WV...
- Thread starter Herdstruck
- Start date
If the coal industry was so darn good and great, why are towns like Logan. Welch, Pineville, Oceana, etc. still mired in 3rd world status? The corps.. take the profits and run. The average union guy stands up for coal even though he'll die from black lung and his community will be no better from the mine that's been there 25 years. jmo.
If coal were that great, these places should be boom towns and gleaming examples of how great the industry is.
BTW. my wife's grandfathers were both Logan Co. coal miners.
If coal were that great, these places should be boom towns and gleaming examples of how great the industry is.
BTW. my wife's grandfathers were both Logan Co. coal miners.
the answer is healthcare and advanced degrees in healthcare. if you want your kid to stick around- don't LET them major in english lit or political science for 4 years and then go looking for work- put them in healthcare, specifically a clinical path, not healthcare administration, which is the redheaded step child of 'business administration'. become an RN, a PA, an OD, a MD.
fun facts about wv: 33% of the population qualifies for medicaid. 20% qualify for medicare. nearly half of the state has healthcare insurance via the gov- factor in private insurers and you are looking at one of the highest insured populations in the country- that is a recipe for a profitable healthcare industry. health insurance companies, hospitals, private practices...you can make a pretty decent living at any which of one.
and before you go squaking about who the hell pays for all this free insurance- its primarily someone else, not west virginia. medicaid is largely (nearly 70%) funded by the federal government and medicare is 100% federal.
fun facts about wv: 33% of the population qualifies for medicaid. 20% qualify for medicare. nearly half of the state has healthcare insurance via the gov- factor in private insurers and you are looking at one of the highest insured populations in the country- that is a recipe for a profitable healthcare industry. health insurance companies, hospitals, private practices...you can make a pretty decent living at any which of one.
and before you go squaking about who the hell pays for all this free insurance- its primarily someone else, not west virginia. medicaid is largely (nearly 70%) funded by the federal government and medicare is 100% federal.
Medicare 100% federal then what did the money I was paying for 35 years go to? Pretty ignorant statement.
This post was edited on 2/24 8:26 PM by Herd In the Plains
This post was edited on 2/24 8:26 PM by Herd In the Plains
Wal-Mart - WM is the largest employer in exactly one other state, Arkansas. It is the largest private employer in seventeen. Hardly the majority.
Casinos, tourism, etc. - Casinos are a dead end. Eventually, every state, or every other state, has them. And then? All you have is a low rent, low class, LOCALS casino, which is just a tax on those bad at math. General tourism is mostly a dead end. WV has little to offer tourists. The only airport is a joke, the roads still inadequate, and, while there are a few places that are OK for niche groups (ultra-rich at the Greenbrier, skiers here and there, hikers and back to nature crowd in the highlands, so on) there is little to do for ordinary people. And for all of those who say "it is so pretty". You know what WV looks like? It look just like eastern KY, SE Ohio, southwestern Virginia, western Pennsylvania, and western Maryland. All of which are, by definition, closer to potential tourists. The One Party Government's tourism gang overstates the numbers by a factor of 10000. Some guy driving from Morgantown to Bluefield and buying a burger along the way on his way to Florida is not a tourist.
Healthcare - The whole great socialist idea that every little girl should go off to nurse school so they can take care of old people on welfare and then age out to being an old person on welfare has two huge holes in it. First, eventually you run out of other people's money. Second, in the coming healthcare fiasco, it isn't covered anymore. But more importantly, it is not the basis for an economy. What does your state do? We grow wheat. What does yours do? We program computers. You? We make steel. You? Umm, we have a bunch of old people on welfare, we wipe their a***es for them. See the problem?
Public-private partnerships - Yeah, as far as it goes. Should any college offer things that the local employers want? Yes. But that only goes so far, because there are good jobs available already.
