ADVERTISEMENT

Bill Withers

Y.A.G Si Ye Nots

Platinum Buffalo
Mar 7, 2010
5,841
2,426
113
Home Wrecker
Last night, I was with Mary J Blige and Nas after their show. We ended up having a little debate about who the top 10 R&B singers of all-time were, as Mary is routinely put in that discussion. Mary's list included Bill Withers. When she mentioned him, Nas and I looked at each other with a "WTF" expression, so Nas Googled him to see if his resume qualified anywhere close to being top 10.

In reading about him, he said that Withers was born and raised in West Virginia. I didn't realize that, so I read about him some more this morning. I knew he had two huge mega-hits with "Lean on Me" and "Ain't No Sunshine," but I had forgotten that "Just the Two of Us" and "Lovely Day" were also huge hits for him. Some of his other songs ended up being sampled for huge modern day hits like "No Diggity" and some records for Kendrick Lamar, Ed Sheeran, and Dr. Dre.

Withers was born in Slab Rock and grew up in Beckley where his father died when Bill was 13. He joined the Navy, served for nine years, then moved to LA when he was 29. So he basically grew up where many of you did and had a similar upbringing in terms of geography, money, military, etc. What's interesting is how different his views on social issues are from many of you who had a very similar upbringing other than him being black.

In one article I read about him, he was extremely moved by Caitlyn Jenner's ESPY speech. In another, he discussed how he, along with other black men his age, thought Obama was crazy to think he could actually win the presidency in the United States referring to him as "naive." In another, the interviewer mentioned how Withers seems to still be bitter about the obstacles he faced growing up (being black, stuttering). Withers also referred to how he still gets stopped by police in his own neighborhood, because they don't think he fits in there and appears suspicious to them.

This is a guy who grew up with very blue collar roots and went on to become wealthy and still have a very comfortable life 40+ years after retiring, yet he still has bitterness about the things he faced.

The differences in social beliefs you guys have even though you had very similar upbringings reinforces my belief that you deplorables simply don't have the experience seeing first-hand what minorities go through in this country. You haven't truly spent significant time around blacks, gays, etc. to see the daily discrimination and obstacles they face, which is why so many of you claim that racism is overblown.
 
He only required his guitar for accompaniment. A truly great song-writer and performer. Would imagine he's on a lot of top soul artist list.
 
  • Like
Reactions: sistersville
Last night, I was with Mary J Blige and Nas after their show. We ended up having a little debate about who the top 10 R&B singers of all-time were, as Mary is routinely put in that discussion. Mary's list included Bill Withers. When she mentioned him, Nas and I looked at each other with a "WTF" expression, so Nas Googled him to see if his resume qualified anywhere close to being top 10.

In reading about him, he said that Withers was born and raised in West Virginia. I didn't realize that, so I read about him some more this morning. I knew he had two huge mega-hits with "Lean on Me" and "Ain't No Sunshine," but I had forgotten that "Just the Two of Us" and "Lovely Day" were also huge hits for him. Some of his other songs ended up being sampled for huge modern day hits like "No Diggity" and some records for Kendrick Lamar, Ed Sheeran, and Dr. Dre.

Withers was born in Slab Rock and grew up in Beckley where his father died when Bill was 13. He joined the Navy, served for nine years, then moved to LA when he was 29. So he basically grew up where many of you did and had a similar upbringing in terms of geography, money, military, etc. What's interesting is how different his views on social issues are from many of you who had a very similar upbringing other than him being black.

In one article I read about him, he was extremely moved by Caitlyn Jenner's ESPY speech. In another, he discussed how he, along with other black men his age, thought Obama was crazy to think he could actually win the presidency in the United States referring to him as "naive." In another, the interviewer mentioned how Withers seems to still be bitter about the obstacles he faced growing up (being black, stuttering). Withers also referred to how he still gets stopped by police in his own neighborhood, because they don't think he fits in there and appears suspicious to them.

This is a guy who grew up with very blue collar roots and went on to become wealthy and still have a very comfortable life 40+ years after retiring, yet he still has bitterness about the things he faced.

The differences in social beliefs you guys have even though you had very similar upbringings reinforces my belief that you deplorables simply don't have the experience seeing first-hand what minorities go through in this country. You haven't truly spent significant time around blacks, gays, etc. to see the daily discrimination and obstacles they face, which is why so many of you claim that racism is overblown.



I know, I know, I know, I know, I know, I know...
 
