Texas Church Shooting

[caliherd]

It was illegal for him to have a gun. What else do you want?

He wants guns banned. That is the end game. It was already against the law for this guy to have guns. So how could having tougher gun control laws prevented him from obtaining a gun illegally?

I would have more respect for the anti gun groups if they would just admit that they want guns confiscated and banned.

To answer my own question is the reason the anti gun groups do not call for a confiscation and outright ban of guns is the fact there are a lot of Democrats who own guns and would not take kindly to it and in only the leftist of the left areas would they ever win an election.

 

[GreenDuke]

He wants guns banned. That is the end game. It was already against the law for this guy to have guns. So how could having tougher gun control laws prevented him from obtaining a gun illegally?

I would have more respect for the anti gun groups if they would just admit that they want guns confiscated and banned.

To answer my own question is the reason the anti gun groups do not call for a confiscation and outright ban of guns is the fact there are a lot of Democrats who own guns and would not take kindly to it and in only the leftist of the left areas would they ever win an election.

I bet if you step foot on his property Out Echo he would open fire immediately.

 

[WV-FAN]

that's eye opening.

 

[herdfan429]

Suspect bought the gun from academy sports even though he was banned from owning them since he was a convicted spousal abuser. Instead of pushing more background checks how about we fix the ones already in place. Instead of pushing more gun laws let's enforce the ones already on books and strengthen/enforce penalties of said laws.

 

[extragreen]

It was illegal for him to have a gun. What else do you want?

National permit to purchase. Heavy penalties for illegally selling a gun.

 

[extragreen]

He wants guns banned.

wrong

You gotta admit prayers and positive thoughts ain't working.

 

[herdfan429]

National permit to purchase. Heavy penalties for illegally selling a gun.

And which one of those will prevent him from getting a gun

 

[extragreen]

And which one of those will prevent him from getting a gun

Are you insinuating that the only solutions we should try have to prevent all gun deaths. Really?

 

[herdfan429]

Are you insinuating that the only solutions we should try have to prevent all gun deaths. Really?

Not at all I want to prevent these types of mass murders so propose something that in your mind will prevent them and explain how it will do so

 

[extragreen]

Not at all I want to prevent these types of mass murders so propose something that in your mind will prevent them and explain how it will do so

National permit to purchase. Heavy penalties for illegally selling a gun.

 

[ThunderCat98]

National permit to purchase. Heavy penalties for illegally selling a gun.

You didn't address the second part of his question. I'd like to know the answer to this as well.

 

[i am herdman]

Pitiful, just pitiful. I'll use the same "logic".

The 2 world wars and our civil war had nothing to do with muslims. No need to worry about muslims.

Ok, you are running around in circles saying nothing. You deal with the issue at hand.

 

[i am herdman]

Not sure you want to go there. I mean it might be an uncomfortable topic. See Chicago for the reason why.

 

[i am herdman]

It was illegal for him to have a gun. What else do you want?

He would like to see all the guns gone. He just won't say it.

 

[extragreen]

You didn't address the second part of his question. I'd like to know the answer to this as well.

"Two recent studies provide evidence that background checks can significantly curb gun violence. In one, researchers found that a 1995 Connecticut law requiring gun buyers to get permits (which themselves required background checks) was associated with a 40 percent decline in gun homicides and a 15 percent drop in suicides. Similarly, when researchers studied Missouri's 2007 repeal of its permit-to-purchase law, they found an associated increase in gun homicides by 23 percent, as well as a 16-percent increase in suicides."
http://www.npr.org/2016/01/09/46225...kground-checks-work-but-theyre-not-everything

 

[extragreen]

Ok, you are running around in circles saying nothing. You deal with the issue at hand.

No, you're running around in circles.

 

[herdfan429]

"Two recent studies provide evidence that background checks can significantly curb gun violence. In one, researchers found that a 1995 Connecticut law requiring gun buyers to get permits (which themselves required background checks) was associated with a 40 percent decline in gun homicides and a 15 percent drop in suicides. Similarly, when researchers studied Missouri's 2007 repeal of its permit-to-purchase law, they found an associated increase in gun homicides by 23 percent, as well as a 16-percent increase in suicides."
http://www.npr.org/2016/01/09/46225...kground-checks-work-but-theyre-not-everything

Background checks. I said we should address the issue with the background check system so central this guy obviously passed one when he shouldnt have.

 

[NutcaseConservative]

Not sure you want to go there. I mean it might be an uncomfortable topic. See Chicago for the reason why.

And Chicago is part of the US, this encompasses the Whole US. But it's convenient for you to blame Chicago. Let me ask you.. What's the difference between us and those countries? Why is our murder rate 5 times higher ?

 

[Raoul Duke MU]

And Chicago is part of the US, this encompasses the Whole US. But it's convenient for you to blame Chicago. Let me ask you.. What's the difference between us and those countries? Why is our murder rate 5 times higher ?

Your chart seems to say black people.

 

[i am herdman]

No, you're running around in circles.

I am not. Before guns man killed man. And, you could get rid of all them and there would be killers and dictators and evil persons.

We have a 2nd Amendment. Until that is gone, there will be guns in this country.

 

[NutcaseConservative]

Your chart seems to say black people.

It's not just blacks.

 

[i am herdman]

And Chicago is part of the US, this encompasses the Whole US. But it's convenient for you to blame Chicago. Let me ask you.. What's the difference between us and those countries? Why is our murder rate 5 times higher ?

We all know the answer. Sweeden is not like Chicago. Your chart points it out.

Racists chart?

 

[extragreen]

Background checks. I said we should address the issue with the background check system so central this guy obviously passed one when he shouldnt have.