EP - The EP makes it IN SPITE of WV, not because of it. The One Party Government gets a P&G plant and, for the next 10 years will yell "SEE!!! We are not 'tort hell'. All is well!! Its great." Did it with Toyota, did it with the phony airplane plant, so on. Meanwhile, in well run states, 50 such operations open every year. To no fanfare, because there is ordinary news. And meanwhile, less WVians work ever day.
Drugs - You cannot fight drugs on the supply side. You can kill every Detroit drug dealers and all you do is turn Huntington over to Chicago drug dealers. Drugs are 100% a demand side problem. Idiotic welfare policies have made work optional, and a certain subclass of proto-humans will choose not to work, preferring a life of subsidized idle, and a subclass of that will fill its day on dope. Really that simple. Make work mandatory again, end the drug problem. But that takes the moral courage to cut off (cut off completely, not just the phony one-program "reform" of the 90s) the deadassed. Nobody currently in politics has that moral courage.
WV's future can be bright. Copy laws and policies of well run places (Texas, Virginia, etc) for the parts that are habitable, and let nature reclaim the rest.
Casinos, tourism, etc. - Casinos are a dead end. Eventually, every state, or every other state, has them. And then? All you have is a low rent, low class, LOCALS casino, which is just a tax on those bad at math. General tourism is mostly a dead end. WV has little to offer tourists. The only airport is a joke, the roads still inadequate, and, while there are a few places that are OK for niche groups (ultra-rich at the Greenbrier, skiers here and there, hikers and back to nature crowd in the highlands, so on) there is little to do for ordinary people. And for all of those who say "it is so pretty". You know what WV looks like? It look just like eastern KY, SE Ohio, southwestern Virginia, western Pennsylvania, and western Maryland. All of which are, by definition, closer to potential tourists. The One Party Government's tourism gang overstates the numbers by a factor of 10000. Some guy driving from Morgantown to Bluefield and buying a burger along the way on his way to Florida is not a tourist.
Healthcare - The whole great socialist idea that every little girl should go off to nurse school so they can take care of old people on welfare and then age out to being an old person on welfare has two huge holes in it. First, eventually you run out of other people's money. Second, in the coming healthcare fiasco, it isn't covered anymore. But more importantly, it is not the basis for an economy. What does your state do? We grow wheat. What does yours do? We program computers. You? We make steel. You? Umm, we have a bunch of old people on welfare, we wipe their a***es for them. See the problem?
Public-private partnerships - Yeah, as far as it goes. Should any college offer things that the local employers want? Yes. But that only goes so far, because there are good jobs available already.
EP - The EP makes it IN SPITE of WV, not because of it. The One Party Government gets a P&G plant and, for the next 10 years will yell "SEE!!! We are not 'tort hell'. All is well!! Its great." Did it with Toyota, did it with the phony airplane plant, so on. Meanwhile, in well run states, 50 such operations open every year. To no fanfare, because there is ordinary news. And meanwhile, less WVians work ever day.
Drugs - You cannot fight drugs on the supply side. You can kill every Detroit drug dealers and all you do is turn Huntington over to Chicago drug dealers. Drugs are 100% a demand side problem. Idiotic welfare policies have made work optional, and a certain subclass of proto-humans will choose not to work, preferring a life of subsidized idle, and a subclass of that will fill its day on dope. Really that simple. Make work mandatory again, end the drug problem. But that takes the moral courage to cut off (cut off completely, not just the phony one-program "reform" of the 90s) the deadassed. Nobody currently in politics has that moral courage.
WV's future can be bright. Copy laws and policies of well run places (Texas, Virginia, etc) for the parts that are habitable, and let nature reclaim the rest.
The "future light" for WV is fading fast. This is my State, born and raised. I earned by degree from Marshall and went to law school out of State (sorry WVU) and moved back with my WV born and raised wife. I have practiced law here for the last 14 years. I have two kids that are currently in middle school. I make a really good salary. My wife works as well and makes a decent salary. (Also a graduate of Marshall) However, my wife and I have decided that in about a year or so, we are moving.
