Yep. No doubt but we can’t police it.
Do what we can do and forget about the rest.
Fan Accountability
- Thread starter herd4life5 (HN)
- Start date
Do what we can do and forget about the rest.
What in the world are you talking about there, Kreskin? By MU changing their spending habits, are you intimating increasing ticket prices? Good God man, haven’t you been paying attention? Talk about assisted suicide: $75 general seating!! Yeah, that’ll fill up the Joan!!
GHMY - that’s the point: The $2500 beach trip, put on a credit card and making the minimum payment severely dents the average families’ disposable spending the rest of the year. Step outside of yourself for 5 minutes and crunch the numbers - not from your point of view, but from theirs…..the sound you hear is the bell ringing….
How about we win the next 5 or 6 conference titles..
if you want to grow your program or fan base you have to win conference titles....
as for the hotdog situation... just bring back the thunder dog and quit toying with it...
if you want to grow your program or fan base you have to win conference titles....
as for the hotdog situation... just bring back the thunder dog and quit toying with it...
The bottom line is: Marshall football isn't a priority for a lot of people in our area. Marshall's athletic department needs to do whatever it can to change that, and make it a priority.
This attitude that "well people should just want to come to the game" is part of the problem.
This attitude that "well people should just want to come to the game" is part of the problem.
This is a big issue and getting bigger... Especially as home entertainment continues to improve.
I can drive 6 hours, spend thousands of dollars for hotels, tickets, meals, gas, etc for 3 days for my family of five... Or I can sit in my comfy recliner, watch the game on my 50-inch flat screen in high-def, drink whatever beer I choose and get any food I want delivered by Grubhub.
Like everyone else on here Im a diehard, so I still make the trip 3-4 times a year. But every year the decision gets a little tougher.
Cost isn't an issue for me either, fortunately, but I will say this... My dad got two tickets to the Tennessee Titans season opener cheaper than what he paid for two sideline tickets for him and my mom to watch Marshall lose to ECU. That is an issue.
WOW! That last line about ticket cost says it all. That is a huge issue.
Here is a radical thought!! I have noticed the East side bleachers are getting thinner and thinner. The student section was great the first game, but not so the second game. Why don't we do like Penn State (again) and move the student section behind the visiting team. That should help the kids stay and be involved in the game as what is more fun than giving a 6' 5" 300 pound man He!! and he can't do nothing about it.
The second thing is our Ad needs to learn from the Southwest Airways project I had to do in College. An empty seat is a bad seat, drop the end zone seats down to $12 a game. That way families will attend the game.
To those who say we are going to offend the season ticket holders on the east side, not so if the AD handles it right. They need to explain why they are doing it and offer these individuals a discount for a couple of year. May lose some, but long term might get some future ticket holders out of the students.
The second thing is our Ad needs to learn from the Southwest Airways project I had to do in College. An empty seat is a bad seat, drop the end zone seats down to $12 a game. That way families will attend the game.
To those who say we are going to offend the season ticket holders on the east side, not so if the AD handles it right. They need to explain why they are doing it and offer these individuals a discount for a couple of year. May lose some, but long term might get some future ticket holders out of the students.
Endzone seats at Marshall are $20 ticket online. That's affordable. Using a cost excuse for 95% of the public just isn't legit when you see what people actually spend their money on regularly.
Reality: Watching a football game is just not a priority for most people. Too many other obligations exist and take priority for a "casual" fan.
I wouldn't necessarily drop all end zone seats to $12 a game across the board, but there is no reason a week out we can't look and see "Damn, we've only sold 20k tickets for next Saturday" and run a promotion to that effect.
If we are playing a quality opponent and ticket sales are going well, don't have a promo. If we are playing NC Central or a G5 bottom feeder, fire up discounted tickets a week before and have a fire sale on end zone seats.
They were $30 for ECU. You can get 4 in 105 for $100 normally, For ECU they jacked it up to $30 per ticket as well. I paid $40 to sit in 107 and tack on a $2 online fee.
Yeah, people will spend money on what they think brings value and enjoyment. MU's job is to make the games fun and exciting for all. Right now they aren't doing that. It's entertainment more than a game for the average fan. For us hardcore fans, we go to watch the Herd compete, period.