Perhaps the permit to purchase would have caught it.

 

[extragreen]

I am not. Before guns man killed man. And, you could get rid of all them and there would be killers and dictators and evil persons.

We have a 2nd Amendment. Until that is gone, there will be guns in this country.

National permit to purchase does not eliminate guns. Neither does closing the gun show loophole. Nor making it difficult to obtain bump stocks, etc.

 

[NutcaseConservative]

We all know the answer. Sweeden is not like Chicago. Your chart points it out.

Racists chart?

France has a black population that in % numbers is closet to the US. Blacks account for %14 in the US and 8% in France. Yet they have a murder rate that pales in comparison. Your race card fails there.

 

[herdfan429]

France has a black population that in % numbers is closet to the US. Blacks account for %14 in the US and 8% in France. Yet they have a murder rate that pales in comparison. Your race card fails there.

What's the percentage of two parent households among blacks in France vs US

 

[ThunderCat98]

"Two recent studies provide evidence that background checks can significantly curb gun violence. In one, researchers found that a 1995 Connecticut law requiring gun buyers to get permits (which themselves required background checks) was associated with a 40 percent decline in gun homicides and a 15 percent drop in suicides. Similarly, when researchers studied Missouri's 2007 repeal of its permit-to-purchase law, they found an associated increase in gun homicides by 23 percent, as well as a 16-percent increase in suicides."
http://www.npr.org/2016/01/09/46225...kground-checks-work-but-theyre-not-everything

The same article also states:

"There's no perfect consensus on how well background-check laws work. A 2000 study found that the 1994 Brady Act — which instituted not only background checks but waiting periods at first — did not reduce either homicide or suicide rates.

A CDC task force also found in a 2003 review "inconsistent findings" as to whether restricting gun access through background checks works and insufficient evidence as to whether an array of other gun laws are effective. However, the CDC also said that its findings didn't mean that gun laws don't work; rather, it said it needed to study the topic more."

Based on this, I'm not sure the studies you cited are conclusive. I agree that something needs to be done, I'm just not sure what additional measures can be taken that would have an actual, practical, positive impact on the situation.

 

[HerdBuckeye]

Oh goodness I’m so glad no one jumped to conclusions and said this was terrorism in 5 minutes. Clearly this guy was wacky.

 

[Raoul Duke MU]

It's not just blacks.

Blacks, Mexicans, assorted dark people, whatever.

 

[extragreen]

The same article also states:

"There's no perfect consensus on how well background-check laws work. A 2000 study found that the 1994 Brady Act — which instituted not only background checks but waiting periods at first — did not reduce either homicide or suicide rates.

A CDC task force also found in a 2003 review "inconsistent findings" as to whether restricting gun access through background checks works and insufficient evidence as to whether an array of other gun laws are effective. However, the CDC also said that its findings didn't mean that gun laws don't work; rather, it said it needed to study the topic more."

Based on this, I'm not sure the studies you cited are conclusive. I agree that something needs to be done, I'm just not sure what additional measures can be taken that would have an actual, practical, positive impact on the situation.

Let's pass some laws that show promise, whether conclusive or not, and see what they do or do not accomplish.

 

[herdfan429]

Let's pass some laws that show promise, whether conclusive or not, and see what they do or do not accomplish.

How about we enforce laws already on books instead of just lassi g laws to pass laws

 

[caliherd]

So you feel that if an individual commits mass murder a gun law on the books will cause that person not to get a gun and not kill 27 people. Sounds legit!

 

[ARandomHerdFan]

Blacks, Mexicans, assorted dark people, whatever.

 

[herdfan429]

So you feel that if an individual commits mass murder a gun law on the books will cause that person not to get a gun and not kill 27 people. Sounds legit!

If current law was enforced in this case he would not have been able to buy a gun

 

[caliherd]

I’ll go a step further though. One if my biggest issues with gun control advocates is they try to make a logical response to an illogical action. This guy decided to kill a whole bunch of people including kids.

That is a completely illogical thought. To think that if we had some specific law on the books that if it was followed would suddenly make him not want to kill all of those people is just crazy.

The only gun control that could maybe cut down gun violence is confiscation of current guns and making it illegal to privately own a gun. That is NEVER going to happen and even if it did I don’t think it would have stopped this psycho. He would have found other ways. Someone who wants to kill massive amounts of people would not let a background check of any kind prevent him to taking out the people he wants to take out.

 

[i am herdman]

National permit to purchase does not eliminate guns. Neither does closing the gun show loophole. Nor making it difficult to obtain bump stocks, etc.

Then, what are you going to say when some nut goes in with a Remington 870 12 gauge and mows down people? Show some balls and say what you mean which is you don't like guns .

 

[extragreen]

How about we enforce laws already on books instead of just lassi g laws to pass laws

Which ones are no being enforced?

 

[i am herdman]

The previous deadliest mass shooting in Texas had been a 1991 attack in Killeen, when a mentally disturbed man crashed his pickup truck through a restaurant window at lunchtime and started shooting people, killing 23 and injuring more than 20 others.

 

[extragreen]

The previous deadliest mass shooting in Texas had been a 1991 attack in Killeen, when a mentally disturbed man crashed his pickup truck through a restaurant window at lunchtime and started shooting people, killing 23 and injuring more than 20 others.

ALL 23 OF THOSE KILLED WERE BY THE GUN. NONE BY THE TRUCK.

 

[i am herdman]

ALL 23 OF THOSE KILLED WERE BY THE GUN. NONE BY THE TRUCK.

Ok. exactly. In 1991. Lee Harvey Oswald Killed the POTUS in 1963. Abe Lincoln killed in the 1860's.

So, what is your solution?