We are not moving because of ourselves, we are moving for our kids. There is nothing here for our kids and I don't see it changing. It hasn't since I was a kid. Healthcare is not great, nothing here for kids to do, majority of people are unhealthy, jobs are pretty much non-existent. WV routinely rates dead last in these categories. Highest percent of households earning less than $25,000 a year we are next to last (which is not good). I think the last time I looked the poverty rate was something like 19%. Something like only 30% of people 25 to 34 had an associate degree or higher.
Gallup did a chart a year or so a go. It was a future livability chart for each State. West Virginia ranked "worst" State in the following: Economic confidence index, obesity, smoker, future job prospects, well being, social life.
So, it is not just the money or job prospects for us. We will be fine either way. However, we want more opportunity for our kids. That is our focus.
We are not moving because of ourselves, we are moving for our kids. There is nothing here for our kids and I don't see it changing. It hasn't since I was a kid. Healthcare is not great, nothing here for kids to do, majority of people are unhealthy, jobs are pretty much non-existent. WV routinely rates dead last in these categories. Highest percent of households earning less than $25,000 a year we are next to last (which is not good). I think the last time I looked the poverty rate was something like 19%. Something like only 30% of people 25 to 34 had an associate degree or higher.
Gallup did a chart a year or so a go. It was a future livability chart for each State. West Virginia ranked "worst" State in the following: Economic confidence index, obesity, smoker, future job prospects, well being, social life.
So, it is not just the money or job prospects for us. We will be fine either way. However, we want more opportunity for our kids. That is our focus.
He is saying there are not many promising industries for good jobs in WV and another state will provide more opportunities for his kids. There will always be some good jobs in any area but there needs to be enough to where people are not underemployed. Which I figure is his concern. His kids may turn out to be smart well educated adults but there could be others who have already taken the majority of the good jobs and they may have to settle for a lesser position than they could get in another area. Stronger economies provide more and better paying jobs.
OK, that makes sense in the context of his posts. Thank you.
Funny, when I think of WVa, I never think about the "EP". I know a cousin of mine & her husband had looked in WVa when they were moving to the DC area for his job, but they ended up around where the battles of Bull Run were fought.
On several levels, that is VERY correct. Most coal is used to boil water & raise the temp & pressurize the resulting steam to rotate turbines. All the alternatives (fuel oil, natural gas, enriched uranium) to boil the water are much, much cleaner & don't require blasting the shit out of mountain ranges. All 3 alternatives have their disadvantages, but coal pretty much is the worst option.
In the late summer of 1970 I left Marshall and went to work for a large coal company. I ordered and bought a new 1971 Chevrolet Nova in approx. February of 1971.........I wanted to buy and install an 8-track tape player (thery were the big thing when trying to listen to music in your car back then).
I went to one of the local stores in my town and wanted to start establising some other credit. If memory serves me right the Motorola player was approx. $49.00 (quite a bit of money back then, especially when the minimum wage was approx. $1.25 per hour). I asked the owner of the store if I could charge it and he said I could as long as I put it on my mother's charge account (you could charge at local stores back then too). I said nicely.....no, I want to open up an account and put it in my name. He ABSOLUTELY refused and said no I wasn't 21 yet (would have been in April of that year). I ended up getting mad and upset and said NO I will not put it in her name. I then stated that I would not buy anything else from that store again (I don't think I ever did, but not positive).
I told other adults and people my own age.....that was a BIG problem with business people in our town. They didn't want to trust people or give someone a chance to get started and didn't look to the future for improvement & change & vertually would become stagnant.........
now in 2015 the town is virtually dried up. All of these businesses went out of business: Krogers, A&P, 2 indoor theaters, bowling alley, 3 jewelery stores, 4 clothing stores, Western Auto, G. C. Murpy's, Ford, Chevrolet, Buick, Crysler, hardware store, Sears catalog store, 3 barber shops, 4 gas stations, oil distributor, wholesale grocery company, an hospital, numerous bars, hotel & many others.........
