

[Tim Hensley]

Pullman, should we just drop basketball?

 

[19MU88]

Pullman, should we just drop basketball?

then we could pull for wvu full time

 

[PullmanFinger]

By the way I've seen 20-10 teams in the top 20 RPI and 25-5 teams not even in the top 100. SOS actually does matter

Tim- Obviously you are either not very bright, or just didn't read the whole thread. I don't have a problem with where the basketball program is. What I DO have a problem with is when fans are unrealistic. I think we have made great strides in basketball, but TO THE POINT OF THE THREAD, Sean was not being realistic.

19MU88 must be a young guy as his handle might suggest, because he rarely has much feedback other than to jump to stupid conclusions every time someone has an opinion (a better one at that) different than his.