It's a tall order to increase our attendance, many factors working against MU. Heck , all sports are suffering attendance declines. Students prefer Tik Tok to watching our games. ugh!
As stated, I-A college football COSTS MONEY. Typical Huntington attitude
Rotten super-fandom. CUSA football is Marshall football.
Rotten super-fandom. If you want the “good guys” to win every game, become a fan of pro wrestling or the Globetrotters.
The biggest name at Marshall stadium every week is, and should be, MARSHALL. However, 22 has a return of a G5 team that has had recent success, Appy State; 23 has a service academy, Navy, and an ACC team with a history, Virginia Tech; the next nearest I-A team, Ohio, returns in 25 (and should be an annual event); and ESPN’s darling, Boise State comes in in 27. That is comparable to any peer program.
Playing P5 teams at home, especially in a for 1 basis is not going to happen on a regular basis.
The “reseating issue” was almost a decade ago. Another typical Huntington attitude. I have been setting here forever and I want what I want and I want OTHERS to pay for it. Memo: Again, I-A football costs money, and paying a premium for the premium seats is part of that. If you want the seats, this is how much they cost.
And the same thing went on at about the same time at WVU, UK, Cincy, and lots more places.
IMO, MU's job is to do all it can to put a good product on the field. Attracting someone to buy a ticket who rather be on Tik tok, or to engage ADHD "fan" interests is a complete waste of time and resources.
It wouldn't matter if you had AC/DC singing/playing the team intro every week at the Joan. "Fans" would blame loud music for reduced attendance.
Then is sounds like we are stuck in the 24-25K average from this point going forward. No reason to discuss at that point. We just accept it at face value for what it is.
Not saying we should "accept" it. The only thing Marshall can control is the quality of the product playing the game and promoting that quality product. "party decks" and DJs are gimmicks that will only going to get you so far
This could not be more off base. If we continue to act like this we’ll have an empty stadium but I guess we’ll have our pride because we didn’t have to give in and engage those darn “adhd fans”.
Sadly, a lot in the Marshall athletic department have historically felt this way. “You should want to come watch our game and if you don’t, that’s your loss.” What an awful model for attracting fans.
I'm not saying we cant try new things. The DJ has potential. Closing down 20th ST for music and gathering is good too. But lets not think for a moment that entertainment gimmicks will change the long term trajectory of fan attendance. What are the big boys really doing special for fan "entertainment"? Seriously? Did WVU have a DJ booth playing in morganhole this weekend to sell tickets? (No.) Did NC State ( a chronic underperforming program) build a party deck to attract student body or uninterested ADHD fans? (No.) What will Appy do on a week night to attract fans to drive 3+ hours to sellout a mountain top stadium? (probably nothing special) It is in their schools culture to fully support (via attendance) when a rival opponent comes to town.
The point is ADHD fans are NOT fans you'll ever fully attract. Marshall needs to focus its time and resources on rebuilding a good product on the field and building a University culture promoting active students/ alumni/big green organization that works together to raise funds and expand real fan activism/loyalty long term. Not gimmicks that will be stale by the 4th home game.
Rarely does anyone mention those who benefitted from the re-seating plan. Many of us, who have been among the stronger financial supporters and long-time loyal fans, had been shut out of an opportunity to secure the better seats. That decision allowed me the opportunity to relocate into much better seats and as a result, I now have an even stronger bond with the university, and have further increased my giving. And the irony is that my giving is minuscule compared to what most other athletic programs require for seats as good as mine.
Frankly, I never begrudged those who had prime seating during the many years I was an average or below financial supporter. I just assumed the chair back crowd was made up of all the “big hitters”. I have to admit however, I was excited when given the opportunity to relocate and the thought of moving back to the cheaper seats, as we were forced to do with covid last year, is a great incentive to keep writing those checks!
Frankly, I never begrudged those who had prime seating during the many years I was an average or below financial supporter. I just assumed the chair back crowd was made up of all the “big hitters”. I have to admit however, I was excited when given the opportunity to relocate and the thought of moving back to the cheaper seats, as we were forced to do with covid last year, is a great incentive to keep writing those checks!