I went to one of the local stores in my town and wanted to start establising some other credit. If memory serves me right the Motorola player was approx. $49.00 (quite a bit of money back then, especially when the minimum wage was approx. $1.25 per hour). I asked the owner of the store if I could charge it and he said I could as long as I put it on my mother's charge account (you could charge at local stores back then too). I said nicely.....no, I want to open up an account and put it in my name. He ABSOLUTELY refused and said no I wasn't 21 yet (would have been in April of that year). I ended up getting mad and upset and said NO I will not put it in her name. I then stated that I would not buy anything else from that store again (I don't think I ever did, but not positive).
I told other adults and people my own age.....that was a BIG problem with business people in our town. They didn't want to trust people or give someone a chance to get started and didn't look to the future for improvement & change & vertually would become stagnant.........
now in 2015 the town is virtually dried up. All of these businesses went out of business: Krogers, A&P, 2 indoor theaters, bowling alley, 3 jewelery stores, 4 clothing stores, Western Auto, G. C. Murpy's, Ford, Chevrolet, Buick, Crysler, hardware store, Sears catalog store, 3 barber shops, 4 gas stations, oil distributor, wholesale grocery company, an hospital, numerous bars, hotel & many others.........
Well Elgin, if you ignore little things like cost per BTU, then you are correct, coal sucks.
And hunters, your right, people that work for community don't know anything about money center banks. Good thing I worked at 4 of the 10 largest banks in the country before I worked for a community bank. It's also a good thing that of the 19 bankers that work for me nearly all come from Chase, BB&T, Fifth Third, PNC, etc. if you want to find people that don't know anything about banking walk in to a savings and loan or credit union.
And hunters, your right, people that work for community don't know anything about money center banks. Good thing I worked at 4 of the 10 largest banks in the country before I worked for a community bank. It's also a good thing that of the 19 bankers that work for me nearly all come from Chase, BB&T, Fifth Third, PNC, etc. if you want to find people that don't know anything about banking walk in to a savings and loan or credit union.
So you went into debt for a depreciating, ultimately worthless piece of junk that cost roughly a weeks pay (assuming you worked a full 40hr workweek). No wonder you don't think someone can live on $15 hour starting out in the working world. If this post is any indication how you handled your finances its amazing you can afford the computer you are typing on.
Additionally, a business that doesn't extend credit to someone in this type of situation is a blessing. If more businesses (and govts) practiced this policy, this country wouldn't be bankrupt the way we are now.
Part of it is because WV is a bunch of cowards and afraid of others and outsiders...WV used to be an escape place for people to basically hide out and not be noticed.
Sort of took it to an extreme.
Also, so many people ultimately try to screw each other...business owners try to put one another out of business...others refuse to see what a good thing another business can do for everyone.
Hell, that Glaser furniture fuc.ker...absolutely HATES Marshall and refused to sell his building to the school who wanted the property...at the time El Ranchito's was vacant so it could have been where Fats is now.
Anyways, the school offered him something ridiculously high like $2.5 million for the property and building...he refused. He now has displayed the newspaper article, all blown up in his crap-tastic store...about his "victory" over Marshall. I'm sure his family are hoping he dies soon because they couldn't possibly be making any money in that store...and he's a prick when it comes to parking and will tow students who park there who want to go to Fats instead.
So there's that...we also have too much greed...and it seriously, should come to the point where, if I could afford it, I'd hire foreign assassins to take out some of the greed...people need to die for some of the shit they've done. I know of one landowner who basically enslaved a tenant to work for him for rent, would pay him for overtime work, didn't pay him...it got so bad the tenant had to pawn his boss' powertools (his boss was the landlord) just to feed his family.
Landlord took him to court...and thankfully lost.
But that sort of crap...I mean...really...give me a catapult and let me put some of these worthless pieces of crap on there and shoot them into the hills in ohio.