I know this story because I’m from Beckley and my mom grew up just past Slab Fork in Helen. There used to be a sign on Tams Mountain Road indicating his birth place there. I would imagine a lot of people from that area have no idea who he is and what he went through to get there.
 
did the fact that he was moved by someone with a mental disorder push him into the top 10 of all time for you?

The differences in social beliefs you guys have even though you had very similar upbringings reinforces my belief that you deplorables simply don't have the experience seeing first-hand what minorities go through in this country. You haven't truly spent significant time around blacks, gays, etc. to see the daily discrimination and obstacles they face, which is why so many of you claim that racism is overblown.
or, it could be that liberal an faggit assholes like you throw the word racist around so cheaply when other's views doesn't butt fvck your own views and then you are called out on it after hearing yore calls of racist time and again, and would be why you believe that we believe racism is overblown. i know that sentence is probably more structurally fukt up than a football bat, and i'm okay with it. if you read it enough times, you'll get the point.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 19MU88
I completely agree that lack of experience or interaction with minorities makes it difficult to make assessments. We probably agree on this stuff more than we disagree.


Two things can be true at once though - racism still exists, but in some sectors the demand for racism exceeds the supply (see the recent GA politician that faked this supermarket incident, Smollett, etc). Lot's of good reading on this from both sides (Coates, Glen Loury, John McWorter, Coleman Hughes).

Kind of an aside:

However why does Whither's feelings (Obama is naive, he can't win bc he’s black and US racist) trump the truth (Obama can and will win)?

Personal "lived experience" as the woke like to say, does not trump empiric truth. The issue is nailing down what is truth and that is incredibly difficult. You can look at FBI crime stats and say blacks are more violent, but maybe that doesn't tell the whole story...but one's perceptions or "lived experience" should not be given more weight than that of empiric truth. THe concern to me in college campuses is we are prioritizing other things over search of truth. This was discussed some below.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/the-downside-of-diversity-11564758009
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: alphasig1053
And Withers is the man too.

I'm way out of my element on ranking R and B singers...but those Withers numbers mentioned above are classics.
 
Two things can be true at once though - racism still exists, but in some sectors the demand for racism exceeds the supply (see the recent GA politician that faked this supermarket incident, Smollett, etc). Lot's of good reading on this from both sides (Coates, Glen Loury, John McWorter, Coleman Hughes).

Or it's simply a situation where daily racism is hard to show many times - when you get passed over for a job because of your black sounding name even though the hire has a far less impressive resume . . . when nobody at the upscale jewelry store will help you . . . when you have a store employee follow you around at a store to make sure you aren't stealing . . .

Those forms of racism are tough to show unless you have a 360 degree camera recording you the entire time, so as a result, it leads to people fabricating incidents of racism in order to draw attention to the prevalence of it.

However why does Whither's feelings (Obama is naive, he can't win bc he’s black and US racist) trump the truth (Obama can and will win)?

It doesn't trump it. The point was that somebody with such a similar upbringing to people on here can have such a drastically different view of racism in this country. It is logical to know that Withers would have far more personal experiences with racism than the deplorables on here who grew up in that same region.
 
Or it's simply a situation where daily racism is hard to show many times - when you get passed over for a job because of your black sounding name even though the hire has a far less impressive resume . . . when nobody at the upscale jewelry store will help you . . . when you have a store employee follow you around at a store to make sure you aren't stealing . . .

Those forms of racism are tough to show unless you have a 360 degree camera recording you the entire time, so as a result, it leads to people fabricating incidents of racism in order to draw attention to the prevalence of it.



It doesn't trump it. The point was that somebody with such a similar upbringing to people on here can have such a drastically different view of racism in this country. It is logical to know that Withers would have far more personal experiences with racism than the deplorables on here who grew up in that same region.

Good post.

I *think* in general racism is getting better. Steven Pinker's data/books suggest lots of things are better.

However, it's not gone (examples above are good and I think still real). And if you were to just watch Twitter or the news it's hard to even imaging things are better but again I *think* they probably are. The hoaxing and victimhood-as-currency model are starting to hurt though.

I haven't developed deep thoughts on this but more than anything I'm starting to think that depersonalization and social media bubbles are worsening some social fabric. Thoughts like white men are evil, Blacks are violent, Mexicans are border hoppers or whatever, Trump voters are deplorables, Clinton voters are Marxists, et al....just doesn't line up with what I see in the real world...but those thoughts fester online and in bubbles.

To your original point though - yes, meeting and interacting with different people definitely changes your perspective.
 
ADVERTISEMENT

Latest posts

ADVERTISEMENT