That's all great... but you are using a lot of buzz words while simultaneously dismissing the idea of "gimmicks". Those larger universities don't need the gimmicks because their fanbase is much larger. The larger the pool of fans you draw from, the more likely you are to have high attendance. And it's different with every university. Some schools have a rich tradition and the games are special. Ours are not. Most of the time our fans sit down, aren't involved in the game, there's one chant, no song, and the whole experience is sort of disjointed.
You are right, the root problem is culture. The problem is when we talk about things that would build that culture the response is: "those are gimmicks" or "that's stupid! if someone won't come to a game because of XYZ, then they aren't a real fan!" or "all we have to do is put a winner on the field! in my day we came for the game not the entertainment!". None of those are solutions to the problem, and none of them will help us actually build a culture that gets people to the games. And the things that would help are typically resisted.
I have a family member who is a minister and lives out of town. He was in for the C-USA championship game last year and remarked "our atmosphere is like a church that's dead. the people keep showing up and going through the motions but its a doomed venture the people just don't know it yet."
We need change.
Calm down gramps, someone must've spiked your dehydrated milk with some caffine.
Learn to read.
My reference of, 'No, I can't change THEIR spending habits, but don't be shocked or mad when MU changes theirs.'
That was in reference to fans and people. I can't change THEIR spending habits (as in not being able to afford a game because they'd rather spend money at the same 5 barely functioning rides at Camden Park for a summer).
I didn't say MU would increase ticket prices, but do something where people willing to spend money, will get priority over those who won't, as in the reseating approach...in order to...get this...ready? Make money.
How much more "tradition" does Marshall need to attract fans on Saturdays? I would argue our "tradition" and history is much more meaningful to the community of Marshall than many big level programs around the country.
Gimmicks (like DJs and closed streets) dont build culture. Culture is built on meaning and purpose. What is the culture you want to have? Dedication. Loyalty. Desire to be a part of something unique and special. Of course.
Does a DJ and street party instill meaning and loyalty to Marshall? Not long term. That's not saying gimmicks dont work for attracting a casual observer. (The drums and flashing light shows in today's modern contemporary churches have sucked the ADHD Christians back in a couple Sundays a month). But building a culture through gimmick strategy wont instill the long term loyalty and giving necessary for what we all want for Marshall.
Ok man, so what’s the answer? What are actual tangible things that can be done to “fix the culture”? Which I agree needs to be fixed.
1) Huff needs to keep doing what he has started out doing. Positively engaging fans, alumni, Htgn community/state. Doc was never/rarely seen involved in the community. Pruett was everywhere. Donnan was even present. Continue to engage with former players and teams. Keep them involved and connected in the program. Huff is right on this.
2)Current Players need to actively participate in the community events and organizations once the season is over.
3) keep improving product on the field
4)better collaboration between alumni and BG organizations when it comes to engaging and growing their members. Look to do more in building relationships and engagement with these members outside the immediate tri state area. (its been inconsistent or non existent at best) There are large pockets of alumni in various cities throughout the S.E. Build from that as a start.
1,3,4 I can agree with. The big green is not well run currently (it seems), obviously good teams help, and alumni involved is good.
I honestly don’t see how players involved in the community after the season, and alumni being involved in the program moves the needle attendance wise. I think they’re good things, just don’t see how they move the needle.
IMO, we have to improve our facilities and game atmosphere if we actually want to fill the stadium. Along those lines earlier you said that we have a rich tradition, I was referring to game day experience. What game day tradition do we have? There’s not one.
Rotate three 2 for 1 deals with Power 5 conference opponents so our non-conference schedule annually includes Power 5 Home, Power 5 Away, Power 5 Away and I-AA Home. That guarantees 6 home games a year and one marquee match up that sells season ticket packages. If you look at Marshall attendance, the years that include a WVU, Purdue or Virginia Tech outdraw the years without a major home game and the attendance boost lasts throughout the home schedule.