Hopefully the mayor cleans up alot of the corruption...which is basically one of the major parts of why Huntington is so bad...and WV as a whole.
Sort of took it to an extreme.
Also, so many people ultimately try to screw each other...business owners try to put one another out of business...others refuse to see what a good thing another business can do for everyone.
Hell, that Glaser furniture fuc.ker...absolutely HATES Marshall and refused to sell his building to the school who wanted the property...at the time El Ranchito's was vacant so it could have been where Fats is now.
Anyways, the school offered him something ridiculously high like $2.5 million for the property and building...he refused. He now has displayed the newspaper article, all blown up in his crap-tastic store...about his "victory" over Marshall. I'm sure his family are hoping he dies soon because they couldn't possibly be making any money in that store...and he's a prick when it comes to parking and will tow students who park there who want to go to Fats instead.
So there's that...we also have too much greed...and it seriously, should come to the point where, if I could afford it, I'd hire foreign assassins to take out some of the greed...people need to die for some of the shit they've done. I know of one landowner who basically enslaved a tenant to work for him for rent, would pay him for overtime work, didn't pay him...it got so bad the tenant had to pawn his boss' powertools (his boss was the landlord) just to feed his family.
Landlord took him to court...and thankfully lost.
But that sort of crap...I mean...really...give me a catapult and let me put some of these worthless pieces of crap on there and shoot them into the hills in ohio.
Hopefully the mayor cleans up alot of the corruption...which is basically one of the major parts of why Huntington is so bad...and WV as a whole.
I dont know if you are angry at him or what but I dont see in his story that he purchased the 8 track. Also it is admirable is that he did not want to put his mom on the hook for his purchase. However, if a person can get a loan for a car they should probably be able to get credit for a 8-track player. I am not sure why you are so combative about the purchase of the 8-track. How is that any different from buying a nice TV nowadays? Lets say you make 40,000/year and you are paid on the 15 and 30th of each month. $40,000 / 24 = $1,666.67 per two weeks. $1,666.67/2 = 833.34 per week. A good TV is somewhere close to $800. $40,000 is a reasonable salary in todays terms. So you are saying someone is dumb for purchasing a TV for one weeks worth of their salary?
No that's not what I am saying. You are changing the premise of what ATH was stating he was actually looking to do. ATH was not simply talking about buying with cash a depreciating item like a tape player. Buying with debt (no matter who's debt it is) is not the same (or wise) as buying with cash. If one has the expendable cash on hand to do so.......then so be it. Its their $$$, good for them.
ATH advocating that it be a wise financial decision to buy such a worthless item on "credit", consuming 1 weeks pay, is as absurd and irresponsible as later in life, starting a thread/poll, pointing out how people "cant make it" earning $30k a year in WV; while also attempting to make a point that a business not issuing credit/debt allowing people to burn up there earned income on depreciating junk with no future value before they earn it......... somehow causes a town, state (like WV) to disappear.
As usual, ATH is all over the place with his senseless polls and "reasoning" in asking for participation in them.
First off I think I am agreeing with you more than I originally thought. I would agree one could, without doubt, "make it" on 30,000 in Huntington. To be honest I do not know what he meant by buying on credit because I was not around in the 70s so I am not sure if this is interest bearing "credit" or if he would put it on a layaway type program. If it was like a 12 months no interest program then I can understand it. I live by the idea you are speaking of (only purchasing items if you can pay in cash) with the exception of a mortgage. However, I purchased some furniture last year that I could have paid cash for, however, they had a 12 month no interest deal so I used that. Doing so provides people with the ability to not have a large cash outflow at one time and allows them to keep more cash in case of emergency. I have not read the other thread you are talking about.
. . . and fuel oil, natural gas, enriched uranium, water turbines, wind turbines and sunlight collector grids all are far more expensive than bituminous coal per btu of output.The Obama regime has shut electrical generation units adding up 72 gigawatts of power generation - enough to supply 44.7 million homes. That is all the power needed for every state west of the Mississippi excluding Texas. The EPA is targeting a total of 103 GW of power. The only question is: When will the brown-outs begin - starting with the east coast?
Coal does not suck! Most U.S coal comes from three open quarry mines located in the Powder River Basin on the high plains of northeastern Wyoming. The North Antelope Rochelle mine in Powder River Basin, operated by Peabody Energy, is the world's largest. Black Thunder is fifth largest and the Coballo mine, near Gillette, WY is #8. This coal is high in btus and very low in sulfur. The operations are mechanized with huge machines doing the work. The coal is super, super, cheap. The coal deposits are vast. Why would we use any other fuel to produce electrical power?
Over 100 years of colonialism with extraction industries. WV is rugged, most locals still isolated. Face it, the state is fvcked and there is nothing any politician can do but cut off the bums so they move, clean the place up, and leave it for old hippies, rich people who want to live in the mountains, and a few low paying jobs in tourism. And ban MTR tomorrow, all it does is mess up the view for the above hippies, the rich, and tourists.
Posted from Rivals Mobile
Posted from Rivals Mobile
co·lo·ni·al·ism
kəˈlōnēəˌlizəm/
noun
the policy or practice of acquiring full or partial political control over another country, occupying it with settlers, and exploiting it economically.
the policy or practice of acquiring full or partial political control over another country, occupying it with settlers, and exploiting it economically.
This post was edited on 2/26 10:04 PM by herdgadfly
It does suck. Where is all the ash 'deposited'? The ash is very high in heavy metal salts & forms dams which kill people. The exhaust of even the 'cleanest' coal burned contains heavy metal compounds. Transporting coal is dangerous. There is no valid reason that using uranium & plutonium would be more expensive except that the environmentalists went after the wrong target which would be COAL. Extracting coal permanently fvcks up the ecologies & topographies of where it's mined...and since huge volumes of coal relative to Uranium is required, extracting coal REALLY scars the country side...along with the huge amount of ash produced. (Any form of oil is no bargain either in terms of extraction, but at least there's not much solid waste after burning. U mining is nasty, but much less ore is needed to produce the same energy. E = MC^2 baby.)
Now to the topic...how do the western mines help WV? And AFA as that goes, how much are the WY mines helping Wyoming? Almost all economies based on mineral extraction are very fragile, boom or bust. Are the profits being keep in the state of WY OR like WV, is the capital being sent out of state?
elginherd:
You need to seriously reconsider your limited outlook. If we adopt the thinking of the communist environmentalists, there is no "living the good life" left for us. We can knuckle under to the political lies and regress to the dark cold hardscrabble times of the 18th century or we can enjoy the bright cool times that modern technology has brought.
If we buy into government lies such as 'second hand smoke" and "global warming" - then accepting the government claims about coal ash might be easier - but we already know they lie to us. God's world is bigger than all of us put together and we are but pissants wandering in the Sahara Desert. There is nothing that man can do to harm the good Earth. So let us start a new sanity by not paying excessive costs for the energy that makes living easier.
You need to seriously reconsider your limited outlook. If we adopt the thinking of the communist environmentalists, there is no "living the good life" left for us. We can knuckle under to the political lies and regress to the dark cold hardscrabble times of the 18th century or we can enjoy the bright cool times that modern technology has brought.
If we buy into government lies such as 'second hand smoke" and "global warming" - then accepting the government claims about coal ash might be easier - but we already know they lie to us. God's world is bigger than all of us put together and we are but pissants wandering in the Sahara Desert. There is nothing that man can do to harm the good Earth. So let us start a new sanity by not paying excessive costs for the energy that makes living easier.
That definition of colonialism sounds pretty much 110% spot on for how coal companies have treated this state.
Am I missing sarcasm or what is going on here?