Also, the one thing that would change the gameday atmosphere more than anything is doing something about the Marching Thunder. That may be the smallest band in all of D-1. The band director has a good resume from Alabama and Jacksonville State, so it is probably a funding and commitment issue. But, it screams small time and needs to be addressed.
Also, the one thing that would change the gameday atmosphere more than anything is doing something about the Marching Thunder. That may be the smallest band in all of D-1. The band director has a good resume from Alabama and Jacksonville State, so it is probably a funding and commitment issue. But, it screams small time and needs to be addressed.
cincymike - Excellent post! You are absolutely right. I would guess the net effect on cash flow was/is a huge plus. It was always going to be abrasive to the old chair back folks, but the new occupants can’t be faulted for ponying up. Good to get the viewpoint that you brought to the thread…..
Remember we are building a culture. An reason and purpose to be loyal to a program.
Personal story:
Following Stan Parrish starting here at Marshall, various members of Marshalls football team were introduced into the a "Big Brothers" program within the Huntington Community. Various kids I knew at my school developed life long friendships and connections to these players and loyalty to Marshall that still exist 35+ years later. Having made a few connections myself through such actions at that time made me more interested in wanting to follow the program (that had been shitty for 20 years) and wanting to attend games at a young age even though my parents generally had no interest.
I also remember seeing Greg White as a college player come to my elementary school gym performing a shoot around and ball tricks. Talked about being a good student and working hard. I never wanted to miss a Herd game at the field house.
If players being involved more in community events, charities, and events wasn't valuable, why would the NFL be wasting its time doing that very thing in their cities? Giving back is key to building a lifelong committed fanbase.
The same for alumni. The more alumni that become personally engaged and financially committed... provide a bigger return on $$ donation potential, necessary to pay for the gimmicks you want to experience. How can anyone doubt greater involvement with Alumni wouldn't result in better attendance and involvement at sporting events??
Marshall went from a half empty, shitty Fairfield stadium to virtually selling it out weekly by 1) Improving the product on the field 2)Team members and coaches becoming an active, involved part of the Htgn community consistently.
IMO "Traditions" happen on their own organically. They are not contrived by Athletic Dept sitting around a conference room table contemplating ticket sales. Can gimmicks be introduced to game day activities to engage those attending and create some buzz? Absolutely. "Traditions" are built out of loyalty and commitment to a purpose. Not a Tshirt give away during the 3 qtr.
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You make a valid point, but in defining the problem, (lack of culture + not a large enough following to expect near/sellouts) you don’t offer concrete steps to take to solve the problem! Therein lies the conundrum wrapped around the buffalo horns that is Marshall football.
OK man. I've given my suggestions with added context. So whats YOUR answer? What tangible, fix the culture items do you have to offer.
Like I said I agree many of your things are important, and you are right that for the most part tradition comes about organically. I would argue you have to have people in seats in order to build that tradition, and throughout much of sports history "gimmicks" became tradition.
1. Stadium improvements- Concourse, it has to be bigger. This needs to be job one facility wise. I arrived to the game late on Saturday, decided to get my drink before I went to my seat. From the concourse I was convinced we'd have close to 30,000 people in the stadium. It feels full at 24,000. People are not going to keep coming back to fight that type of crowd. Also, bathrooms need to be bettered and modernized a little bit. The field honestly needs a fresh coat of paint, I'm hoping we are just due for new turf in a year or so cause it doesn't look great. Overall maintenance in the Joan could be better, which means more people are at games.
2. In game atmosphere - I understand that advertising is good money. But we've overdone it. I don't need to hear about Dutch Miller or One of the hospitals, or my favorite a commercial for Marshall.... during the game 15 times. At times we play those ads at the biggest moments, killed any buzz we had. People hate commercials, now we are paying money to have them played at every moment. Saturday almost 15 minutes of the 20 minute halftime was taken up by commercials. The other 5 minutes was the band.
3. That leads me to the next improvement, its time for the band to get better or dissolve. I understand there are limitations because of Covid but it seems extremely small. We should invest more resources or whatever we can to have a bigger band, thats a great way to create atmosphere, if done right.