This post was edited on 2/27 9:26 AM by jkcoltsfan18
Yep, I laughed at that comment myself. WOW!Originally posted by jkcoltsfan18:
Am I missing sarcasm or what is going on here?
This post was edited on 2/27 9:26 AM by jkcoltsfan18
Gadfly, colonialism does not necessarily involve one nation state over another; internal colonialism is a very real concept...see the work of Nicholas Thomas, the Australian anthropologist.
If you want to be technical, WV has suffered from internal extractive colonialism.
Posted from Rivals Mobile
If you want to be technical, WV has suffered from internal extractive colonialism.
Posted from Rivals Mobile
I'm not siding with the environmentalists...nor do I side with coal advocates. Neither side is pragmatic. Both sides really believe their own bullshit without regard to the effect of what they would advocate happen.
1st: nukes are much cleaner & could be cheaper than coal. No scientific reason to pay excessive costs.
Your beliefs about 2nd hand smoke demonstrates basic misunderstanding of probabilities. Plus you would infringe on my right to breathe air that doesn't stink whether it's harmful (and it is) or not.
Your statement about 'global warming' demonstrates that you don't believe in thermometers. I'll let you read about the thousands of temperature sensors deployed around the world & the correlation in the geological evidence of the effect from the dawn of the 19th century along with the satellite observations which gather data from the lightning strikes around the world.
The info about coal ash are not "gov't" claims...they are fact. Ask a chemist or soil scientist or even a high school chem teacher.
OH what about the thousands of streams & ponds where mercury salts from coal exhaust have made it dangerous for us to eat the fish? A lot of poor people in SC depended on this to supplement their food supply. What about MY FVCKING RIGHT TO EAT CRAPPIE WITHOUT A NON-GOVERNMENT ENTITY FvCKING WITH MY RIGHTS TO EAT FISH NOT CONTAMINATED WITH Hg salts???? BTW, just the mercury deposits screws your 'man can't harm the world' hypothesis.
You are right about one thing & one thing only...we don't want to go back to the stone age. The thing is that coal (no matter how 'clean' the coal) ends up being a very expensive option when ALL the costs are considered. Of course you (& most of the environmentalists) don't consider systems, That's where your head-in-the-sand "burn coal" & the NIMBY tree-huggers "no nuke" (add the Yucca Mountain NIMBY's) are seriously misguided.
Besides, the topic is about WV's prospects. WY's coal doesn't do WV any good & WV's coal wealth was for the most part transferred out of state.
This post was edited on 2/27 9:52 PM by elginherd
1st: nukes are much cleaner & could be cheaper than coal. No scientific reason to pay excessive costs.
Your beliefs about 2nd hand smoke demonstrates basic misunderstanding of probabilities. Plus you would infringe on my right to breathe air that doesn't stink whether it's harmful (and it is) or not.
Your statement about 'global warming' demonstrates that you don't believe in thermometers. I'll let you read about the thousands of temperature sensors deployed around the world & the correlation in the geological evidence of the effect from the dawn of the 19th century along with the satellite observations which gather data from the lightning strikes around the world.
The info about coal ash are not "gov't" claims...they are fact. Ask a chemist or soil scientist or even a high school chem teacher.
OH what about the thousands of streams & ponds where mercury salts from coal exhaust have made it dangerous for us to eat the fish? A lot of poor people in SC depended on this to supplement their food supply. What about MY FVCKING RIGHT TO EAT CRAPPIE WITHOUT A NON-GOVERNMENT ENTITY FvCKING WITH MY RIGHTS TO EAT FISH NOT CONTAMINATED WITH Hg salts???? BTW, just the mercury deposits screws your 'man can't harm the world' hypothesis.
You are right about one thing & one thing only...we don't want to go back to the stone age. The thing is that coal (no matter how 'clean' the coal) ends up being a very expensive option when ALL the costs are considered. Of course you (& most of the environmentalists) don't consider systems, That's where your head-in-the-sand "burn coal" & the NIMBY tree-huggers "no nuke" (add the Yucca Mountain NIMBY's) are seriously misguided.