4. Coordination of band/music. This has been an issue for years. We start playing music over the speaks and the band starts to play. It makes for an uncomfortable listen. Now you throw in the DJ. There's no sense of "hey this is a big moment, we don't need to play an ad or music here. Let's let the crowd's 'We are Marshall' chant grow or lets play a song that will get them to sing/chant (zombie nation, seven nation army, sweet caroline, etc.) Instead, we get an advertisement... followed by the intro of a song and then the game is back. Again, it's just disjointed.
5. I love that in the 4th quarter the band was playing (forgive me if i'm wrong) Mountain Music - by Alabama. The problem is there were ads/music playing over them and you couldn't really hear them that well, and I was sitting near them. That song would be awesome if it played at the beginning of every 4th quarter, and fans sang along either the band or preferably the speakers. With a few words changed to fit Marshall.
6. Lights, I think over time we will get these. But the stadium lights that are a little brighter than ours and also allow you do turn sections off and on and create a "light" show are really cool and add a great touch to the game.
7. Not every chant has to be We Are Marshall, but when we do We are Marshall the PA doesn't need to chime in. Also, with that being said I would love for the Thunder Clap to come back. The problem all those years with it, was the band drumline would play a rhythm behind it, and it was hard unless you were right in front of the cheerleaders or Marco to keep rhythm. There are ways to fix that and also have a count of what number you are on on the scoreboard so that you don't have the inevitable claps where half the stadium stopped and the other half lost count and kept going. If you've seen the Vikings "skol" clap its pretty cool. That's essentially the Thunder Clap.
8. No re-entry.
I realize that these are all "small" things and I also realize that not all of these can or will be done. There are going to be ads at games, and special presentations. But, we could do a lot better in our game presentation and the overall atmosphere. Like you have said it will take time to develop culture. But we have to have people in the seats to do that, and people aren't going to come to the game without some of these "gimmicks" (which I actually think there's a lot more "gimmicks" we can do I just didn't feel like writing all of them down).
1. Stadium improvements- Concourse, it has to be bigger. This needs to be job one facility wise. I arrived to the game late on Saturday, decided to get my drink before I went to my seat. From the concourse I was convinced we'd have close to 30,000 people in the stadium. It feels full at 24,000. People are not going to keep coming back to fight that type of crowd. Also, bathrooms need to be bettered and modernized a little bit. The field honestly needs a fresh coat of paint, I'm hoping we are just due for new turf in a year or so cause it doesn't look great. Overall maintenance in the Joan could be better, which means more people are at games.
2. In game atmosphere - I understand that advertising is good money. But we've overdone it. I don't need to hear about Dutch Miller or One of the hospitals, or my favorite a commercial for Marshall.... during the game 15 times. At times we play those ads at the biggest moments, killed any buzz we had. People hate commercials, now we are paying money to have them played at every moment. Saturday almost 15 minutes of the 20 minute halftime was taken up by commercials. The other 5 minutes was the band.
3. That leads me to the next improvement, its time for the band to get better or dissolve. I understand there are limitations because of Covid but it seems extremely small. We should invest more resources or whatever we can to have a bigger band, thats a great way to create atmosphere, if done right.
4. Coordination of band/music. This has been an issue for years. We start playing music over the speaks and the band starts to play. It makes for an uncomfortable listen. Now you throw in the DJ. There's no sense of "hey this is a big moment, we don't need to play an ad or music here. Let's let the crowd's 'We are Marshall' chant grow or lets play a song that will get them to sing/chant (zombie nation, seven nation army, sweet caroline, etc.) Instead, we get an advertisement... followed by the intro of a song and then the game is back. Again, it's just disjointed.
5. I love that in the 4th quarter the band was playing (forgive me if i'm wrong) Mountain Music - by Alabama. The problem is there were ads/music playing over them and you couldn't really hear them that well, and I was sitting near them. That song would be awesome if it played at the beginning of every 4th quarter, and fans sang along either the band or preferably the speakers. With a few words changed to fit Marshall.
6. Lights, I think over time we will get these. But the stadium lights that are a little brighter than ours and also allow you do turn sections off and on and create a "light" show are really cool and add a great touch to the game.