Besides, the topic is about WV's prospects. WY's coal doesn't do WV any good & WV's coal wealth was for the most part transferred out of state.
This post was edited on 2/27 9:52 PM by elginherd
As I said, we need to look at a state similar to WV...well...one that WAS similar to WV and see how their model worked for them.
I think Natural Gas is the next wave for us in terms of productivity or something...I dunno.
WV has to figure itself out or they'll lose even more ground than ever.
I think Natural Gas is the next wave for us in terms of productivity or something...I dunno.
WV has to figure itself out or they'll lose even more ground than ever.
There is no state similar to WV. Seriously. The closest would be Wyoming, and all they have is the same extraction industries (just a lot more stuff to extract) with the wealth fleeing the state. Wyoming has a high median income because no one lives there. One day, when all the mineral wealth is gone, Wyoming will either see everyone leave or it will be another WV.
A
anon_0314hp8ssprnn
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I left WV 40 years ago, so I'm emotionally detached from this discussion. What I do know is West Virginia history which included corruption among both the industrial and political classes, the intentional and successful efforts to keep the working class dependent upon the powers in both sectors, the stifling of entrepreneurship and the overall lack of vision and creativity among the state's leaders. The middle class that was created in the state was a direct result of federal government initiatives, educational employment and the union movement.
Having said that, as a traveler to most of the 50 states, West Virginia is still to me the nation's most beautiful. Whenever I make one of my all too rare visits, I get chills when I drive up I77 through Mercer and Raleigh and through Greenbriar County on I64. The state has many assets to offer companies. One big mistake was not building a major airport between Huntington and Charleston years ago. Another issue is having short sighted politicians who are not aggressive in selling the state using tax and development incentives that favorably compete with other states. I'm sure that all of you could add other errors to this list.
Unfortunately, what's past is past. It's up to you who remain there to demand better either by electing the appropriate representatives or run yourselves and be a part of the process. In my view, West Virginia has maintained great potential throughout its history. But for a myriad of reasons something or someone continually got in the way of progress. It's time to make that potential a reality.
Having said that, as a traveler to most of the 50 states, West Virginia is still to me the nation's most beautiful. Whenever I make one of my all too rare visits, I get chills when I drive up I77 through Mercer and Raleigh and through Greenbriar County on I64. The state has many assets to offer companies. One big mistake was not building a major airport between Huntington and Charleston years ago. Another issue is having short sighted politicians who are not aggressive in selling the state using tax and development incentives that favorably compete with other states. I'm sure that all of you could add other errors to this list.
Unfortunately, what's past is past. It's up to you who remain there to demand better either by electing the appropriate representatives or run yourselves and be a part of the process. In my view, West Virginia has maintained great potential throughout its history. But for a myriad of reasons something or someone continually got in the way of progress. It's time to make that potential a reality.
I don't tell many attorneys this, but your logic sucks.
Your kids are in middle school and you're moving so they can have more opportunity? More opportunity for what, places to blow money, better homes to stay for sleepovers? If you're talking about education, they're going to go elsewhere for a whopping 4 years before they eventually move again and go to college? Per your profile, you live in Winfield - which has the #4 rated HS for WV on SchoolDigger. My graduating class at Cabell Midland (currently ranked #24) had students attend (and graduate from) Cal Tech, Cornell, Penn, VT, NIU, UC, Alabama, and that's only the kids I knew while I was there. I don't begrudge anyone for moving away from WV for a better job, that's understandable, but your kids are past the point where moving will make a difference.
You forgot about WVU...nah you ARE correct, all they have is Marshall.
Clark, I'm sure there are some really good teachers in Cabell Co schools. There might even be a decent administrator or two, though the 5 teachers that I know tell horror stories about the shitty way they were & are treated. But there are much, much better public schools available than what are available in the tri-state.
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