7. Not every chant has to be We Are Marshall, but when we do We are Marshall the PA doesn't need to chime in. Also, with that being said I would love for the Thunder Clap to come back. The problem all those years with it, was the band drumline would play a rhythm behind it, and it was hard unless you were right in front of the cheerleaders or Marco to keep rhythm. There are ways to fix that and also have a count of what number you are on on the scoreboard so that you don't have the inevitable claps where half the stadium stopped and the other half lost count and kept going. If you've seen the Vikings "skol" clap its pretty cool. That's essentially the Thunder Clap.
8. No re-entry.
I realize that these are all "small" things and I also realize that not all of these can or will be done. There are going to be ads at games, and special presentations. But, we could do a lot better in our game presentation and the overall atmosphere. Like you have said it will take time to develop culture. But we have to have people in the seats to do that, and people aren't going to come to the game without some of these "gimmicks" (which I actually think there's a lot more "gimmicks" we can do I just didn't feel like writing all of them down).
Well, according to your previous posts, a simple paint coating on the goal posts, a forensic cleansing of drops of "red spots" on the bleachers, and making the bathrooms cleaner.
I agree with many of your suggestions. The easiest fix would be someone at MU assigned to better coordinate your #2,4,5 suggestions. The rhythm and flow of in game activities has been disjointed for years. I understand your point about ads too, but understand those businesses/sponsors are actually paying for them to be shown. But your point is well taken. They need to broadcast at other, more coordinated, designated times that dont distract. Frankly do we really need to see the same commercial about EMTs saving OD patients 5 times a game? (Hell no)
Paint the field? No. Its turf and unless its Boise, it doesn't need painted. It's good for 10 years I'd say its about $5.00 per square foot to replace.
It's not cheap for MU and doesn't need to be done until it needs to be done.
Dutch Miller may be annoying, but he and several others, are the reason tickets are even close to affordable for MU.
Suck it up, because unless you want to pay much more, or don't want your precious bathrooms ever upgraded, you're gonna have to face that makeup-less clown every Saturday for a bit.
The problem with the We Are Marshall chant is nobody leads it. The PA leading it is actually a good thing because the cheerleaders trying to get the chant up tends to fail.
No to the Thunderclap. It's stupid and with nobody on camera, and not Marco, it will always fail. This is why Iceland can do it and the Vikings can too, because they have someone that everyone's looking at, leading them.
There needs to be an established agreement with the band, PA, DJ, etc...that at a designated time in the game (hell, maybe in the 75th minute) the chant comes up...and nothing can be played.
Or do what they used to do and chant at a specific time, each time during the game.
The tradition being at some point in the game, nonmatter what, everyone unites and chants MU's chant.
Ok, so you are making fun of the fact that I happened to notice that we bought yellow goal posts then slowly let them fade? Finally they look white which is ok I guess, certainly looks better then it did a few years ago. But yes... i'm the moron for expecting our facilities to look nice. As for the "red spots" yeah, crazy me for not wanting to go to a basketball game and see drops of dried blood all over the bleachers where I am sitting. I am the worst.
I agree, we don't need those commercials that many times. I understand that ads are necessary, I agree if it was at a designated time that didn't distract it would be good. And yes, I think if we had someone assigned as the coordinator of all things game management it would run better.
As for the field paint... I mean it looks ok I guess if you're into that weathered vintage look. It's fine. Just doesn't catch the eye in a positive way. It's not big deal. And yeah... no one outside of Boise paints the logos/line on their turf field. Not one. Good point.
I'm glad you think the thunderclap is stupid. Your reason that "no one can lead it" leaves me kind of confused though. Is there a reason no one is allowed to lead it? Seems like it could be lead and would be great, if done the right way.
As for advertising... less can be more. filling up every spare second actually worsens the experience, in the long run choking future earnings. Not that we shouldn't have any advertising at all, but as was previously stated it needs to be designed with the purpose of NOT interrupting the game.
The chant idea sounds good.
A little organization and communication between all parties would make a huge difference. Because right now it’s an annoying clusterbomb
PA guy used to start the thunder clap after every td, and it would be counted on the scoreboard. Then they decided to sell more ads which led to no time available for the scoreboard count.
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